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Tariffs

delldude

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Interesting article by Byron York on Europe's fears of the US declining to be China's biggest trading partner. It's a good track record of what happened to our jobs and economy.

Also a video of how tariffs work and who's really been screwing us all these years. Note the part about who's making the most noise.

Much of the public’s attention to the Trump tariff situation focuses on 1) each person’s individual loss, or possible loss, in the stock market and 2) whether tariffs will result in inflation going forward. But the tariff controversy has many parts. One interesting aspect is the growing fear in Europe that China will do to Europe what it did to the U.S. in the last 25 years, to disastrous effect. This, according to some media accounts, is somehow President Donald Trump’s fault. But the real fault is China’s.
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The story noted that China cheats all over the place when it comes to trade. The government subsidizes the production of massive amounts of goods, allowing China to sell them at artificially low prices. China steals intellectual property right and left. It has also erected extensive “non-tariff barriers” to trade — for example, shutting the U.S. out of selling many goods in China.

China can flood a country with cheap goods, undercutting the industries in that country. What had been a vital local economy becomes one saturated with Chinese goods. Here is what the New York Times wrote with respect to China and Europe: “[China] produces a vast array of artificially cheap goods — heavily subsidized electric vehicles, consumer electronics, toys, commercial grade steel and more — but much of that trade was destined for the endlessly voracious American marketplace. With many of those goods now facing an extraordinary wall of tariffs thanks to President Trump, fear is rising that more products will be dumped in Europe, weakening local industries in France, Germany, Italy, and the rest of the European Union.”

A few days ago, the Washington Post said much the same thing: “As China’s factories continue to hum, Chinese goods that would have gone to the U.S. will instead head for Europe and other markets, threatening them with the sort of job-killing shock that battered American workers in the first decade of this century.”

Could there be a more compelling reason for the measures that Trump is taking against China? Why shouldn’t the U.S. fight back against China’s “job-killing” strategy that has “battered” American workers? Yes, of course Europe needs to protect itself against China too. Maybe they will realize that it would be better to trade more with the U.S.

On other aspects of the trade situation, National Economic Council head Kevin Hassett told Fox Business’s Larry Kudlow on Monday afternoon that the U.S. has “been contacted by virtually every country on Earth” to negotiate trade arrangements. There have been at least 10 actual offers of new deals. It seems to be happening quickly, Hassett said, but it is important to remember that such conversations did not begin last week — they began Jan. 20, when Trump took office. “I’ve had countless conversations with European Union counterparts and around the world,” Hassett said. “The trade deal discussions have been going on really from the very beginning.”



 
China just cancelled all Boeing deliveries. They are the biggest exporter, This will hurt. And this guy does a good job of explaining how tariffs impact aviation. We won't have a trade deficit, but we won't have all those sweet jobs that are promised.

 
They've been having image problems lately.

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China just cancelled all Boeing deliveries. They are the biggest exporter, This will hurt. And this guy does a good job of explaining how tariffs impact aviation. We won't have a trade deficit, but we won't have all those sweet jobs that are promised.


China’s orders only amount to less than one percent of Boeing‘s total orders. I think I’ve read they only have four planes they are waiting on for delivery.
 
China’s orders only amount to less than one percent of Boeing‘s total orders. I think I’ve read they only have four planes they are waiting on for delivery.
Well Boeing won't be selling to China because that business will go to Airbus. Or that new Chinese manufacturer. And thanks to a tariff being essentially a tax on the buyer, major components of the planes they build come from all over teh world...Japan, S Korea, Sweden, UK, France, Italy, Germany and even China. Each of those components will be tariffed at whatever percent the genius has designated. That means than airline looking at a 787 or A350 will see that the Airbus is tens of millions of less. At that rate, even Southwest may find the A320 too good to pass up.
 
Well Boeing won't be selling to China because that business will go to Airbus. Or that new Chinese manufacturer. And thanks to a tariff being essentially a tax on the buyer, major components of the planes they build come from all over teh world...Japan, S Korea, Sweden, UK, France, Italy, Germany and even China. Each of those components will be tariffed at whatever percent the genius has designated. That means than airline looking at a 787 or A350 will see that the Airbus is tens of millions of less. At that rate, even Southwest may find the A320 too good to pass up.
I believe Boeing has scheduled orders and deliveries until 2030. Don't think they are concerned with China's lost orders. Between now and then I think Boeing will figure out how to work things out with customers. All Boeing sales are negotiations and they will make things workout.
 
