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I would have mine BROTHERIs the AMT Pension next concession of the TWU?
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I would have mine BROTHER<_< <_< <_<
TIME FOR CHANGE
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I believe that the the twu would have it no other way than to screw everyone equally no matter your age or time spent paying dues to a sorry excuse of a union.
Although the I got mine people will be all for it.
To bad for the guy that is 44 :down:
Although the I got mine people will be all for it.
To bad for the guy that is 44 :down:
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<_< ---- Or 60!!!
Does anyone out there know what sort of 401K match that the carriers that eliminated their pension plans have?
I dont see AA getting rid of their plan just yet. Why would they?
Lets say they did away with the pension and went with only a 3% match. Well for me,last year it would cost $1860, instead of the $1100 the traditional pension cost them. So a 401K would not only have been more expensive but they would have lost the only bargaining chip they have. Forget what the pension liability is, they defered that till far off in the future, that chip got them over $1.2 billion a year in concessions from the TWU alone.
What I think they will try and do is try and go with a 401K for new hires with the promise that those of us on the defined plan will remain on it, for now. The TWU will agree to yet another way to split up the membership. Pay rates will remain low, they will sell it off to the senior guys by claiming that they have to save the pension and sell off a shortened progression to the new hires. Eventually they will screw the guys on the DB plan because the extensions they won as far as underfunding the plan will come due.
The fact of the matter is that the only reason why our plan is still in place is because it more than pays for itself for the company.The savings they get by having it in place pays more than they could ever hope to save by eliminating it. So contrary to what we've been told by the company and its "union" the DB plan at present is not more costly than DC plans, in fact its the opposite.
By splitting the membership between DB and DC AMR and the TWU insure that for many years into the future they will be looking at a divided workforce and will simply play one off against the others like they have done for the last twenty years.
DB, DC, long progressions with extremely low starting rates, over 20 powerless locals with appointed International stooges in charge of the contract,one of their own in charge of the union, overhaul in about as close to third world cost areas of the US as you can find, management couldnt dream of a better setup than that.
One thing is for sure, if American Airlines' favorite low level member of management, Jim Little, is in charge, we are screwed.
I dont see AA getting rid of their plan just yet. Why would they?
Lets say they did away with the pension and went with only a 3% match. Well for me,last year it would cost $1860, instead of the $1100 the traditional pension cost them. So a 401K would not only have been more expensive but they would have lost the only bargaining chip they have. Forget what the pension liability is, they defered that till far off in the future, that chip got them over $1.2 billion a year in concessions from the TWU alone.
What I think they will try and do is try and go with a 401K for new hires with the promise that those of us on the defined plan will remain on it, for now. The TWU will agree to yet another way to split up the membership. Pay rates will remain low, they will sell it off to the senior guys by claiming that they have to save the pension and sell off a shortened progression to the new hires. Eventually they will screw the guys on the DB plan because the extensions they won as far as underfunding the plan will come due.
The fact of the matter is that the only reason why our plan is still in place is because it more than pays for itself for the company.The savings they get by having it in place pays more than they could ever hope to save by eliminating it. So contrary to what we've been told by the company and its "union" the DB plan at present is not more costly than DC plans, in fact its the opposite.
By splitting the membership between DB and DC AMR and the TWU insure that for many years into the future they will be looking at a divided workforce and will simply play one off against the others like they have done for the last twenty years.
DB, DC, long progressions with extremely low starting rates, over 20 powerless locals with appointed International stooges in charge of the contract,one of their own in charge of the union, overhaul in about as close to third world cost areas of the US as you can find, management couldnt dream of a better setup than that.
One thing is for sure, if American Airlines' favorite low level member of management, Jim Little, is in charge, we are screwed.
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<_< ---- Bob! If the TWU gives up it's pensions The younger people will be better off building Chevy's! Or working for the Post Office! The job will not be worth having! For the price of an A&P ticket today, and the responsibility that go's along with it, it won't take a genius to figure out that there is no future in this business!! If the TWU goes along with this, they'll be sacrificing future "Dues" to pacify aa today!!! :rant:
Over half the ATD is from AMR. The ATD is the largest part of the TWU. As long as the TWU can collect enough dues to pay Little and fund his second pension Jim Little will continue to do whatever AMR tells him to do.
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<_< ----If that's the case any young man,or lady remotely thinking about getting into this Field, I feel would be making a grievous mistake! 😉
That goes without saying, but for those of us who have already made that error we have to deal with what we have, and the first thing we must do is get rid of Little "by any means neccissary"!
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FYI
Little is now TWU International President. Check out the picture at the top right of the TWU page. We're doomed !!
http://www.twu.org/
Some guy named Yingst is now ATD Director. Anybody know anything about him. I heard he could be worse than Little was.
http://www.twuatd.org/
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Any of you line guys want to watch the company union Dog and Pony show, then fly into Tulsa Wednesday morning or afternoon for the Carmine Romano - Dennis Burchette Town Hall Boot and Butt Licking Show.
Just come to the North End of Hangar 5 and drop your jaw. They will have some microphones if you "have questions".
Just come to the North End of Hangar 5 and drop your jaw. They will have some microphones if you "have questions".
I am completely confused why you guys are so hung up on the pension. Why would you put all of your retirement in the trust of AMR? Even if you're 60 you're likely to live 20 or 30 more years, what are the odd AMR doesn't go bankrupt and dump the pension in the next 20 years? I'd say 50/50 at best.
Take the cash buy out, buy an annuity with a AAA rated bank. You'd maybe give up 5-15%, but you'd get a hell of a lot more security.
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The way things are going in this country and industry, I agree with you. The thing is:a pension should be untouchable by AMR even in bankruptcy and that's for everybody not just Carty and Arpey. Pensions should not be used to pad executives pocketbooks either.
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<_< -----Princess! When are you running for Congrss? I'll vote for you any day of the week!!
Just wondering what you would consider a fair buyout of say a 20 year employee?
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