IAM Stepping Up campaign

[700UW]

So post the increases, all we have you're hearsay, no facts, nothing but you saying it happened.
 
Since June 20, 2012 and at the end of this year DL's pilots would have gotten nearly 20% in a 2 1/2 year period, did any other employee groups get that high of a raise in the same 2 1/2 year period?
 
Put up or shut up, and the what is greater, a percentage of 200,000 or 40,000?
 
And what happened to the DL non-union pension?
 
It was taken away also now wasnt it?
 
Funny thing is we all know about Leadership 7.5, what about "Operation Clockwork" that happened before chapter 11?
 
The non-union employees had their pensions frozen, so they dont get any future accural from it, now do they?
 
And Delta had to give the PBGC stock to make up for the shortfall and ALPA and DL negotiated a replacement pension, something you cared to post.
 

Its pension plans are permanently frozen, and the carrier did enjoy relief from federal government that allows a longer funding period for commitments prior to freezing of the plan and favourable discounting rates. Yet its pension commitments remain hefty, prompting many investors to question how Delta will fund its requirements.
 
Presently, depending on the discount rate, Delta’s pension funding commitments could range from USD8 billion to USD13 billion. The carrier has stated it plans to make up to USD1 billion of incremental contributions to the plan during the next five years in addition to the USD650 million to USD700 million in minimum annual required contributions. Mr Bastian admitted that Delta realises the pension risk is a “bit of an overhang” but the carrier believes the minimum pension requirements over the next decade combined with 9% return on assets should create sufficient cash flows for its pension funding.

 
http://www.pionline.com/article/20130829/ONLINE/130829877/delta-air-lines-picks-wurts-as-outsourced-cio
 

 
Delta had $8.2 billion in defined benefit plan assets as of Dec. 31, and $21.5 billion in projected benefit obligations, for a funding ratio of 38.1%, according to the company's most recent 10-K filing

 

Under the settlement agreement, the PBGC will make a final decision whether to accept the PBGC staff’s recommendation that the Pilot Plan meets the statutory criteria for distress termination. If the agency agrees that the Pilot Plan meets all legal criteria for distress termination, the PBGC will become the Plan’s trustee, establishing a Sept. 2, 2006 termination date for the Plan. In settlement of its claims against Delta and its affiliates, the PBGC will be allowed a pre-petition unsecured claim against Delta of $2.2 billion, and the debtors’ proposed plan of reorganization will provide for the distribution to the PBGC of $225 million in senior unsecured notes.
 
The Bankruptcy Court previously determined that Delta could not reorganize or emerge from Chapter 11 unless the Pilot Plan was terminated.
 
As previously announced, retired Delta pilots will receive in excess of $800 million in allowed claims in respect of their lost non-qualified pension benefits. Delta’s current pilots are now covered by a defined contribution pension plan previously negotiated with the Air Line Pilots Association, the union representing Delta’s more than 6,000 current pilots.
 

 

[WorldTraveler]

I don't know where you learned math but in math in the US, we put the $ in front of the number and the % behind. If DL pilots got a $20 increase, then I can assure you that DL's other employees beat them.

But the DL pilots didn't get a $20 increase. They received 4,8,3, and 3 percent over 4 years.
 

So post the increases, all we have you're hearsay, no facts, nothing but you saying it happened.
 
Since June 20, 2012 and at the end of this year DL's pilots would have gotten nearly 20$ in a 2 1/2 year period, did any other employee groups get that high of a raise in the same 2 1/2 year period?
 
Put up or shut up, and the what is greater, a percentage of 200,000 or 40,000?

I posted 3-5% in each of the years that the pilots received their increases. Every DL employee who participates on here knows they received pay increases.

Why don't you ask Kev to deny that the increases occurred if you are convinced I am wrong.

If you truly don't understand that a percentage is a percentage, then you have no business negotiating anything for anyone.

DL employees don't expect to receive a pilot's pay raise in dollar amount on a non-pilot salary. Did your survey show that DL employees expect that?

 

[700UW]

Is the best you can do is post a typo? lol
 
And you say 3%-5%, which is it? Where are the facts?
 
You havent posted anything except hearsay.
 
Try again, you can do better.
 
They will have earned almost a 20% increase in a two and half year period, show us how any other group at Delta will receive the same almost 20% in the same time period.
 
Facts, post facts.
 
Using the extreme figure of 5%, that means non-union DL employees will only receive 10%, not 20%, facts.

 

[WorldTraveler]

How was I supposed to know it is a typo. If you are so quick to get a post off that you don't even use the right units, how do I know what other information is incorrect?

