Industrial vs. Craft

[Raptorman49]

One thing I very much admire about the Teamsters is how their running their card drive campaign, I find it quite impressive, I am a firm believer that visualization matters A LOT & apparently the Teamsters feel the same way with all the buttons, Lanyard, soon to be T-shirts, posters, billboards etc. as I said it's quite impressive, they are doing everything the AMFA supporters did in 2003 (that made a huge difference) & taking it to even higher levels, soon they are planning on holding signs in front of the base & passing out cards at the turnstiles .... very impressive indeed, would love to see the AMFA team doing some of these things & increasing their visual appearance at the base again .... It takes courage I know but winning a card drive requires people to step out of their comfort zone..... how bad do you want it ???

 

[TWU informer]

Ok Dave I'll make you a deal you can choose to accept it or not your choice, The ONLY thing I have been telling anyone about AMFA or the Teamsters is that from my perception (and many others too) it appears that the Teamsters have a lot more support in Tulsa than AMFA because they wear Teamster buttons, Lanyards etc. no shirts yet, if you want me & many others to believe that AMFA has support in Tulsa then prove it by setting an example by proudly wearing your AMFA shirt & encouraging your fellow Organizers to do the same, If the organizers start wearing their then supporters will see that & follow that lead & start wearing theirs as well & before you know it AMFA will have presence in Tulsa once again & people will visually see that there is support for AMFA in Tulsa & just like the Teamster drive that enthusiasm will multiply pumping people up & making them believe that AMFA has a chance, If I visually see that AMFA has a chance like I see with the Teamsters then I too will start believing that AMFA has a chance & start telling people that AMFA does have a chance, I will even go on record in the Tulsa world, As I said Dave it's your choice, as long as it visually appears to me that the Teamsters are strong in Tulsa & AMFA is weak then I will continue to believe exactly that, appearance is everything in 2003 I spent a lot of my own money buying AMFA shirts for people because I knew that & everyday I saw more & more AMFA shirts being worn at the base & people getting excited about it, I was getting excited about it ! I rarely see anyone wearing AMFA these days not even you their head organizer in Tulsa ..... it's sad, If you want my attitude to change then you know what it will take ramp up the visualization to get me & others excited again, then proudly stand in front of the base in force wearing your shirts someday & holding AMFA signs like we did in 2003, Dave Lead the Revolution by example wear your colors.
I wear a Teamster button because I enjoy the comradery of running into fellow Teamster supporters that I don't know showing their support by wearing their buttons etc. & talking to them about the drive, no point in wearing an AMFA shirt because no one else does.

Like I told you in a previous discussion.
We don't tend to broadcast our intentions.

But let's just say that even though you will be wrong, you will soon be able to say that you "made" us get t-shirts. Just so you will shut up about it, I will go ahead and say it. We are getting some t-shirts! Ok ?
Never quite understood how anyone could or even would gauge support or strength on a t-shirt. However, I do know the TWU has trained members into this type of thinking for years. Well OK, t-shirts are the easy part. Try getting into the real in's and out's of successful organizing. I might even have to buy you a t-shirt since that means so damn much to you.

To do things right in a democratic organization, things take a little more time and patience, but I think once you see the results, you will see that the longer results make for a better end results.

Check your PM here in a minute. I will show something and see if you approve.

 

[Raptorman49]

Like I told you in a previous discussion.
We don't tend to broadcast our intentions.

But let's just say that even though you will be wrong, you will soon be able to say that you "made" us get t-shirts. Just so you will shut up about it, I will go ahead and say it. We are getting some t-shirts! Ok ?
Never quite understood how anyone could or even would gauge support or strength on a t-shirt. However, I do know the TWU has trained members into this type of thinking for years. Well OK, t-shirts are the easy part. Try getting into the real in's and out's of successful organizing. I might even have to buy you a t-shirt since that means so damn much to you.

To do things right in a democratic organization, things take a little more time and patience, but I think once you see the results, you will see that the longer results make for a better end results.

Check your PM here in a minute. I will show something and see if you approve.

