Let The Games Begin!

[MetalMover]

What is really ironic Bob, is that if it wasn't for the actions of the TWU/AA, the McCaskill-Bond Amendment would never had been passed! And you all, (TWU) might have tried do to US, what the TWU did to TWA!---- Sad, but true!

You seem to leave out the fact that Kasher DECIDED WHAT WAS FAIR AND EQUITABLE!  NOT THE TWU!!!!!!!!!
Had AA not bought TWA's sorry ASSets!, the whole lot of you would have been on the street.
GET OVER IT! 

 

[Bob Owens]

Kev doesn't speak for 80,000 DL employees nor is there any basis to believe that what he says is representative at all and actually quite a few reasons to believe it is not. He is free to have his opinions and he might actually be knowledgeable of the opinions of his peers in his immediate city and friends elsewhere but he is nowhere close to being a spokesman for his work group or DL employees as a whole. And he has never claimed he was.DL employees speak with mgmt. directly and they haven't engaged any intermediary source, including and perhaps esp. Kev.IF DL employees don't believe DL's direct employee-mgmt. process works, they have had more than enough to ask for labor representation but they have not done so.Labor strife and lack of any real benefit from unions is precisely why B6 and DL people EN MASSE have consistently hung out the "not buying" sign.You and others, including Kev, can't get on here and tell us all of the faults of the labor movement and then be the least bit surprised that the movement is shrinking. The DL-NW merger eliminated 30,000 union members and those positions are no closer to being replaced that the day the final legal challenge was settled.This site is the best antidote against further unionization in the airline industry.

I would think that to most logical people the opinions and views of an employee would be more accepted than the views of non-employees as far as what its like to work for Delta. The fact is we do not see many Delta employees posting here, good reason for that is Delta has a history of terminating employees who put things on the Internet. We don't see many Delta employees saying how they love it at Delta either and I know other people from Delta who do not post here, and what they say is a lot closer to what Kev says than what you claim. What are your claims based on? Delta spends millions of dollars every time the employees there do start union drives and they utilize the same tactics employed in dictatorships to keep unions out. They lie and threaten their employees to keep them from joining a Union, they campaigned heavily against changing the rules for elections, more so than any other airline, IIRC they were the only airline to show up at the hearings held by the NMB. If Delta was so sure their employees didn't want Unions then why do they spend millions every time employees there start a union drive? I've also talked to a few people who chose to resign from Delta because they were pressured into signing for work that Delta would have students from a Local A&P school accomplish. They felt they would be better off even at AA than to stay at Delta and put their license at risk. With no union, no ASAP program they had nowhere to turn, so they quit.

 

[737823]

Yet Bob you always say that your DL counterparts working side by side hundreds of yards away are paid more, have more vacation, more paid holidays, etc. same goes for jetblue. Again you have said before joining the TWU and paying $600/yr for what you consider the worst contact in the industry is bad, but now you say DL is worse? I understand your point on the "protection" a CBA offers but your line mechanic counterparts at DL and B6 make more than AA TWU line.

Josh

 

[700UW]

Delta outsources ALL their heavy checks and have contractors working at the ATL Tech Center, they arent hiring their  own mechanics anymore.
 
Ask the DL mechanics who use to work at the DFW Hangar and TPA Hangar how things are, oh wait you cant cause DL shut them down.
 
They fly planes empty half way around the world to get their interiors redone.
 
At least at US all the widebody work and 757 work is being brought back in-house and being done in CLT now.

 

[Kev3188]

Lets see Kev actually works at DL, do you? If not then how can you claim to know whats going on at the floor level?

Right?

Truth is, he can't.
 
 

Kev doesn't speak for 80,000 DL employees

Who said I did?

Remind us; as someone who walked away from the carrier years ago, how are you in any position to judge what happens on the "inside?"

 

I would think that to most logical people the opinions and views of an employee would be more accepted than the views of non-employees as far as what its like to work for Delta.

Thanks, Bob.

As much as WT and the rest of the anti-worker crowd would like to paint pro labor people as a radical fringe, the truth is that we're not.

 

The fact is we do not see many Delta employees posting here, good reason for that is Delta has a history of terminating employees who put things on the Internet. We don't see many Delta employees saying how they love it at Delta either and I know other people from Delta who do not post here, and what they say is a lot closer to what Kev says than what you claim. What are your claims based on? Delta spends millions of dollars every time the employees there do start union drives and they utilize the same tactics employed in dictatorships to keep unions out. They lie and threaten their employees to keep them from joining a Union, they campaigned heavily against changing the rules for elections, more so than any other airline, IIRC they were the only airline to show up at the hearings held by the NMB. If Delta was so sure their employees didn't want Unions then why do they spend millions every time employees there start a union drive? I've also talked to a few people who chose to resign from Delta because they were pressured into signing for work that Delta would have students from a Local A&P school accomplish. They felt they would be better off even at AA than to stay at Delta and put their license at risk. With no union, no ASAP program they had nowhere to turn, so they quit.

I wish I could disagree with a single word in there, but I can't. Everything you've noted has either occurred, or is still occurring...