I posted the facts. You don't want to hear it. It is between 3 and 5 years in each of the years.

But the issue is that you still have some perverted idea that DL FAs are going to be motivated to compare themselves to what DL pilots make. They know what job they do. They know the reason why the pilots got a slightly larger increase in one year in return for increased scheduling flexibility and loosened scope.

When you start posting actual, comparative data for the right work groups including profit sharing and union dues, then you can be taken seriously.

But you won't do it because it doesn't show that DL employees are in a worse position and in fact compare very favorably to their peers at other airlines.

 

[700UW]

Avoidance alert.

 

[robbedagain]

So now wt is teaching you how to post the proper way huh 700! Lol! We are waiting for facts on all other employees of delta w regards to their raises like pilots.....

 

[Kev3188]

sorry, but if you want to argue that DL is free to change any term of your employment at will, then you can't argue that you earned anything and spend the pay that DL has given you - which is at or above many of your peers in the industry - while at the same time arguing that you don't have any scope protection while your peers at other airlines are being forced out of numerous small and medium sized cities and even from hubs.

You can't have it both ways, Kev. Either you have no protection and you can't enjoy what the company is giving you or you can argue that there really is not benefit to what DL provides you and refuse to accept anything they give you that is better than your peers.

You can't BOTH argue that your at will employment at DL is inferior to what other carriers offer because you have no protection while at the same time arguing that what your peers have is superior. If what you have is not superior, then accept only as much as your peers at other legacy carriers get - job reductions included.

Again, you're premise is absurd.

You're not one of those people that think a company "gives" you a paycheck, are you?

 

[WorldTraveler]

no, but employees EARN their salary at other companies too.
The notion that DL employees earn their salary while others just to go wo. rk is what is absurd.

Specific to the discussion, the notion that DL employees have no protection or benefit is validated every time you spend the money DL puts in your bank account

can you deny that DL employees have not received pay raises over the last several years when the pilots have received them. They are dying to prove me wrong and need your help.

All you have to do is tell us all that you didn't get pay raises - in addition to your profit sharing.

 

[swamt]

Still waiting for evidence that all the non-contract employees received somewhere between 3 and 5%, per year for 2.5 years as requested.  When pressured for the answer WT reverts to misspelling and punctuation, then in the very following answer from WT to 700, his grammar/spelling is incorrect.   I am beginning to wonder myself if the non-contract employees received anything too.  Usually WT and 700 is sooooo good at providing a company letter (which is exactly what Delta does) when they are about to give their employees a raise, as they like to brag, in public about how well they are once again treating their employees.  Asking other employees to confirm?  Too late, this subject has been going on for some time, and as usual, someone would have piped up by now and confirmed their 3-5% raises in said 2.5 years in question.  I will stick with my very good friends info, who I have known for well over 30 years, who IS one of the non-contractual employees of Delta and has always said the raises that Delta gives is mostly always around the times some union card drive is going on or a threat of one starting.  Now if anyone can provide company documents that show the raises were given, then I will believe so, other than that no-bueno... 

 

[WorldTraveler]

obviously you are ticked that the word is now out that WN employees were topped in their profit sharing by DL employees.

DL employees most certainly did receive pay increases. DL didn't post press releases so there is nothing published. I don't post non-public information from DL's internal website.

you are free to stick with what ever you choose to believe. The world is round whether you or anyone else wants to believe it. Pay raises were indeed given to DL's non-contract employees and they know it.

If DL is motivated to give pay raises only by card drives then they should have unions all over the place.

In the meantime, DL employees have no interest in unions or at least aren't willing to vote for them using established procedures, DL employees have topped profit sharing for 2 years in a row, and DL is not set on dismantling the farce that is the protectionistic N. Texas aviation market.

You might wanna make sure you keep some of your profit sharing in liquid investments.

 

[700UW]

No interest?

Then why are there two grassroots efforts right now?

And why did over 7,000 delta FAS take the survey?

 

[Kev3188]

Just for fun, clearly...
 
(sarcasm, of course)

 

[yoyodyne]

No interest? Then why are there two grassroots efforts right now? And why did over 7,000 delta FAS take the survey?

 
Because the IAM needs more funds?

 

[700UW]

Do you understand what grassroots efforts me?

 

[WorldTraveler]

 

No interest? Then why are there two grassroots efforts right now? And why did over 7,000 delta FAS take the survey?

you do realize that DL employees are MASTERS at yanking the company's chain about unionization efforts only to take the company's money and then tell the unions to take a hike don't you?

Just for fun, clearly...
 
(sarcasm, of course)

 
it's actually a well-oiled game in which the employees and DL both win... serious business, my friend - no games.