AA and Labor Negotiations-2020

[ATD]

Who cares of what Samuelson thinks of this contract.
he is a piece of S---, vote yes sign a card..

 

[swamt]

In Fleet, it's about 80% IAM.

One of the biggest reasons the mechanics need to get the "F" out. My Lord, I had no clue the division was so far off. That's a Fleet union.

 

[swamt]

why would it take another year or 2??

the money is there. reshuffle it.

move the toggle switch from point iam to between point iam and point twu.

Typical average timeframe after a no vote. Our Pilots, F/A's and us mechanics all took 1 more year after first offer voted down.

that's all the money right there.

you acknowledge a gap at the moment.

there should be no gap at all.

That's not all the money. That just what the asso. wants you to believe so they don't have to go back in there and fight for more.

Once they (TWU Members) see the language there will be a change of heart. Don't think most are prepared for all the IAM language they'll see.

Welcome to T/A day!

I think they will sooner rather then later

Welcome to T/A day!

 

[CremaDiLimone]

That's not all the money. That just what the asso. wants you to believe so they don't have to go back in there and fight for more.

it is all the money. he is acknowledging a gap, a compensatory disparity.

that's my feeling and why i will vote no.

there is no assoc. there is iam and twu. the iam is happy, the twu is ok with this. when voters close to the twu are already out there backing this AIP, i know they were told to do so. no chance the twu is objecting to anything.

 

[AANOTOK]

complain to our union? our union is with this program. when intelligent people with twu connections are backing this AIP for selfish reasons, i know the twu is ok with this AIP. no use complaining there.

many with my seniority are terrified of scope and will vote 'yes' if there are no major scope changes. they are terrified of having to do work. this is the company's fault...this company is broken. some people walking around doing nothing all day, in front of mngt. they would take a $1 pay cut and give it to lus to continue with scams.

so, if laa scammers and the twu are all ok with lus assoc. members walking away with more, not much anyone can do.

only way is if the cs policy change is so drastic that will be the catalyst for a 'no' vote.

Not sure what ours will look like, but this is the MLS/Stores T/A on the CS Swap:

Rights: Contractual swapping rights; Discipline for Violations: Warnings instead of immediate suspensions; Swap Limit: 32 swaps per quarter; Enhanced Flexibility: Half-day swaps permitted; Enhanced Flexibility: DAT/COMP swaps permitted; Enhanced Flexibility: Premium/Basic swaps permitted.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

aanotok - what i've learned through the years about ot, CS policy and sk PPC and what is currently going on with pax service:

the rules are not for everyone. the scammers know who to grease with a coffee, a smile & a backslap. mngt always has the final say and have bent the rules and going forward - probably will bend the rules for certain people.

company is broken. who thrives in chaos? the scammers.

 

[AANOTOK]

Once they (TWU Members) see the language there will be a change of heart. Don't think most are prepared for all the IAM language they'll see.

NYer, I'm not sure what you are revering to, but I have no doubt you are correct. I have been told that bids, will be worse because seniority is not always followed 100%...I have also heard that the way we do bids (bid specific jobs and work areas) under the new contract managment will have more As Assigned shifts therefore having more control over who goes where. One other thing is management will play a bigger role in the overall bid...have no clue if this is true but it does sound like compared to what AA is use to, those who do not like to work but watch others do so will have a more difficult time doing so. Just some things folks were discussing.

 

[1AA]

You have to be a complete idiot to vote no to this TA and then say bring in AMFA and continue losing money for a undetermined amount of time. I am all for switching to AMFA. But to continue losing money would make us the laughing stock of the Aviation World.

How can you make up your mind on voting YES when you haven't seen the full proposal yet? You have to be an idiot to vote on anything without knowing what you are voting on.
Educated members will read the full text before finalizing their decision on how to vote. Suggesting that we should all vote YES at this point is irresponsible and shooting from the hip. Isn't that what Nancy Pelosi said about ObamaCare? Just vote it in and we'll look at the details later. (Paraphrasing)

We need to remove the Association but saying just vote Yes and then vote in AMFA has no relevance.

The card drive is moving along in a positive direction. The T/A is not a positive one or better yet a ILC.
You just can't compare the two or tie them together as a package deal.

