Feb / Mar 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[traderjake]

You must be a really lonely person. We all know that it's all about YOU. What an ass.

Nobody can have an opinion unless it agrees with yours.

I don't need any "friends" like you.

Keep ignoring what APA and the results of the last four pilot seniority arbitrations say, we'll see how much more money your kind costs us.

 

[EastUS1]

"That is basically promising to break the law."...? Really? Which law would that be?

I'll give you a hint, it's also one of the ten commandments

Bean

In the bluntest possible terms then, while we're going all sanctimonious here with the Ten Commandments; you're just lying about usapa "promising to break the law", and must now in defense (as usual with your supposed "knights") just pretend towards some farcical fantasy of moral superiority? Did you miss the one about: "Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour."...? How about: "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's."...? Sigh!...I guess at least thy neighbor's attrition should be up for grabs though...?...And certainly thy neighbor's widebody aircraft, which thou didst never "bring" to anything anywhere...?

Ah heck. What do I know of morality or sacrifice? I've never so much as fought to the death alongside Leonidas at Thermopylae, or ever even been a "knight"...much less a "Dire Wolf".

 

[Pi brat]

Just remember, some of the APA pilots are just as friendly. I can think of one union meeting where two pilots went at it in a conference room, one guy ended up with a Justin boot print on his face. Those two are probally retired now, but they have their share of friendly people.

Bean

Didn't a certain beloved west captain get a smack down at a union meeting? And by a westie, not an eastie. ;-)

 

[Bill Brasky]

I don't need any "friends" like you.

Keep ignoring what APA and the results of the last four pilot seniority arbitrations say, we'll see how much more money your kind costs us.

Sorry, ahole. To me, doing the right thing is ALWAYS more important than the money. Like I said, you are one lonely guy.


Oh, and calling you an "ahole" is the right thing.

 

[Beancounter]

Dude, I'm right where I intend to stay. I can't make any more money than I'm already making. It's the west scabbies that want a lottery ticket. I'm not going anywhere.

Your Nic dream is dead and gone.

I didn't come up with the list and sorry, but it didn't go anywhere yet. My apologies for thinking you were one of the furloughed guys trying to grab an upgrade.

Bean

 

[Beancounter]

While you "brought" exactly what, other than yourself? What possible value can you assert that holds, other than that which was previously established through your work performed and your, gasp! DOH/longevity? Please spare us all any nonsensical rants about "expectations" here.

Rant about, "expectations?" Dude, it was in the friggin' merger policy. You know, the one we had to use because we were in the same union. Any of this ring a bell? You guys are unbelievable.

Bean

 

[Beancounter]

"That is basically promising to break the law."...? Really? Which law would that be?



In the bluntest possible terms then, while we're going all sanctimonious here with the Ten Commandments; you're just lying about usapa "promising to break the law", and must now in defense (as usual with your supposed "knights") just pretend towards some farcical fantasy of moral superiority? Did you miss the one about: "Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour."...? How about: "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's."...? Sigh!...I guess at least thy neighbor's attrition should be up for grabs though...?...And certainly thy neighbor's widebody aircraft, which thou didst never "bring" to anything anywhere...?

Ah heck. What do I know of morality or sacrifice? I've never so much as fought to the death alongside Leonidas at Thermopylae, or ever even been a "knight"...much less a "Dire Wolf".

My bad, I thought, "Thou shalt not taketh thy neighbors seniority," was one of them Twas meant as a joke (opps, that's the Kings old english).

Bean

 

[Beancounter]

Didn't a certain beloved west captain get a smack down at a union meeting? And by a westie, not an eastie. ;-)

Hey, what can I say, we have them over here too.

Bean

 

[end_of_alpa]

I don't need any "friends" like you.

Keep ignoring what APA and the results of the last four pilot seniority arbitrations say, we'll see how much more money your kind costs us.

You keep stating the same ole mantra of "the last four pilot seniority arbitrations" like it was some sort of maxim.

But the real fact is that IF it goes to arbitration, there is a gret risk that APA coud have ratio go against THEM! What makes YOU think USAPA is going to advocate DOH in front of he arbitrators?

 

[EastUS1]

Twas meant as a joke (opps, that's the Kings old english).

It's all good Bean. About all any of this amounts to nowadays is pure grins and mutual amusement, and naturally; the continuance of years of habitually exchanged "Nyaah, Nyaahs." The MOU vote's cast. Whatever's to be from that point forward, will be.

 

[cleardirect]

The conclusion I make is not that DOH was the problem, but rather the length of the fences. The least disruptive merger I've been a party to on this property was the PSA/USAir merger, which went straight DOH. The next was the PI/U merger, same thing. No operational issues whatsoever, except, of course, the seriously bad management of the company as a whole. The problem is when one of the groups is rewarded with a sense of entitlement by the arbitrator, either with fences or method of merge. Everyone on both sides of the merger worked hard to get where they are, and giving one group an advantage over the other for some percieved "career expectations", which we all by now realize are a farce, is what causes the problems.

There are some APA folks screaming that DOH is unfair, but what would they say if this were to go to an arbitrator that ruled that since they were acquired during a bankruptcy proceeding that they had less "career expectations" than the other group? I'm not saying that is what will happen, but we all know that it could. They would be screaming for DOH in that case.

There is only one real way to combine groups that will provide a fair, honest and understandable merge, and that is some kind of formula based on DOH or LOS with fences of short length (like, 5 years or less) to allow the operation to stabilize. They should get full credit for their contributions to the company, and we should get full credit for ours. The attrition we bring makes up for any perceived issue of more senior employees.

Keep banging that drum. Maybe someone will believe you. DOH will not work.

DOH is bad for APA pilots end of story. There is no way that an arbitrator could come up with a worse seniority list than using DOH. Take a look at the lists and tell me if an arbitrator would put 85% of the east in the top 50% of the combined list even if he thought because the APA had less career expectations?

In your tiny limited mind there may be only one method to integrate. The rest of the world does not see it that way. Ask Roland WIlder what he thinks.

 

[cleardirect]

Dude, I'm right where I intend to stay. I can't make any more money than I'm already making. It's the west scabbies that want a lottery ticket. I'm not going anywhere.

Your Nic dream is dead and gone.

If that were true why spend money trying and failing to expedite the ninth.

Why file another law suit in new york against Leonidas? If it is dead and gone why all the pain from usapa?

 

[cleardirect]

Rant about, "expectations?" Dude, it was in the friggin' merger policy. You know, the one we had to use because we were in the same union. Any of this ring a bell? You guys are unbelievable.

Bean

Career expectations must have some validity. It is even mentioned in the usapa C&BL.

 

[EastUS1]

In your tiny limited mind there may be only one method to integrate.

A' la "The Nic is it!" for example?

 

[cleardirect]

You keep stating the same ole mantra of "the last four pilot seniority arbitrations" like it was some sort of maxim.

But the real fact is that IF it goes to arbitration, there is a gret risk that APA coud have ratio go against THEM! What makes YOU think USAPA is going to advocate DOH in front of he arbitrators?

History!

You east guys could not get out of the way of DOH last time. This time it is in the C&BL. Are you saying usapa will violate their constitution?

How pray tell would ratios go against the APA? They have more WB, NB and pilots. Are you using some sort of usapa calculator?