AA to pay $14 million in first quarter AIP bonuses

[Hopeful]

If you think not locking in the two year deal was bad, hop over to the WN forum. Their pilots just turned down a TA which gave them fairly decent raises....

There's a lot more to that "deal" than meets the eye. It was another concessionary deal sweetened with a 5% lump sump and a 3% lump sum. There were items in there that the company has wanted very badly. And when they want something that bad, it usually means someone is getting screwed.

 

[frontline]

If you think not locking in the two year deal was bad, hop over to the WN forum. Their pilots just turned down a TA which gave them fairly decent raises....

I've been following that! Not to get too OT, but I'm pretty stunned they walked away from raises like that. Now of all times to do that...

 

[Hackman]

I've been following that! Not to get too OT, but I'm pretty stunned they walked away from raises like that. Now of all times to do that...

There must have been some concessions they didn't like. Paying a few dollars up front by the company to get a "yes" vote is why some are fooled into voting in major concessions like the twu's 1995 6 year contract. Some will vote "yes" for a BBQ sandwich and a dose of "working together" company lies.

Regardless of any contract language, the company has a definate "yes" vote from you as long as you get a small pittance up front?

Simply amazing......

 

[frontline]

I see Hackjob is at it again... :huh:

The concessions they didn't like had to do with codesharing, and they had the same idiotic arguments against it that our pilots do. Although it's even easier in Southwest's case, since the company was wanting to codeshare on routes they specifically do not fly (international).

Bottom line is they turned down a raise during a very deep recession when jobs are being lost every day.

I will not vote "yes" for a BBQ sandwich but I also will not vote my employer into bankruptcy when my prospects for find a new job (that pays the same or better) are slim to none.

 

[WeAAsles]

There must have been some concessions they didn't like. Paying a few dollars up front by the company to get a "yes" vote is why some are fooled into voting in major concessions like the twu's 1995 6 year contract. Some will vote "yes" for a BBQ sandwich and a dose of "working together" company lies.

Regardless of any contract language, the company has a definate "yes" vote from you as long as you get a small pittance up front?

Simply amazing......

The problem is either the members don't read the whole contract or they don't know how to read? It's amazing how many guys didn't realize the taxes that would come out of that 5% pittance that the company offered us last May. Credit Card companies love that we dumbasses don't read the fine print also.

 

[The Goose]

I see Hackjob is at it again... :huh:

The concessions they didn't like had to do with codesharing, and they had the same idiotic arguments against it that our pilots do. Although it's even easier in Southwest's case, since the company was wanting to codeshare on routes they specifically do not fly (international).

Bottom line is they turned down a raise during a very deep recession when jobs are being lost every day.

I will not vote "yes" for a BBQ sandwich but I also will not vote my employer into bankruptcy when my prospects for find a new job (that pays the same or better) are slim to none.

As with many other employees of American, you seem to have spent your time spending ther money you made rather quickly when times were good rather than preparing yourself for days like this.

There's plenty to do out there that will make a person a reasonable living, but one must have taken the time acquiring the skills to do so.

American's mismanagement is so certain they've stocked the employee ranks rather well with individuals such as yourself they're blowing off every attempt of ours to secure a reasonable contract - even the last POS which was "presented" to the company earlier this week is, in effect, another prelude to additional concessions which we could easily get without the TWU's so-called "bargaining assistance".

Anothing placed before me for a vote had better be an improvement over the pre-concession contract or my vote will be NO.

You might speak with your doctor about helping you grow a set of balls.

 

[WeAAsles]

Anything placed before me for a vote had better be an improvement over the pre-concession contract or my vote will be NO.

If we could get everyone to think this way then we would at least get improvements. And no one wants to vote AA into bankruptcy Frontline. We just want a fair shake when they do have good times, not be stabbed in the back or take more steps backward? Don't you think we've done enough of that already?

 

[FrequentFlierCA]

I don't see anyone trying to deny the employees a "fair shake" when times are good. The point is that right now - as you negotiate - times are absolute crap and the company is losing money. In the same breath you say you don't want to vote AMR into bankruptcy but also want "restore and more".

