WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
- 21,709
- 10,662
- Banned
- #2,461
congratulations... you had to take over AA in order to get a contract for US workers.
DL isn't going to get taken over by anyone....
IAM Stepping Up campaign
- Thread starter 700UW
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DL isn't going to get taken over by anyone....
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
- 21,709
- 10,662
- Banned
- #2,463
absurd, no.
the only reason why US personnel are getting a contract is because Parker is using the revenue generating power of AA and their own BK in order to subsidize pay raises at US.
If the IAM and US mgmt. had any intention on either side of negotiating a contract, it could have been done years ago. You yourself have repeatedly blame US' current pay and benefits on BK.
what is happening at US has no influence on DL people who have been getting multiple pay and compensation raises since their merger - without the need for a union.
take your campaign of boasting to US people; they have been waiting for years for even the slightest movement in their contract.
the only reason why US personnel are getting a contract is because Parker is using the revenue generating power of AA and their own BK in order to subsidize pay raises at US.
If the IAM and US mgmt. had any intention on either side of negotiating a contract, it could have been done years ago. You yourself have repeatedly blame US' current pay and benefits on BK.
what is happening at US has no influence on DL people who have been getting multiple pay and compensation raises since their merger - without the need for a union.
take your campaign of boasting to US people; they have been waiting for years for even the slightest movement in their contract.
- Thread Starter
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- #2,464
Its quite apparent you cant back up what you stated and you clearly dont understand the Section 6 process.
And what happens at EVERY union carrier effects Delta and its employees, if you believe otherwise you are truly blinded by your hatred of organized labor and its members.
Dont fly DL anymore, those pesky pilots and dispatchers who ensure your safety are union members.
When did ACS or FAs have a say in their pay, benefits and working conditions at DL, did they negotiated the 33% cut in profit sharing or why some in ACS only got a 2% raise while others got 3%?
How come the pilots will have by the end of this years, gotten a 20% raise in a two and half year period?
And what happens at EVERY union carrier effects Delta and its employees, if you believe otherwise you are truly blinded by your hatred of organized labor and its members.
Dont fly DL anymore, those pesky pilots and dispatchers who ensure your safety are union members.
When did ACS or FAs have a say in their pay, benefits and working conditions at DL, did they negotiated the 33% cut in profit sharing or why some in ACS only got a 2% raise while others got 3%?
How come the pilots will have by the end of this years, gotten a 20% raise in a two and half year period?
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
- 21,709
- 10,662
- Banned
- #2,465
I have no problem with whether an employee is unionized or not.
I do have a problem with unions claiming they had anything to do with progress when there is far more evidence that the labor movement has stood on the sidelines while mgmt. has done what they have wanted.
The only thing certain is that you cannot prove that the IAM could have delivered this contract without AA; if they could have, they didn't.
Move on.... DL takes care of its own employees and aren't interested in you or the IAM as evidenced by the thousands of expired IAM membership cards that DL employees have.
I do have a problem with unions claiming they had anything to do with progress when there is far more evidence that the labor movement has stood on the sidelines while mgmt. has done what they have wanted.
The only thing certain is that you cannot prove that the IAM could have delivered this contract without AA; if they could have, they didn't.
Move on.... DL takes care of its own employees and aren't interested in you or the IAM as evidenced by the thousands of expired IAM membership cards that DL employees have.
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
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- #2,466
Management had to use bankruptcy laws to get what they couldnt negotiate away.
But DL can do whatever and whenever they want to ACS and FAs as long as they dont break the law.
Just burns you up inside that unions are making gains now in the industry to get back some of what was stripped away by the law, the judges and the courts.
You werent in negotiations, you dont know what could have been done or what was done, you are making things up again.
And the companies use the RLA to delay negotiations, its not something new or novel, the employees have lived it, you havent.
The only thing is certain is you havent provided one fact of what you claim.
But DL can do whatever and whenever they want to ACS and FAs as long as they dont break the law.
Just burns you up inside that unions are making gains now in the industry to get back some of what was stripped away by the law, the judges and the courts.
You werent in negotiations, you dont know what could have been done or what was done, you are making things up again.
And the companies use the RLA to delay negotiations, its not something new or novel, the employees have lived it, you havent.
The only thing is certain is you havent provided one fact of what you claim.
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
- 21,709
- 10,662
- Banned
- #2,467
AA/US have to pay their people more because DL has recorded the highest increases in compensation - including profit sharing that you want to pretend isn't real compensation yet amounted to a month's worth of pay last year - of any carrier.
DL hasn't delayed its pay raises because of the RLA.
I'm actually laughing on the inside watching you try to claim this as an IAM victory.
DL people know not only better but what is best.
They have said no to unionization efforts at least 10 times in the past 10 years.
and yet the IAM continues its campaign to try and replace the union dues it is losing because of workforce shrinkage that will come at other carriers.
DL hasn't delayed its pay raises because of the RLA.
I'm actually laughing on the inside watching you try to claim this as an IAM victory.
DL people know not only better but what is best.
They have said no to unionization efforts at least 10 times in the past 10 years.
and yet the IAM continues its campaign to try and replace the union dues it is losing because of workforce shrinkage that will come at other carriers.
