Ideas to pass a TA with the mechanics.

[MetalMover]

Huh? Anyway, swa isn't included in the average, it is what it is, move on. Think about the future, not the past, we all know twu structure is corrupt. next.  The name of the thread is:
Ideas to pass a TA with the mechanics.
 
Your idea was everyone get paid the same!!!! My idea was, thats bs, break out  the major carriers, do the math, contracting out, pay, on and on.  Let OH compete with OH, let line compete with line.

So one is allowed to speak of the past? Ever? It is because of the TWU's ineptness of the past that moving forward and looking towards the future is that much more difficult. I would be happy for moving 2 steps forward and one step backwards than 2 steps backward and one step forward. 
As for paying all mechanics the same, I feel that basic mechanic pay should be equal between OH and LINE,,,but geographical, shift, and specific duties and responsiblilities  and license factors should be the determining factors.

 

[bigjets]

So one is allowed to speak of the past? Ever? It is because of the TWU's ineptness of the past that moving forward and looking towards the future is that much more difficult. I would be happy for moving 2 steps forward and one step backwards than 2 steps backward and one step forward. 
As for paying all mechanics the same, I feel that basic mechanic pay should be equal between OH and LINE,,,but geographical, shift, and specific duties and responsiblilities  and license factors should be the determining factors.

So one is allowed to speak of the past? Ever? It is because of the TWU's ineptness of the past that moving forward and looking towards the future is that much more difficult. I would be happy for moving 2 steps forward and one step backwards than 2 steps backward and one step forward. 
As for paying all mechanics the same, I feel that basic mechanic pay should be equal between OH and LINE,,,but geographical, shift, and specific duties and responsiblilities  and license factors should be the determining factors.

This kind deviseiveness will cause a TA not to pass and have a divided negotiating team. We already know Doug will pay us a little above Delta, he has proven this with the FA contract. What we need to avoid sense Line mechs now out number OH is, letting the TWU accept less because AA says we can't pay you more because we have to cut line pay to supplement OH. Remember during BK AA could have closed or sold off TUL like it did with MCI and AFW but chose to keep it.

What's sad is, I'm more worried about the TWU screwing us then I'm concerned with AA.

 

[bigjets]

A couple of things I thing should be in and out of a contract. We should NOT accept less money so OH can have weekends and holidays off. I say uniforms should NOT be part of our contract, sense OH doesn't wear uniforms and we are actually leasing uniforms and most cases used polyester pants and shirts. Just becuase the old time goofs got it in the contract doesn't make it smart.

I say this because in the 2003 give backs, we gave back half our uniforms becuase they had monetary value to the company, so instead of paying $22 for a pair of dickies we lose out on actual cash contract after contract becuase the same guys that gave us the b scale decided to RENT clothes from AA.

 

[MetalMover]

This kind deviseiveness will cause a TA not to pass and have a divided negotiating team. We already know Doug will pay us a little above Delta, he has proven this with the FA contract. What we need to avoid sense Line mechs now out number OH is, letting the TWU accept less because AA says we can't pay you more because we have to cut line pay to supplement OH. Remember during BK AA could have closed or sold off TUL like it did with MCI and AFW but chose to keep it.

What's sad is, I'm more worried about the TWU screwing us then I'm concerned with AA.

Maybe a FA can post specifics about their contract. I doubt it is all FA one sided. There has to be things the fa's do not like in their TA.
Same will go for us. Maybe the company will offer us more in terms of pay, but what else will be given up in exchange for matching Delta?
My guess is two things will be offered for sacrifice in exchange for DL comparable wages.....................
The first is the 401k will be offered in exchange for TWU members participating in the IAMPNF.
The second is that sick time will no longer be accrued. capped at 7 days a year. Unused sick time will be paid out at retirement at a predetermined rate...
What scares me is that some people will see the $$$$$ signs and get seduced by this offer. 
Just my guess.

 

[bigjets]

Maybe a FA can post specifics about their contract. I doubt it is all FA one sided. There has to be things the fa's do not like in their TA.
Same will go for us. Maybe the company will offer us more in terms of pay, but what else will be given up in exchange for matching Delta?
My guess is two things will be offered for sacrifice in exchange for DL comparable wages.....................
The first is the 401k will be offered in exchange for TWU members participating in the IAMPNF.
The second is that sick time will no longer be accrued. capped at 7 days a year. Unused sick time will be paid out at retirement at a predetermined rate...
What scares me is that some people will see the $$$$$ signs and get seduced by this offer. 
Just my guess.

I disagree the FAs went from banking 1000 hrs to banking 1500, if you have the use it or lose it system, I'm going to burn days because there is no garentee that you will get it at retirement.

I can easily see the IAM screwing with our 401k to build up IAM pension.

The mob used the teamsters pension fund to build its empire in Vegas. No Union for me thank you

 

[MetalMover]

I disagree the FAs went from banking 1000 hrs to banking 1500, if you have the use it or lose it system, I'm going to burn days because there is no garentee that you will get it at retirement.

I can easily see the IAM screwing with our 401k to build up IAM pension.

The mob used the teamsters pension fund to build its empire in Vegas. No Union for me thank you

Remember, the TWU is not the FA union. 

 

[bigjets]

Remember, the TWU is not the FA union.

