Feb / Mar 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Phoenix]

What POSSIBLE difference would that make? Are you a pizza eatting, former furloughed, freedom scab, scum-sucking, MDA J4J, DOH to the DEATH Eastie?

Are you really an elected rep? You seem to be losing your cool.

 

[nevergiveup]

Speaking of things that don't matter (line pilots - real or imagined- espousing views of what is fair): in the DEN workout room today I introduced myself to DAL (former NWAL) pilots. They said they "hoped that the new abitrators bent the former US Air pilots over a barrel (like they deserved). Further, they said the former US Airways pilots (let's say - DOH to the DEATH supporters) were the PARIAHS of the commercial aviation industry.

How about that. Pilots from another major airline calling a spade - a spade.

Sounds like another made up story. Keep trying!

 

[mrbreeze]

Speaking of things that don't matter (line pilots - real or imagined- espousing views of what is fair): in the DEN workout room today I introduced myself to DAL (former NWAL) pilots. They said they "hoped that the new abitrators bent the former US Air pilots over a barrel (like they deserved). Further, they said the former US Airways pilots (let's say - DOH to the DEATH supporters) were the PARIAHS of the commercial aviation industry.

How about that. Pilots from another major airline calling a spade - a spade.

I'm sure he was just taking your side to humor you and be your pal. In reality he was probably thinking just the opposite when he left the gym. Probably even told his co-workers about the fool he met in the gym, having a good laugh all the way around.

Bottom line is that other airlines couldn't care less about what we are going through. Just the way people are.


breeze

 

[cleardirect]

Of course they wouldn't put a number on it. If they did, you worsties wouldn't take the bait and send in a 98% vote for in favor.



There was a third list only because people were hired after the snapshot was taken and weren't considered by the arbitrator. Remember, by the time Nicolau came up with his abomination, there were no longer furloughees on the east.

Since then, that third list is simply present at the bottom of the east list, as they are all working.

Should USAPA treat the west furloughees like the west presented the east furloughees to Nicolau? That is, bringing nothing to the table and therefore should be stapled? Is that what you are asking? Or, would the west furloughees prefer to hit the arbitration table with their DOH?

Try and get your facts right, the east had 1700 furloughed at the snap shot. When Nicolau ruled only 300 had been called back. Did the other 1200 not get called?

Now if the T/A only allowed for that the new hires to be considered "east" pilots. Could you point out in the MOU where that is handled differently? Did the TA 9 change that?

No I think the west furloughed pilots would prefer to hit the arbitration with their NIcolau seniority.

The question should be how will usapa handle the APA furloughed pilots. Will they give them their DOH and put them senior to new hires?

 

[PullUp]

The West Furloughees are going to hit the arbitration at their position on the Nicolau award. So will you and every single other US Air pilot. USAPA doesn't have an LUP for ignoring the Nic. They know it. The Company knows it, the West damn well knows it, and the Court system knows it. Make it ripe for adjudication and find out...which your pilot group did by RATIFYING A CONTRACT. Only a fool would believe that the MOU simply erases the RLA, and USAPA's Duty to fairly represent the pilots...which they have never had any intention of doing.

AOL will be going after a Restraining order within 48 hrs of the POR and there is absolutely nothing you, your fake union, the APA or the company can do to stop it. If it derails the merger for a period of time...who cares.

Not ripe until injured. What will be the complaint for the RO? The ninth said not ripe. Denied. Next?
No LUP required now, you voted for the MOU which spells out how seniority will be determined and also states bluntly that the MOU/MTA or the new JCBA will not be a basis for changing the existing seniority lists in effect.
I don't see the coherent argument here....
Please give me your best legal reasoning as to how the nic could ever be ultilized while also complying with the clauses in the ratified MOU. And BTW, on the effective date, when the MOU kicks in, the old T/A and both old contracts and LOA's, etc. all go in the trash - so you can't use those to base your reasoning on.
Cheers.

 

[Phoenix]

Not ripe until injured. What will be the complaint for the RO? The ninth said not ripe. Denied. Next?
No LUP required now, you voted for the MOU which spells out how seniority will be determined and also states bluntly that the MOU/MTA or the new JCBA will not be a basis for changing the existing seniority lists in effect.
I don't see the coherent argument here....
Please give me your best legal reasoning as to how the nic could ever be ultilized while also complying with the clauses in the ratified MOU. And BTW, on the effective date, when the MOU kicks in, the old T/A and both old contracts and LOA's, etc. all go in the trash - so you can't use those to base your reasoning on.
Cheers.

Mr. Judge, may we refer to the ubiquitous and persuasive webposts of Nic4Us and Cleardirect? Please, please can we?

 

[EastUS1]

No I think the west furloughed pilots would prefer to hit the arbitration with their NIcolau seniority.

"would prefer"...? Well...THAT changes everything! Given that all have been offered recalls already, but declined them: That sounds a lot like a "personal problem" at this point. Good Luck!

 

[cleardirect]

Mr. Judge, may we refer to the ubiquitous and persuasive webposts of Nic4Us and Cleardirect? Please, please can we?

I would put my posts up against your posts any day.

 

[PullUp]

No I think the west furloughed pilots would prefer to hit the arbitration with their NIcolau seniority.

The question should be how will usapa handle the APA furloughed pilots. Will they give them their DOH and put them senior to new hires?

I think the west furloughed pilots are happy having a job going into this merger. Depending on how furloughed pilots are treated (ala west: no job, no status - 'cause you didn't bring anything to the merger; or ala east: you made the ultimate sacrifice for the rest of the group, you should be considered a part of the group), the west guys flying on the east list might be better with their 'east' seniority.
The west guys still on the street (by choice) could be in trouble.
How will USAPA handle the APA furloughed pilots? Well, everything is negotiable - and this is one of those good reasons to negotiate rather than let it go to arbitration. I would hope that however they are treated, all furloughees receive the same treatment with the goal being to bring them back on the property ASAP.
Cheers.

 

[EastUS1]

....with the goal being to bring them back on the property ASAP.

Agreed in full.

 

[EastUS1]

I would put my posts up against your posts any day.

No Judge anywhere, not even up to the Supreme Court level, could even possibly fail to be impressed by that!

 

[Phoenix]

No Judge anywhere, not even up to the Supreme Court level, could even possibly fail to be impressed by that!

I freely admit any judge anywhere will be impressed with his posts at least ten times more so than mine! (but then I suspect I have a better grasp of the irony of multiplying zero by an order of magnitude. ).

 

[nevergiveup]

I would put my posts up against your posts any day.

Saturation bombing!

 

[cactusboy53]

Are you really an elected rep? You seem to be losing your cool.

Oh yea.....losing control......losing cool...losing control.....Marooon.

 

[cactusboy53]

Sounds like another made up story. Keep trying!

Oh yea. You are so correct. I made the whole thing up NGU! You are rightfully supremely confident. How is it possible that a forNWA\\pilot has seen you guys for the tools that you are?? Hangman is comin' down from the gallows and you don't have very long...