More than likely the T/A will pass.
Word from the floor is the association is pushing for a YES vote. Not surprising. At least read the entire proposal before telling others how to vote.

 

[V.O. Reason]

Look we heard that exact same reasoning at SWA about our first offer too. But after the road shows and the economist explaining in detail what we were missing out on and how it could get done and us made whole again, then we all became super united and fought for the full retro, correct Snap up, and 3% for outgoing years (all of them) as they were trying to duck out of paying us for 2 of the outgoing years. AND we were also made whole in 401K and PS as well as compounded interest and increases on yearly increases. Therefore, we were actually made whole. Yes we were without our money up front, but we did what we were missing in the end. So to say that you will keep losing money is somewhat correct, but just for now, as long as this asso. and the membership can get united enough to pull it off. Now, UNFORTUNATELY, I am not too sure this can happen with all these (7?) groups within the same contract and is the #1 reason why the mechanic and related needs to get their own C&C union. This way the focus can and will be on the mechanic and related and that's it. Let the industrial unions keep representing the other 6 groups at AA. Then you guys would be able to 100% unite and be strong to hold out for being made whole in the end. Right now too much focus is on the IAM boys, and the Fleet boys. It's time to get a union in there to solely focus on mechanics and related and all issues that affect them only. This IS exactly why the PIlots and F/A's have done it in the past.
BTW; I think this asso. screwed you mechanics and related over the outstanding suit at hand by not even fighting for "full retro" and the correct bonus to help offset that suit cost. So not 100% satisfied if it can get done with your current issues and why I will still support either a No vote and vote AMFA in, as well as a Yes vote and still vote AMFA in. I do understand why some are saying both.

The Association is recommending a yes vote , did you get that in your meetings?
I don’t see this being voted down it would be a huge waste of time

 

[CremaDiLimone]

NYer, I'm not sure what you are revering to, but I have no doubt you are correct. I have been told that bids, will be worse because seniority is not always followed 100%...I have also heard that the way we do bids (bid specific jobs and work areas) under the new contract managment will have more As Assigned shifts therefore having more control over who goes where. One other thing is management will play a bigger role in the overall bid...have no clue if this is true but it does sound like compared to what AA is use to, those who do not like to work but watch others do so will have a more difficult time doing so. Just some things folks were discussing.

something like this would definitely get 'no' votes. sounds like another operational flop from lus mngt.

700 clerks will line up at the manning office to get their daily assignment. right.

 

[AANOTOK]

something like this would definitely get 'no' votes. sounds like another operational flop from lus mngt.

700 clerks will line up at the manning office to get their daily assignment. right.

Could be just a rumor...don't know

 

[1AA]

The Association is recommending a yes vote , did you get that in your meetings?
I don’t see this being voted down it would be a huge waste of time

So was the last four years of negotiations. All we got out of it was a better balance of articles for both sides. Still plenty of TWU and IAM specific articles. Not a JCBA in a long shot. They could have streamlined the agreement without wasting four years of lost compensation.

 

[1AA]

something like this would definitely get 'no' votes. sounds like another operational flop from lus mngt.

700 clerks will line up at the manning office to get their daily assignment. right.

Only if they read the full proposal you might wake up some members. Most won't and vote Yes because they listen to what the leaders are telling them. That's the way it's been for years. Won't change with this one. I would be very surprised if any one group turns it down.

 

[scorpion 2]

Who cares of what Samuelson thinks of this contract.
he is a piece of S---, vote yes sign a card..

So give us the details of this ILC if it’s so great. Besides the “time share” sales pitch to get your wallet out what’s in it???
I’m a no vote without retro. The bullet points won’t overturn that. If there are some fantastic perks built into the body of this thing to change my opinion to yes I’m willing to listen though.
Like a poster quoted Pelosi earlier, “we have to vote for it so we can see what’s in it”. Bullshit.

 

[ALUS78]

Not sure what ours will look like, but this is the MLS/Stores T/A on the CS Swap:

Rights: Contractual swapping rights; Discipline for Violations: Warnings instead of immediate suspensions; Swap Limit: 32 swaps per quarter; Enhanced Flexibility: Half-day swaps permitted; Enhanced Flexibility: DAT/COMP swaps permitted; Enhanced Flexibility: Premium/Basic swaps permitted.

Local managers can give extra swaps if needed