The TWU will probably give up our sick bank in order to get 20 more OSMs on property, more dues coming in, or OSMs to work b checks, no telling the damage the TWU can further cause.

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

ANY​

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Part of this T/A that you are talking about that has any concessions what so ever should be​

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VOTED Down.​

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I see that you are 100% blaming the TWU and that is well deserved.​

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But what about the guys who did not vote or voted Yes so they could get the early out packages.​

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Your putting the cart before the horse guys, why would you even consider a T/A with the TWU or IAM Logo on the top of it.​

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The NMB has not given us a ruling and if we do get some type of VOTE why would you expect the TWU to win?​

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Haven't you had enough of all the give backs and trade this for that the TWU has done that long enough don't you think?​

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Fighting with the O/H guys and blaming them is not going to get us anywhere, we need to stand as one group. All this OSM/O/H that is just what the TWU wants. Keep us divided.​

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If at any time we do get a T/A the sick time, vacation, 401k, our frozen pension all should be off the table and if its there that should be an automatic NO vote.​

 

[MetalMover]

The TWU will probably give up our sick bank in order to get 20 more OSMs on property, more dues coming in, or OSMs to work b checks, no telling the damage the TWU can further cause.

The possibilities are endless.

 

[OldGuy@AA]

Looks like the same old stuff.  A line guy brings the knock on O/H to start the fight.  I can understand that this dude does not want to give anything up for overhaul.  I don't expect him to.  But there is a huge difference between Timco and AA overhaul.  Do not compare me, an airline overhaul mechanic, to Timco and I won't compare a line guy to something he is not.  I get it that you are angry.  I am too.  But to tell me to take a pay cut so you can get a raise makes you no better than the TWU that you hate.  I have an A@P just like you do.  The new management has made it clear we will work weekends in TULE.  Just like the line guys.  I am not going to get into an argument about this stuff.  I know what I do and I know what you do.  I can do your job and you can do mine.  The truth of the matter is that many of us in TULE will not do overhaul work for Timco wages (or OSM wages).  If AA wants to contract out the O/H so be it.  It will make the line guys' job harder.  I deserve the same base pay as any line mechanic.  If they want to add a line premium and/or GEO pay for line so be it.  Honestly this is the attitude that makes it difficult to get AMFA cards signed.  This is the most used excuse that I hear when I ask.  They say AMFA will be controlled by the line and O/H will be thrown under the bus.  Just remember that they can outsource your job on the line just like they can outsource mine in O/H.  But if you want to continue to use the wedge and drive it deeper between line and O/H you will suffer too.  The TWU has used this to keep us down.  Keep it in mind that there are those who enjoy seeing us fight among our own group.

 

[DallasConehead]

I am sick of taking it in the ass so you OH guys can have day shift and  weekends off, and so AA can employ 6000 of you when every other airline has less then half of that and so you can work in a heated hangar or shop while I'm out on the flight line every holiday, freezing or sweating my balls off. I am sick of that Bull ####. I don't care what you say, I have suffered through 28 years of that crap.
 
And now, and now, we need to stick together, stick up for the OH guys, where were you all during all that time... my ass....

 

[OldGuy@AA]

I was voting no all that time.  For 29 years I've done it.  I even held a sign at the front gate on the last two TAs.  But go ahead and hate.

 

[blue collar]

We already know Doug will pay us a little above Delta, he has proven this with the FA contract.

I don't know if that's correct. The FAs didn't have such a huge disparity between the two companies like the mechanics do. I hope that you guys can bridge that gap, but it's far from fact right now.

 

[topDawg]

Same old stupid argument, you want swa rates then do swa contract out.
 
Let the overhaul guys compete with the MROs of the world, while the rest of us compete at line rates. Then if the OH guys want the line rate they use their sen and come out to the high cost areas.
 
.55 cents is silly and we all know it.

Sure you wanna go that route? 
 
Delta makes more than you
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
and is the largest airline MRO in the US. So if you want your OH to make MRO rates (Delta) and you to be on your own then good luck with that one. 
 
 
 
forgot to add, MROs have line MX too. May wanna do a comparison with that before you hold your nose so far up in the air. 

 

[topDawg]

I am sick of taking it in the ass so you OH guys can have day shift and  weekends off, and so AA can employ 6000 of you when every other airline has less then half of that and so you can work in a heated hangar or shop while I'm out on the flight line every holiday, freezing or sweating my balls off. I am sick of that Bull ####. I don't care what you say, I have suffered through 28 years of that crap.
 
And now, and now, we need to stick together, stick up for the OH guys, where were you all during all that time... my ass....

28  years and you can't get a job at AA in a hangar or shop? 
 
 
Or is this one of those deal where you are making the choice to be "freezing or sweating your balls off" and are just mad cause we aren't all on out the line too? You could pay me to take a line job at Delta. Why? I don't wanna be cold or wet (it gets hot in the hangar during the summer, maybe AA pays for A/C at TULE. If so I am a little jealous) 
 
how I will say not having 24/7 coverage is a little stupid. Agreed you(line) shouldn't be taking a pay cut for OH to not have a midnight or weekend crew. (same for holiday coverage. Many moons ago I had to work holidays doing OH at Delta. That was part of being junior. Odd that its different at AA)