Dave I already have many AMFA T-shirts & i'm sure you do as well that's my point I know that at some point you will order T-shirts but you already have some for yourself & I'm sure that many of the past Organizers already have shirts so I think that the people who already have shirts from the 15 years of AMFA card drives should start wearing them, I have worn mine from time to time as have a couple of other guys in my shop, their wearing Teamsters now because they don't see anyone wearing AMFA but I suspect if they visually saw AMFA support at the base again they would start wearing their AMFA shirts again, I believe many organizers have their old shirts packed away in the back of their closets but would be willing to dust them off & start wearing them again once they see the Lead organizers like yourself making the first move. 🙄
Visualization matters Dave even a guy at the meeting said he wanted to know when to expect to visually see support in Tulsa & you answered him & said soon, it's not just me, I hear everyday that people don't see AMFA at the base, You can change that .... wear what you already have & send out emails & texts asking others to as well, you could even pick an AMFA support day in the middle of the week for everyone to put on a show of support, people need to see support in order to feel it, Tulsa are followers lead by example & they will follow. B)

 

[TWU informer]

Dave I already have many AMFA T-shirts & i'm sure you do as well that's my point I know that at some point you will order T-shirts but you already have some for yourself & I'm sure that many of the past Organizers already have shirts so I think that the people who already have shirts from the 15 years of AMFA card drives should start wearing them, I have worn mine from time to time as have a couple of other guys in my shop, their wearing Teamsters now because they don't see anyone wearing AMFA but I suspect if they visually saw AMFA support at the base again they would start wearing their AMFA shirts again, I believe many organizers have their old shirts packed away in the back of their closets but would be willing to dust them off & start wearing them again once they see the Lead organizers like yourself making the first move. 🙄
Visualization matters Dave even a guy at the meeting said he wanted to know when to expect to visually see support in Tulsa & you answered him & said soon, it's not just me, I hear everyday that people don't see AMFA at the base, You can change that .... wear what you already have & send out emails & texts asking others to as well, you could even pick an AMFA support day in the middle of the week for everyone to put on a show of support, people need to see support in order to feel it, Tulsa are followers lead by example & they will follow. B)

That is your opinion.
My opinion that answering TWU surveys with incorrect answers, quietly getting cards signed until the bread and butter is complete, and then showing our support is a much more effective way of getting it done.

But for some, like yourself, the best strategy is to claim there is no support in the media, when you have no clue what is really happening, and you will broadcast your itentions so your opponent can prepare and counter your moves.

Good luck with that idea. This isn't my first rodeo, and I feel like we have a great plan and it is working just fine.

But hey, pay no attention to that man behind the curtain. We are not really even here!

 

[odie01]

Dave I already have many AMFA T-shirts & i'm sure you do as well that's my point I know that at some point you will order T-shirts but you already have some for yourself & I'm sure that many of the past Organizers already have shirts so I think that the people who already have shirts from the 15 years of AMFA card drives should start wearing them, I have worn mine from time to time as have a couple of other guys in my shop, their wearing Teamsters now because they don't see anyone wearing AMFA but I suspect if they visually saw AMFA support at the base again they would start wearing their AMFA shirts again, I believe many organizers have their old shirts packed away in the back of their closets but would be willing to dust them off & start wearing them again once they see the Lead organizers like yourself making the first move. 🙄
Visualization matters Dave even a guy at the meeting said he wanted to know when to expect to visually see support in Tulsa & you answered him & said soon, it's not just me, I hear everyday that people don't see AMFA at the base, You can change that .... wear what you already have & send out emails & texts asking others to as well, you could even pick an AMFA support day in the middle of the week for everyone to put on a show of support, people need to see support in order to feel it, Tulsa are followers lead by example & they will follow. B)

Dude,
We all know what your objective is , why not be a man and support your teamsters! / twu !

 

[TWU informer]

Dude,
We all know what your objective is , why not be a man a support your teamsters!

IT'S ALL ABOUT SHIRTS, SLOGANS, POLITCAL YARD SIGNS, AND TWISTING FACTS AND STATEMENTS.

LORD, NO WONDER THIS PROFESSION IS SWIRLING DOWN A TOILET WITHOUT A BOTTOM.

 

[TWU informer]

Raptor49,

Now you just watch what happens as an example.

I dislcosed we will soon have t-shirts.

TWU will now have t-shirt disrtibution for the first time in years. And it will happen real damn soon.
Not that a t-shirt matters for crap, but this will be a good example of what happens when you just have to demand t-shirts to believe AMFA has support.