I believe Boeing has scheduled orders and deliveries until 2030. Don't think they are concerned with China's lost orders. Between now and then I think Boeing will figure out how to work things out with customers. All Boeing sales are negotiations and they will make things workout.
They still have a problem- Tails come from one country, wings from another, landing gear from another. And on and on. A tariff is paid on a LOT of the components on that plane. Since Airbus isn't built here, they won't be subject to the costs that the tariffs place on the same components Boeing planes will be. When airlines look to purchase, Airbus will have a significant price advantage.
 
One of the reasons airplane components are sourced out to other countries is that these countries have a provision that if they are to purchase Boeing aircraft that they desire that some components be built in their country. That is the reason that I believe there will be a lot of negotiations in the future deliveries of Boeing’s airplanes.
 
One of the reasons airplane components are sourced out to other countries is that these countries have a provision that if they are to purchase Boeing aircraft that they desire that some components be built in their country. That is the reason that I believe there will be a lot of negotiations in the future deliveries of Boeing’s airplanes.
Or the will just buy Airbus. Remember - unless EVERY component is built here, it will be subject to to a tariff and will add to the cost of the plane. Airbus will not be impacted by that. Indeed...while Airbus builds components in North Carolina and exports them to France for final assembly, France and the EU can exempt that from their tariffs, making the Airbus even more attractive.

But speaking of agreements - Back in 1993 Bill Clinton signed the work of the right wing deal called NAFTA. Trump hated NAFTA, so in his first term he renegotiated that agreement and called it the USMCA. This was an agreement negotiated by the self proclaimed best deal maker ever, and that agreement even addressed tariffs between Canada and Mexico. Then he is gone for four years and upon his return, he violates the very deal that the worlds greatest master negotiator had worked on. These tariffs are going to basically kill Boeing's commercial market. The government doesn't care about paying more for military aircraft so they'll stay in business for that. But if these tariffs stick, Boeing will be out of the commercial aviation market within the decade.
 
Airbus also assembles planes in Mobile, and delivers them from there. Parts come from elsewhere (including Europe).
 
Or the will just buy Airbus. Remember - unless EVERY component is built here, it will be subject to to a tariff and will add to the cost of the plane. Airbus will not be impacted by that. Indeed...while Airbus builds components in North Carolina and exports them to France for final assembly, France and the EU can exempt that from their tariffs, making the Airbus even more attractive.

But speaking of agreements - Back in 1993 Bill Clinton signed the work of the right wing deal called NAFTA. Trump hated NAFTA, so in his first term he renegotiated that agreement and called it the USMCA. This was an agreement negotiated by the self proclaimed best deal maker ever, and that agreement even addressed tariffs between Canada and Mexico. Then he is gone for four years and upon his return, he violates the very deal that the worlds greatest master negotiator had worked on. These tariffs are going to basically kill Boeing's commercial market. The government doesn't care about paying more for military aircraft so they'll stay in business for that. But if these tariffs stick, Boeing will be out of the commercial aviation market within the decade.
I see your point but disagree. Boeing is run by the bean-counters. They will find a way around these tariffs.
 
I see your point but disagree. Boeing is run by the bean-counters. They will find a way around these tariffs.
By doing what, cutting safety? The bean counters are the reason Boeing is facing all the crap they've been facing. Hell....the bean counters are the ones who outsourced all the components.
 
By doing what, cutting safety? The bean counters are the reason Boeing is facing all the crap they've been facing. Hell....the bean counters are the ones who outsourced all the components.
Cutting safety is never intentional. Accidents happen for all kinds of reasons. From what I have heard from talking to legacy employees of Boeing that the extreme bean counting and cutting corners to save a buck started when McDonell Douglas merged with Boeing and McDonell Douglas ended up running things.
 
Cutting safety is never intentional. Accidents happen for all kinds of reasons. From what I have heard from talking to legacy employees of Boeing that the extreme bean counting and cutting corners to save a buck started when McDonell Douglas merged with Boeing and McDonell Douglas ended up running things.
It did. Read the book "Destination Disaster" about the DC10. And see how you can almost replace "DC10" with "737 Max"
 

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