Teamsters Pension Fund in"RED ZONE" - They need your AA AMT Money!

[Real tired]

Yes when the Pension goes to the PBGC & it is above their maximum then it does get reduced ours wouldn't because were not above the Maximum and as you said ours isn't going to the PBGC anyway so were good.

Maybe that is what swampt was referring to Pensions going to the PBGC & above their max.

Not correct. Most likely the benefit you were expecting under the AA plan would be greatly reduced under the PBGC plan. Each plan under the PBGC is different and you will never know the amount you will receive until your plan has been studied and decided upon by the PBGC plan administrator. This process can take years in some plans. I think the TWA people had to wait some years for a final determination for their plan.

With us at US, we had a 85 point plan, as your age and years with the company adds to 85, then you could have retired with full medical and a nice sizable monthly check. That was all taken from us in 2005 when the company terminated our pensions overnight, without warning, with the stroke of a pen.

With AA in bankruptcy, it could happen before you know it. And it is a life changer. Your whole future changes in one second. I'll never forgive this company for that. With the PBGC, I saw my benefits cut in half, and sadly the IAM pension, what little it is, helps take some of the pain away.

 

[Real tired]

Retired pilots at DL saw their pension checks reduced when DL terminated the pension, just like at US and UA before them. That was because the pilots' pensions are generally far more than the monthly PBGC maximum.

This is true, and the reason you see some former US pilots flying a broom, so to speak, at Home Depot after they retire. The monthly maximum at the PGBC just wasn't that much when the terminated their pensions.

 

[Raptorman49]

Under the IAM plan, if we were to change unions, the plan ends. You would still be able to collect what benefits you have earned up to that point, that is when you retire as an A&P Mechanic and no longer work in the industry or with a company that has the IAM plan.

I'm sure the Teamster plan is similar.

I think I understand how it works now & I would be ok with that, & Buck from what I read it might cost you a fee to be in the program, it depends on what if anything is negotiated with the company if they pay the fee then of course the Employee wouldn't have to but someone has to pay for it, Pensions aren't Free of course, depending on what the fee was would of course make a difference in whether I would opt to be in it, the company might pay some like the 401k match plan & the Employee pay some, it all depends on what is negotiated.

 

[Raptorman49]

Not correct. Most likely the benefit you were expecting under the AA plan would be greatly reduced under the PBGC plan. Each plan under the PBGC is different and you will never know the amount you will receive until your plan has been studied and decided upon by the PBGC plan administrator. This process can take years in some plans. I think the TWA people had to wait some years for a final determination for their plan.

With us at US, we had a 85 point plan, as your age and years with the company adds to 85, then you could have retired with full medical and a nice sizable monthly check. That was all taken from us in 2005 when the company terminated our pensions overnight, without warning, with the stroke of a pen.

With AA in bankruptcy, it could happen before you know it. And it is a life changer. Your whole future changes in one second. I'll never forgive this company for that. With the PBGC, I saw my benefits cut in half, and sadly the IAM pension, what little it is, helps take some of the pain away.

According to the PBGC charts most Mechanics do not go above the maximum, I called them & they did tell me that you can't go exactly by the chart to find out what you would get because as you say their are other factors that come into play but he told me most people who are not above the max do get pretty close to what they were going to get before it was turned over, doesn't matter anyway because AA is going to keep it's plans so it's all good for now.

 

[Real tired]

Please answer the question, will it cost me fee, tax or penalty to become a teamster in relation to their pension?

Under the IAM plan, no. Not sure about the Teamsters.


But, if they are there trying to sell you their garbage, better ask these question:

What is the vestment period?
What is the monthly multiplier?
Will you receive credit for time served towards a "25 and out"?

 

[Raptorman49]

Under the IAM plan, no. Not sure about the Teamsters.


But, if they are there trying to sell you their garbage, better ask these question:

What is the vestment period?
What is the monthly multiplier?
Will you receive credit for time served towards a "25 and out"?

I haven't seen anything from the Teamsters trying about the Pensions on their Information flyers so at the present they are not playing the Pension card to try & get cards, that could change of course if the drive were to stall they will bring up more selling points but at this stage nothing has been said about the Pension plan.

 

[Raptorman49]

At the present this is all I have seen from the Teamsters for AA drive. http://www.teamster.org/aamx
that's their AA card drive page.

Fact sheet going around a lot. http://www.teamster....eFactsFlier.pdf
If you'll notice there is nothing mentioned on the site about the Pension that I have found.
the one that says stop signing AMFA cards isn't to popular with AMFA supporters for obvious reasons.

 

[xUT]

At the present this is all I have seen from the Teamsters for AA drive. http://www.teamster.org/aamx
that's their AA card drive page.

Fact sheet going around a lot. http://www.teamster....eFactsFlier.pdf
If you'll notice there is nothing mentioned on the site about the Pension that I have found.
the one that says stop signing AMFA cards isn't to popular with AMFA supporters for obvious reasons.

From the Flyer:

Q:Will the Teamsters organize AA Fleet
Service (Ramp) and Stores workers?
A:No, the Teamsters are only looking to organize
mechanics and related classes and crafts

Isn't that what they said at CAL...
Another goodie:

Q: Can the contract be reopened once the
Teamsters are certified as our new union?
A: Yes. The newly-certified union can file Section
6 to reopen the contract.

B) xUT

 

[swamt]

All the pension crap will come out verbally, never in writing as they all know, it can be held against them if they put it in writing. Watch and learn, the teamsters do it every card drive. It is like clock work, and all are paid servants to make the card drive successfull. Just wait, the pension promices are coming, but only verbal...