Just you watch now.

Had we done that earlier, it could have had a negative impact on our plan.

See you wearing a new AMFA t-shirt soon!!!!

 

[odie01]

He's not fooling anybody, nor is he gaining support for the teamsters! He's good though, way better than HSS.

 

[TWU informer]

"IT IS WHAT IT IS"
Raptor49 summer of 2012

 

[Raptorman49]

That is your opinion.
My opinion that answering TWU surveys with incorrect answers, quietly getting cards signed until the bread and butter is complete, and then showing our support is a much more effective way of getting it done.

But for some, like yourself, the best strategy is to claim there is no support in the media, when you have no clue what is really happening, and you will broadcast your itentions so your opponent can prepare and counter your moves.

Good luck with that idea. This isn't my first rodeo, and I feel like we have a great plan and it is working just fine.

But hey, pay no attention to that man behind the curtain. We are not really even here!

I know your idea of a low profile drive is the best strategy & I absolutely disagree & that's why I am not having any part of it, I think that strategy will fail, I think the Teamsters are on the right track & this isn't their first rodeo either with 180,000 members they know how to do a card drive, guess you gotta run the card drive your way & good luck with that. B)

I call it like I see it, presently I see a lot of support for the Teamsters & not for AMFA if that should change then I will call it differently.
As you know I like giving interviews soooo better get on with making some visible changes .... LOL

 

[Raptorman49]

Dude,
We all know what your objective is , why not be a man and support your teamsters! / twu !

Are you Insisting ?? I'm here for YOU Odie so if your INSISTING that I ramp up support for the Teamsters/TWU I guess I will have too.

 

[odie01]

I know your idea of a low profile drive is the best strategy & I absolutely disagree & that's why I am not having any part of it, I think that strategy will fail, I think the Teamsters are on the right track & this isn't their first rodeo either with 180,000 members they know how to do a card drive, guess you gotta run the card drive your way & good luck with that. B)

I call it like I see it, presently I see a lot of support for the Teamsters & not for AMFA if that should change then I will call it differently.
As you know I like giving interviews soooo better get on with making some visible changes .... LOL

OK, now take a hike! You are a desperate twu stooge!

 

[Raptorman49]

IT'S ALL ABOUT SHIRTS, SLOGANS, POLITCAL YARD SIGNS, AND TWISTING FACTS AND STATEMENTS.

LORD, NO WONDER THIS PROFESSION IS SWIRLING DOWN A TOILET WITHOUT A BOTTOM.

I agree all that stuff matters a lot more than you realize ..... you don't have to like it but it is what it is, couldn't help but notice your talking to the press if exposure doesn't matter with card drives then no point in talking to the press. B)
Exposure will make the difference in this card drive, it made the difference in 2003 when we were in front of the base with AMFA signs & handing out cards at the Turnstiles & passing out literature all the time, Exposure means everything, that's why Reagan became President, & arnold became governor of california, etc. I could go on & on, Exposure means everything !!

 

[Raptorman49]

Raptor49,

Now you just watch what happens as an example.

I dislcosed we will soon have t-shirts.

TWU will now have t-shirt disrtibution for the first time in years. And it will happen real damn soon.
Not that a t-shirt matters for crap, but this will be a good example of what happens when you just have to demand t-shirts to believe AMFA has support.

Just you watch now.

Had we done that earlier, it could have had a negative impact on our plan.

See you wearing a new AMFA t-shirt soon!!!!

TWU is getting cheap these days they are cutting services like Big Splash etc. I don't see them giving out T-shirts just to fight the AMFA drive, guess we will soon see which one of us is right on this issue hugh, My guess is No TWU T-shirts will be coming out & the Teamsters T-shirts were planned way before these post's. so that is not a response to these posts.

 

[Raptorman49]

He's not fooling anybody, nor is he gaining support for the teamsters! He's good though, way better than HSS.

WTF was that a compliment ..... LOL some folks think I am High Speed or Anomaly .... LOL
As I said I have always been Raptor something because most know who that is, I have no desire to hide & don't like using an Alias but have a healthy respect for AA HR department .... If I wanted to hide I wouldn't be talking to the press so often 🙄