ATTENTION RESERVE FLIGHT ATTENDANTS (and BH's too...)

[beachboy]

Oh Itestwell please, a decent contract should have not be sold to anyone! A good contract will sell itself. Here we have this MEC trying it's hardest to sell us away from 20 years of past practice. Has AFA done any staffing model projections on these 28 hour hard time 4 days? Lay it all on the table guys so we know just how many people we are throwing under the bus. This is a non concession contract and here we are in the position of negotiating efficiencies and less people....THAT my dear is a concession Period. Hard choices may have to be made and JR people thrown under the bus but let never say well "we didn't know"

 

[Itestwell]

Oh Itestwell please, a decent contract should have not be sold to anyone! A good contract will sell itself. Here we have this MEC trying it's hardest to sell us away from 20 years of past practice. Has AFA done any staffing model projections on these 28 hour hard time 4 days? Lay it all on the table guys so we know just how many people we are throwing under the bus. This is a non concession contract and here we are in the position of negotiating efficiencies and less people....THAT my dear is a concession Period. Hard choices may have to be made and JR people thrown under the bus but let never say well "we didn't know"

That's just it! The MEC has not even agreed to split from the pilots! And all you can do on here is shoot it down and call me stupid, while you have zero information. None. We know nothing about what we would be offered, or how we would be protected. MF did send out an E line about what they would demand similar to the pilots (same hotels/ rest requirements/ minimum day/ etc..), but really, we know NOTHING. This blog is just typical of what you read on here: They're out to get us, we are being sold down the river by both Tempe and AFA, and life as we know it will end. Fear mongering. You are speculating, just as I am. If done properly, we can split from the pilots and enjoy a productive career where we are not tied to the Company for ~28 days, after working our days off on the ETB to pay the bills. What other airline does that????

Give the MEC a chance, because frankly, "dear", it's your only chance. I ask you again, beach boy, are you mentally and financially prepared to sit on this reserve system until ~2015?

 

[Travelpro72]

If AFA can negotiate a deal that has our rear ends covered I'm all for splitting. NOBODY on here has any solutions which could be brought to our negotiators attention that would allow us to stay with the pilots yet ratify a contract. HOW on earth are we to complete our contract without the pilots completing theirs? I'll listen to the crickets as I wait. Hell I'm a nonproductive reserve.......I guess I have all the time in the world to wait.

 

[VAflyGal]

Wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!
*snivel*
Wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!
*whimper*
Wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!

There. I feel better now. Hope the mods don't hate on my post.

 

[flybynite]

If you are a reserve, you may not get these trips or it will be a split and you're right back to square one. No rig.

How about a higher minimum guarantee...like 83 hrs such as CAL? That would be a much bigger help than throwing the pilot's FAR's under the bus.

How about going back to a seniority based reserve system like most of the carriers?

That makes more sense to me and if I was on reserve that's what I'd be pushing for.

 

[HottootrotNyc]

Are you not listening? We had min days of 5 hours and have had decent rips rigs! Those trips paid 28 hours but we didn't fly 28 hours! You are failing to grasp simple math. If someone is actually flying all those hours now working like a pack mule, you don't need as many people.

No apparently you don't get it! I would rather fly HARD TIME then sit around and wait for duty rigs to kick in on long layovers! I guess the way we work it is the more productive, the more we have. Our fleet is slightly larger then US Airways and we have probably double the amount of F/A's. How bout you set staffing level's so the company can't cut because of a more productive contract. I have never seen an airline so stuck in a regional past.

 

[HottootrotNyc]

That's just it! The MEC has not even agreed to split from the pilots! And all you can do on here is shoot it down and call me stupid, while you have zero information. None. We know nothing about what we would be offered, or how we would be protected. MF did send out an E line about what they would demand similar to the pilots (same hotels/ rest requirements/ minimum day/ etc..), but really, we know NOTHING. This blog is just typical of what you read on here: They're out to get us, we are being sold down the river by both Tempe and AFA, and life as we know it will end. Fear mongering. You are speculating, just as I am. If done properly, we can split from the pilots and enjoy a productive career where we are not tied to the Company for ~28 days, after working our days off on the ETB to pay the bills. What other airline does that????

Give the MEC a chance, because frankly, "dear", it's your only chance. I ask you again, beach boy, are you mentally and financially prepared to sit on this reserve system until ~2015?