 

[WorldTraveler]

The only part that Bob got right is that DL has a social media policy that prohibits DL employees from posting anti-company messages on social media sites. Using a pseudonym doesn't make it any more acceptable.

If Kev is so convinced that he speaks for his coworkers then he should use his real name and disclose his real location.

DL employees in the largest workgroups including airport operations, res, maintenance and in-flight service DO NOT have any labor representation or a labor spokesman.

NO ONE speaks for DL employees other than the votes that have repeatedly and clearly shown that DL employees in those workgroups do not want labor representation

The fact that they have failed to elect labor representation makes Kev's comments nothing more than those of a disgruntled employee whose views can't be validated as being any more representative than anyone else's.

As much as 700 and Bob want to try to come up with a list of facts to try and paint the picture otherwise, DL employees esp. in maintenance do not find their situation bad enough that they want a union or believe that a union can do anything for them.

The fact that US outsources a far higher percentage of maintenance and that AA is in the process o shutting the 2nd major maintenance facility in a decade and that DL mechanics do make more than many of their unionized peers is precisely why DL employees want nothing to do with unions and why labor representation in the US is at all time lows and continues to shrink.

 

[Kev3188]

The only part that Bob got right is that DL has a social media policy that prohibits DL employees from posting anti-company messages on social media sites. Using a pseudonym doesn't make it any more acceptable.

I didn't see where Bob wrote that. Can you show us?

Discussing working conditions is protected under federal law.

This isn't another veiled threat from you is it?

If Kev is so convinced that he speaks for his coworkers then he should use his real name and disclose his real location.

You first.

BTW, I tried. "Kevin" is already taken as a board name...

 

DL employees in the largest workgroups including airport operations, res, maintenance and in-flight service DO NOT have any labor representation...

Yet...

 

[700UW]

Once again, let me explain this S L O W L Y to you.
 
The percentage is high because US outsources component overhaul.
 
more than 50% of all HMVs are done in-house.
 
Those are facts, can you say the same about DL?
 
Also US doesnt allow line checks to be outsourced, only if a plane breaks at a non-mtc station can someone look at a US plane and if parts are sent to fix the plane US' mechanics are sent to do the work.

 

[737823]

There you go as a typical BUSINESS UNIONIST covering up weak CBAs saying they protect jobs by keeping OH in house. See all you care about is dues for the IAMAW, yep that's right. It's about quality not quantity, better to have more high paying line maintenance jobs and outsource OH than have many low paying jobs like the IAM at USAIR.

Josh

 

[700UW]

Hey how ignorant are you?
 
The base wages for line and overhaul mechanics in the airline industry pay the same wage.
 
Once again you have no clue of what you talk about.
 
In an airline that does heavy maintenance there are more mechanics in base maintenance than on the line.
 
Go back to stealing old ladies houses, its quite apparent you have NO clue on how an airline and its maintenance works.

 

[737823]

Ok stock clerk maybe you can work in retail today.

Josh

 

[700UW]

Typical
 
You cant debate with facts so you try and use personal attacks.
 
Maybe you can graduate to Ponzi schemes since your employer was found guilty in fraud and had to pay $13 billion in fines.
 
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/11/20/us-jpmorgan-settlement-idUSBRE9AI0OA20131120
 
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-11-26/jpmorgan-pressured-to-disclose-13b-accord-complaint.html
 
Yep a real ethical company, no wonder why you fit right in.
 
Now maybe you can actually educate yourself on how things really work in the airline industry instead of making yourself looks foolish by posting lies and misinformation.

 

[WorldTraveler]

well we lit this thread up real fast. yee haw.

Kev,
I'm not threatening anyone. Bob said DL terminates people who post on internet forums. They did it because it is contrary to their policies. But they also usually have no difficulty finding plenty of other reasons to terminate an employee.

You are free to speak about YOUR perception of DL but you are not free to act as a spokesman for anyone or attempt to argue that your perception is that of anyone else. THAT is not protected. Anywhere.

When labor unions succeed at even getting an election scheduled, let us know.

700,
you can try to spin it as much as you want but there is no denying that US contracts out a higher percentage of its maintenance based on dollars spent than any other legacy airline - and on par with WN.
You can slice and manipulate the numbers to try and protect how poor of a job unions have done at US, but the employees that you most need to convince - DL and B6 aren't biting for good reason. They aren't about to pay to receive something that is decidedly inferior to what they have.

The fact that anyone with two eyes and even one working lobe for a brain can see thru what you write shows why labor is in such a pathetic state in the US.

The fact that Parker has been as successful at decimating labor at US bodes very poorly for AA workers.

Josh isn't here to defend his company. You are defending the labor movement. Please remain on task.

 

[700UW]

You are free to speak about YOUR perception of DL but you are not free to act as a spokesman for anyone or attempt to argue that your perception is that of anyone else. THAT is not protected. Anywhere.

 

Yet you claim to speak for Delta Employees and your not one.
 
Simply amazing.

 

[737823]

Cost of doing business. Not a big deal, many remarked we came out relatively unscathed, don't blame Wall St blame the idiot politicians in DC.

Josh