In this moment in time those are mutually exclusive objectives. I wish you luck getting what you deserve when the red ink turns to black in the future.

 

[WeAAsles]

I'm not hearing the spouting of restore and more there FF and I certainly didn't say that. AA actually has been having the nerve to ask for more concessions in there bargaining though. Now thats just one huge joke thats just NOT going to happen period. And it's incredibly insulting considering what we gave up. The current climate definitely doesn't warrant a large increase in there labor costs right now. What I'm looking for is a fair performance based plan and profit sharing when the times do get better. AIP just doesn't cut it. Before the 95 contract we had something called LEAP checks. Now those could be fairly good checks based on performance. A modest pay increase and PUP pay for employees just could get a contract passed? But so far this company acts like the whole process is just one big joke. Alot of posters on here hate the TWU but at least they've been trying to work with AA and have been very reasonable in negotiations. I think AA wanting to close 21 TWU staffed stations shows where they stand? :down:

 

[frontline]

WeAAsles it sounds like you are someone who is able to see reason and put the dogma aside in favor of practicality. I respect that. Comments by guys like The Goose who demand an improvement over pre-2003 contract... that is just not even in the ball park. It's that kind of mentality that will force us to a stalemate and sink our employer.

Goose I have both balls and brains (you appear to be missing one of these) and know when to use each. Right now it is time for the thinking cap, and making sure AA stays competitive and in business means making sure I can continue to feed, clothe and educate my family.

If you think you're so goddamned smart put your name on a ballot.

 

[Hackman]

WeAAsles it sounds like you are someone who is able to see reason and put the dogma aside in favor of practicality. I respect that. Comments by guys like The Goose who demand an improvement over pre-2003 contract... that is just not even in the ball park. It's that kind of mentality that will force us to a stalemate and sink our employer.

Goose I have both balls and brains (you appear to be missing one of these) and know when to use each. Right now it is time for the thinking cap, and making sure AA stays competitive and in business means making sure I can continue to feed, clothe and educate my family.

If you think you're so goddamned smart put your name on a ballot.

In favor of practicality flatline? You meant to say cowardice did you not? Yours is duly noted here. Your so frightened for yourself and your "job" you would sell yourself and your coworkers out to the lowest bidder, I.E. the current twu sellout offer. You can't wait to vote yes on something, no matter how concessionary it is. I will wager you have less than 10 years seniority, and if there is a severe cut-back, your headed out the door with your tale tucked. Now, I could be wrong on that, however your continuous and desperate "save me" company boy posts are a good indication. I also don't think you were here in 1995 when nearly the same now thing was happening then. Namely, the company/twu scare tactics on in full force during a poor ecomomy and dimwits that "wanna believe" voted for a 6 year twu sellout.

Let's do put on our thinking cap son. Do you actually think that the twu will bankrupt the company with a restore and more contract? Do you think the twu company union would let that happen? If you do, your lightbulb needs a relight. Why is it you never mention all the idiotic past management decisions (like buying TWA etc) that for all intents and purposes, put AA in these dire straights? This, when the company elite can still blow $330 million+ on themselves but they can't do anything for the people who actually saved the company. Go figure. Spare me the flatline excuses please.

At this point in time, if the company has to shrink, then that's the solution. If the final solution is bankruptcy, we could all work for free and not stop them from filing. If managment cannot afford a fair and reasonable restoration of our major sacrifices for the past 6 years, yet, they can damn well continue to enrich themselves beyond comprehension in these "dire times". THEN SHUT THE G-DAMN DOORS AND WELD THEM SHUT!!!!!

Then flatline, you can cry about how the workers broke the company til your Prozack runs out, and maybe Ourpay will give you a job washing his airplane, cleaning his mansion, or waxing his Benz. h34r:

 

[Hopeful]

WeAAsles it sounds like you are someone who is able to see reason and put the dogma aside in favor of practicality. I respect that. Comments by guys like The Goose who demand an improvement over pre-2003 contract... that is just not even in the ball park. It's that kind of mentality that will force us to a stalemate and sink our employer.