Your airline needs more people like YOU! People willing to work and not sit around on two 25 hour layovers on a 4-day. We just moved from having the Pilot's stay with the f/a's on the 737 a little over a year ago. Both pilot and f/a trips became even more productive then they already are. No one WAS LAID OFF, we actually hired 3 more classes a few months after. So this whole putting tons of people on the street is bull, simple fact, we would have people on the street and we don't. We offered less leaves actually for this fall with more productive trips then last fall, 700 compaired to 850, from a company of almost 10,000 f/a's.

 

[Travelpro72]

If you are a reserve, you may not get these trips or it will be a split and you're right back to square one. No rig.

How about a higher minimum guarantee...like 83 hrs such as CAL? That would be a much bigger help than throwing the pilot's FAR's under the bus.

How about going back to a seniority based reserve system like most of the carriers?

That makes more sense to me and if I was on reserve that's what I'd be pushing for.

Ok now that someone brought some ideas out in the open, how do we implement them into a contract that will never be? A contract for flight attendants will never see the light of day until the pilots iron theirs out. So because they have a serious debacle going on we the flight attendant group should suffer and wait? Even if we waited for the east contract to expire we STILL couldn't do anything once we came to the "me-too" items until the pilots finished their negotiating. It's pointless.....we gotta split and negotiate the provisions to cover areas that worry many flight attendants about going our own way.

 

[flybynite]

Where's that 4 day with two 25 hr layovers? I've not seen that one.


CAL's contract isn't too much different than our old one that got shredded into confetti during the last bankruptcy. Other than the crews flying together.

However, if I'm not mistaken the f/a's only have 1 for 4 rig. While we have 1 for 3.5, 1 for 2 and variable minimum rig. They can be pushed up to 16 hr. duty days on domestic. Not US. Their reserves get 83 hrs min. and seniority based unless that's changed but they do things differently too.

But that's what they signed and if they're happy with it, more power to them.

As for me, you can keep your 16 hr duty days and 1 for 4 rig.

No thanks.

 

[HottootrotNyc]

Where's that 4 day with two 25 hr layovers? I've not seen that one.


CAL's contract isn't too much different than our old one that got shredded into confetti during the last bankruptcy. Other than the crews flying together.

However, if I'm not mistaken the f/a's only have 1 for 4 rig. While we have 1 for 3.5, 1 for 2 and variable minimum rig. They can be pushed up to 16 hr. duty days on domestic. Not US. Their reserves get 83 hrs min. and seniority based unless that's changed but they do things differently too.

But that's what they signed and if they're happy with it, more power to them.

As for me, you can keep your 16 hr duty days and 1 for 4 rig.

No thanks.

Actually we can't be scheduled to 16 hours, in fact we can't even be scheduled 14 hours with out a specific rest provisions for both line holder and reserves going into effect. The only time we are on duty for 16 hours or more is trips that take that long to fly such as HKG, NRT, and so on. Other then that it has to be a pure weather related and can't take off if we are going to go over 16 hours. So in all reality, it rarely happens. Then again, I would rather get myself and the passengers to where they have to go and gain extra rest that night.

So in the end you can keep most of your rigs, the only one I want back is our minimum day pay and the one I want to keep is, our layovers over 26 hours, you start getting flight pay for every 4 hours that passes there after. I would rather work HARD TIME. Actually that's what I'll be doing tomorrow, a 26 hour 4-day with layovers no less then 15:33 and no more then 2 legs a day.... HARD TIME BABY!

 

[Itestwell]

If you are a reserve, you may not get these trips or it will be a split and you're right back to square one. No rig.

How about a higher minimum guarantee...like 83 hrs such as CAL? That would be a much bigger help than throwing the pilot's FAR's under the bus.

How about going back to a seniority based reserve system like most of the carriers?

That makes more sense to me and if I was on reserve that's what I'd be pushing for.

Well, I would like to think that, someday, I will be off of reserve, and have ample high time, productive trips available to me. Which is why I don't really understand why you, a 90 hour "hard time" flyer, can't wrap your head around the benefits of higher time, more productive trips. Don't you find yourself, as a BH, flying more days to get those 90 hours than in the past???

 

[flybynite]

Well, I would like to think that, someday, I will be off of reserve, and have ample high time, productive trips available to me. Which is why I don't really understand why you, a 90 hour "hard time" flyer, can't wrap your head around the benefits of higher time, more productive trips. Don't you find yourself, as a BH, flying more days to get those 90 hours than in the past???