 

[JABORD]

Ok so the way I understand this clause is that if you go back to work in another Teamster company you don't lose your Pension you just stop collecting it until your retired again & which point you can start collecting it again ..... Correct ??

If that's the case then I would be ok with that, basically it would be the equivalent to me retiring from AA then going back to work for AA, I too would have my Pension suspended because I'm no longer retired but once I retire again it will resume again.

Great discussion going folks. Good to see civility isn't dead.
Rap your making a big assumption here. Very few folks now a days are able to put 30-40 years in and then make a career change or retire by choice. Especially with todays $$ not going as far as years past and also the trend in the last few years for many of us to be required to average far higher numbers of hours in a week to pay the bills, a good percentage of folks that pull out of the workforce choose to for any number of reasons, health being one. The point is, once a person recieves their pension check, most times they don't have the ability late in the game to suspend and get back into a regular check. Most cases that I was involved with at the Teamsters Pension Fund were fellas that were looking to stay retired and SUPPLIMENT their earnings. And this is where the tragedy lies because no matter how basic their interests were to make some extra bucks, lawn mower repair,etc, the determination by the Review Board was if that type of job was either presently under IBT representation somewhere or could be. And I know that many members were not always pleased with the Boards' decision.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

Not correct. Most likely the benefit you were expecting under the AA plan would be greatly reduced under the PBGC plan. Each plan under the PBGC is different and you will never know the amount you will receive until your plan has been studied and decided upon by the PBGC plan administrator. This process can take years in some plans. I think the TWA people had to wait some years for a final determination for their plan.

With us at US, we had a 85 point plan, as your age and years with the company adds to 85, then you could have retired with full medical and a nice sizable monthly check. That was all taken from us in 2005 when the company terminated our pensions overnight, without warning, with the stroke of a pen.

With AA in bankruptcy, it could happen before you know it. And it is a life changer. Your whole future changes in one second. I'll never forgive this company for that. With the PBGC, I saw my benefits cut in half, and sadly the IAM pension, what little it is, helps take some of the pain away.

A post worth repeating.

It isn't simply a matter of was a mechanics pension benefit below the PBGC maximum. Many factors come into play, as mentioned above. At UAL we also lost a large portion of our benefits, there are many good articles on the UAL pension defaults, not just for mechanics but all affected groups at UAL. Well worth the time to read.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

From the Flyer:

Isn't that what they said at CAL...
Another goodie:


B) xUT

And history seems set to repeat itself at American.

AA mechanics protect your selves and demand ibt assurances in writing from ibt OFFICIALS.

In the coming weeks, as the campaign progresses you see-and probably have already - flyers from the ibt penned by your fellow workers. DO NOT settle for this, have the Chris Moores & Bob Fishers put these "claims" under their signatures. If the promises are on the up & up, they shouldn't hesitate in the slightest.

The two examples above are just a sampling of the lies spread at UAL during the ibts campaign in 07' & 08'

 

[Raptorman49]

Great discussion going folks. Good to see civility isn't dead.
Rap your making a big assumption here. Very few folks now a days are able to put 30-40 years in and then make a career change or retire by choice. Especially with todays $$ not going as far as years past and also the trend in the last few years for many of us to be required to average far higher numbers of hours in a week to pay the bills, a good percentage of folks that pull out of the workforce choose to for any number of reasons, health being one. The point is, once a person recieves their pension check, most times they don't have the ability late in the game to suspend and get back into a regular check. Most cases that I was involved with at the Teamsters Pension Fund were fellas that were looking to stay retired and SUPPLIMENT their earnings. And this is where the tragedy lies because no matter how basic their interests were to make some extra bucks, lawn mower repair,etc, the determination by the Review Board was if that type of job was either presently under IBT representation somewhere or could be. And I know that many members were not always pleased with the Boards' decision.

Yeah I can see how a Union Pension could be worse than a Company Pension, there certainly are some drawbacks & some area's are much higher cost of living to where it is very difficult to retire until your in your 70s or can't work anymore because of health issues, in my particular situation though I live in a very low cost area & at most at my age I will only put 10 years into a Teamster Pension, so at 60 years old I wouldn't have any interest in going back into the work force, so the suspending Pension clause wouldn't effect me, once i'm out of the work force I'm out for good but good info for folks that would fall into the situation you described, thanks for the Info I will pass it along. and I to am enjoying the civility of the conversation.

 

[Raptorman49]

From the Flyer:

Isn't that what they said at CAL...
Another goodie:


B) xUT

The flyers i've seen so far haven't really said much that a person would feel he wanted to get more information on, we have only seen two this one http://www.teamster.org/sites/teamster.org/files/61512AAMXMeetingsFlier.pdf and this one http://www.teamster.org/sites/teamster.org/files/61512AAGettheFactsFlier.pdf , not much there to get worked up about, except the one about whether the Teamsters can file section 6 to reopen a contract is misleading, you can file anything but that doesn't mean the company has to reopen a contract & most likely they Wouldn't be interested in doing that.
I haven't heard that anything on this Q&A is getting any cards signed, all the cards I collected were collected long before any flyers were given out to Organizers, It tool Chris some time to make the Flyers, lots of cards were signed before he got around to making them, I'm sure more flyers with different selling points will pop up as the drive get's to the stalling point that always happens in card drives but it's not there yet, also i'm hearing that their is going to be a mud slinging flyer campaign between AMFA & the Teamsters, I have no doubt that will kill either competing Union's chances of getting enough cards so neither drive is worth getting worked up over.

 

[Buck]

There are those who are aiding the TWU effort to prevent AMFA from representing the M&R, by attempting to dilute the vote.

It is most likely against the law under voter protection acts.

I hope that the TWU or the Teamsters do not go to prison.