Goose I have both balls and brains (you appear to be missing one of these) and know when to use each. Right now it is time for the thinking cap, and making sure AA stays competitive and in business means making sure I can continue to feed, clothe and educate my family.

If you think you're so goddamned smart put your name on a ballot.

You are clearly fearful of losing your job, and I can respect that.
Having said that...Frontline, I'm surprised you haven't gone into management yet. You would fit well with the "we need to save the company" mentality. They would reward someone like you well...Do anything to keep your job...

You would do well....
Considering your distaste for unions and adoration of company,,,,,you should make the move.

 

[WeAAsles]

Frontline, practical or not I WILL NOT vote for anything that takes us in ANY steps backward though. And I'm really not too concerned with bankruptcy when it looks like our government is willing to bail out anyone these days. I want FULL disclosure from AA as to there finances. Before AA pays down debt and calls that a loss I think they have a debt to there employees first. I'm also not willing to forgo a pay increase to fund incompetence and nescience to what kind of ways the cuts of 03 affected us? I totally believe in Restore and More and if AA reaches certain benchmarks it should be demanded! AA HQ though is full of thieves and connivers with hidden agendas who spout corporate propaganda and ra ra shouts in the hope they can stir up followers. They have the opportunity to do the right thing but instead what do they do? Start harassing there employees on every level, training, uniform compliance, safety vests, they even harassed a guy because of his shoelaces. To me this company is being run by a group of children. Maybe it's jealousy on there part that they know who really makes this company work?

 

[onthedock]

In favor of practicality flatline? You meant to say cowardice did you not? Yours is duly noted here. Your so frightened for yourself and your "job" you would sell yourself and your coworkers out to the lowest bidder, I.E. the current twu sellout offer. You can't wait to vote yes on something, no matter how concessionary it is. I will wager you have less than 10 years seniority, and if there is a severe cut-back, your headed out the door with your tale tucked. Now, I could be wrong on that, however your continuous and desperate "save me" company boy posts are a good indication. I also don't think you were here in 1995 when nearly the same now thing was happening then. Namely, the company/twu scare tactics on in full force during a poor ecomomy and dimwits that "wanna believe" voted for a 6 year twu sellout.

Let's do put on our thinking cap son. Do you actually think that the twu will bankrupt the company with a restore and more contract? Do you think the twu company union would let that happen? If you do, your lightbulb needs a relight. Why is it you never mention all the idiotic past management decisions (like buying TWA etc) that for all intents and purposes, put AA in these dire straights? This, when the company elite can still blow $330 million+ on themselves but they can't do anything for the people who actually saved the company. Go figure. Spare me the flatline excuses please.

At this point in time, if the company has to shrink, then that's the solution. If the final solution is bankruptcy, we could all work for free and not stop them from filing. If managment cannot afford a fair and reasonable restoration of our major sacrifices for the past 6 years, yet, they can damn well continue to enrich themselves beyond comprehension in these "dire times". THEN SHUT THE G-DAMN DOORS AND WELD THEM SHUT!!!!!

Then flatline, you can cry about how the workers broke the company til your Prozack runs out, and maybe Ourpay will give you a job washing his airplane, cleaning his mansion, or waxing his Benz. h34r:

"1995 when nearly the same now thing was happening then"?
Are you kidding me?
Dude, pull up your window shade and take a look around!
Jeez.

 

[Hackman]

"1995 when nearly the same now thing was happening then"?
Are you kidding me?
Dude, pull up your window shade and take a look around!
Jeez.

I am fully aware of the current conditions newbie. However until management starts "sharing the sacrifice" as promised and stops stuffing their pockets full of cash, then there is no problem.

If that doesn't make any sense, then you can vote "yes" on the any concessionary twu agreement you wish, however I will not.

Who is kidding who?