I am not trying to slam my time in. I pace myself throughout the month. I am happier and more rested. I am a better flight attendant and a better wife because of this.

I don't want to be the walking dead. Being a zombie is not my idea of a full life. I don't want to come home so bone tired I can hardly speak to my family. That's not right.

I want you off reserve too. The system that's in place now is foul and demonic. That needs correcting more than any one thing in the contract. You have no quality of life. I can manage. LTO has to go the way of the Edsel. Gone... never to come back.

 

[Itestwell]

I am not trying to slam my time in. I pace myself throughout the month. I am happier and more rested. I am a better flight attendant and a better wife because of this.

I don't want to be the walking dead. Being a zombie is not my idea of a full life. I don't want to come home so bone tired I can hardly speak to my family. That's not right.

I want you off reserve too. The system that's in place now is foul and demonic. That needs correcting more than any one thing in the contract. You have no quality of life. I can manage. LTO has to go the way of the Edsel. Gone... never to come back.

Who is asking you to slam your time in? Space trips out all you want; would you not prefer a 26 hour 4 day over a 19 hour 4 day? Hard time, who cares? With 15-17 hour layovers? More than enough rest. USAir flight attendants think this is some new concept to the industry, and they will melt or something! AA and UA flight attendants are simply walking around like the walking dead, right? Please, the trips I am talking about here are so damn senior at other airlines, it's ridiculous!

This is not about me being off of reserve at all; make no mistake. Please don't turn it into that. I see the capacity reductions and general disarray that USAir has gone thru in the past 10 years; I am not placing blame, nor am I shocked that I am still on reserve. This is about improving our quality of life, both RSV and BH. I am tired of flying 20 hour 4 days, 14 hour 3 days, and the like. While I would not mind productive trips on RSV to get me to my guarantee quicker, I am really thinking about my future. It may be years down the road, but one day, I may hold a line.

Why is it that we cannot negotiate protections in a contract and enjoy much more productive trips, without the pilots? You're idea that you would be a better wife and not "bone tired" does not make any sense.

 

[beachboy]

I get it way more than you think. Do what you guys want to do. Don't say you were not warned. I am all for separating from the pilots but here we still have the AIL in the last proposal! They are not serious about scrapping the entire system from the top down.
I really don't give two rats rears about flying with the pilots. I just have no interest in flying a 28 hour hard time 4 day or planning on an LAX layover only to end up in BUF during a snowstorm. NONE. I live in base not because Philadelphia is a beautiful city but because I choose not to commute and do decent trips. For now I am just going to step back and watch everyone travel down a very tricky slope. You people think your MEC can deliver all these protections and rigs your talking about? Sweat dear delusional Flight Attendants....
Sad very very sad. They are selling you a bag of IF's MAYBEE'S and THEORIDICALS.

 

[Itestwell]

I get it way more than you think. Do what you guys want to do. Don't say you were not warned. I am all for separating from the pilots but here we still have the AIL in the last proposal! They are not serious about scrapping the entire system from the top down.
I really don't give two rats rears about flying with the pilots. I just have no interest in flying a 28 hour hard time 4 day or planning on an LAX layover only to end up in BUF during a snowstorm. NONE. I live in base not because Philadelphia is a beautiful city but because I choose not to commute and do decent trips. For now I am just going to step back and watch everyone travel down a very tricky slope. You people think your MEC can deliver all these protections and rigs your talking about? Sweat dear delusional Flight Attendants....
Sad very very sad. They are selling you a bag of IF's MAYBEE'S and THEORIDICALS.

Still haven't answered my question, though:

Are you 100% content with sitting under this current contract until ~2015 so you can have the "protections" of the pilots? As much as you think that our MEC is a joke, you are sure that they cannot come up with something more solid and productive and financially beneficial than this POS contract we now have? From your posts on here, I am pretty sure you have a good idea of what's transpiring between the pilots from East and West, so are you content with living under this contract until pilots ratify? Truthfully, that will not be happening for years. You know it as well as I.

Also, if you live in base, wouldn't 28 hour 4 days be even more beneficial, allowing you more quality time at home? :blink: Again, makes no sense, unless you can't stand being at home. And, I am sure that under this current contract, you have ended up in a different layover, with plans ruined, during a snowstorm.

Every post you sprinkle with "dear" "sweet" flight attendants, leads me to think you are patronizing us, and your posts never really have any real hard facts or info to make me think that we should absolutely stay with the pilots.