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
- 21,709
- 10,662
- Banned
- #2,469
you are the one that is selling the IAM's ability to improve wages and benefits and yet they failed to do it for US employees until the merger.
You have the burden of proof and not me.
You have the burden of proof and not me.
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
- 21,709
- 10,662
- Banned
- #2,471
duh....how many years were between US existing BK and the merger? If the IAM couldn't have done it in that amount of time, I'm not sure what proof you think you will get that they could do it later.
Industry contracts are being settled because the airlines are making money and the airlines with open contracts don't want to lose it all with labor unrest.
Whether the bills can be paid with the higher labor contracts or whether there is really much in the way of increased cost or benefit from the contracts remains to be seen. All the indications are that the airlines themselves are not giving out much in the way of pay raises.... not entirely unexpected since there are now 4 massive airlines, any of which could easily argue that a strike could do harm to major portions of the country.
companies that collaborate with their employees and reward strong performance as DL does will give increased pay based on the strength of the company- and that is exactly what has happened.
given that not many posters on the AA or US threads are terribly impressed with what the IAM brought home, I guess this is a convenient place to hide.
Go out there and fact the music and put your sales campaign on here on ice.
you don't even have the support of DL employees today on here. isn't that exactly what we have come to expect?
this is your campaign and the IAM's and represents little to no interest from DL employees.
not a single DL employee has weighed in supporting whatever the IAM has done today. Not one.
Industry contracts are being settled because the airlines are making money and the airlines with open contracts don't want to lose it all with labor unrest.
Whether the bills can be paid with the higher labor contracts or whether there is really much in the way of increased cost or benefit from the contracts remains to be seen. All the indications are that the airlines themselves are not giving out much in the way of pay raises.... not entirely unexpected since there are now 4 massive airlines, any of which could easily argue that a strike could do harm to major portions of the country.
companies that collaborate with their employees and reward strong performance as DL does will give increased pay based on the strength of the company- and that is exactly what has happened.
given that not many posters on the AA or US threads are terribly impressed with what the IAM brought home, I guess this is a convenient place to hide.
Go out there and fact the music and put your sales campaign on here on ice.
you don't even have the support of DL employees today on here. isn't that exactly what we have come to expect?
this is your campaign and the IAM's and represents little to no interest from DL employees.
not a single DL employee has weighed in supporting whatever the IAM has done today. Not one.
robbedagain
Veteran
- Oct 13, 2003
- 11,125
- 2,676
US exited ch11 in 05 ratified a deal in 08 became amendable in 11 and talks began a yr earlier and got a TA this past weekend. so roughly 3 plus or minus yrs but nonetheless a TA that will be voted on. Now for DL their top pay is what? compare that to the top out for the new AA provided this TA is approved and the top out (again if its approved would be)around 23-24 an hr
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
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- #2,473
I think robbed summed it up quite well.
See he has to change the subject because he know he got caught out there with misinformation again, when will you learn WT?
So once again, where is the facts that it took a merger to get three new CBAs at PMUS, considering the same management is in place in regards to Labor Relations and Contract Negotiations.
And are you going to answer the questions poised to you?
See he has to change the subject because he know he got caught out there with misinformation again, when will you learn WT?
So once again, where is the facts that it took a merger to get three new CBAs at PMUS, considering the same management is in place in regards to Labor Relations and Contract Negotiations.
And are you going to answer the questions poised to you?
robbedagain
Veteran
- Oct 13, 2003
- 11,125
- 2,676
thanks 700 as for learning.. not sure if he learned anything like that during his tenure at DL.... 
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
- 21,709
- 10,662
- Banned
- #2,475
this is a DL forum. The only changing the subject is to focus on what DL people have instead of the tiring sales job that the IAM's salesman has to push here.
average salaries for airline personnel are not secrets and a few scale highlights don't begin to give an indication of how well employees in any workgroup actually do.
Ramp, cargo, and passenger handling personnel are lumped into the same category for DL reports.
Of the 4 legacy carriers, for 2013, DL's ramp/cargo/passenger handling personnel had the highest salaries of the 4 legacies at $47,000/y compared to $44K for AA, $39K for US, and $32K for UA.
are we surprised that the lowest paid ramp groups are represented by the IAM? not me.
The truth is simply that DL employees do better than their legacy carrier peers, all of whom have gone thru BK.
a couple percent increases at other carriers aren't going to erode the advantage DL people have.
aren't you the least bit interested in the scoreless Iran-Nigeria World Cup?
average salaries for airline personnel are not secrets and a few scale highlights don't begin to give an indication of how well employees in any workgroup actually do.
Ramp, cargo, and passenger handling personnel are lumped into the same category for DL reports.
Of the 4 legacy carriers, for 2013, DL's ramp/cargo/passenger handling personnel had the highest salaries of the 4 legacies at $47,000/y compared to $44K for AA, $39K for US, and $32K for UA.
are we surprised that the lowest paid ramp groups are represented by the IAM? not me.
The truth is simply that DL employees do better than their legacy carrier peers, all of whom have gone thru BK.
a couple percent increases at other carriers aren't going to erode the advantage DL people have.
aren't you the least bit interested in the scoreless Iran-Nigeria World Cup?
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