2009 Flight Attendant Attrition

[jimntx]

May, 2009 Year-to-date:
Dom----------17------649
Intl------------11-------76
Total----------28------725
Retirees -----19--------72

Though the monthly total was down from previous months (not counting the big spike from the furloughs in April), note that the retirements as a percentage of the monthly total are way up. 68% of the monthly attrition was retirements. Does this signify anything? Probably not. Just an interesting factoid.

 

[eolesen]

My guess, and it's only a guess, you're seeing the effect of best 3 of 10 years. Either Jan 1999 - Dec 2002 or May 2000 - April 2003 (not sure if it's calculated on retirement month or calendar year) will wind up being the best years for a lot of FA's.

Whatever additional they accrue towards their pension in the next six months probably won't make much of a difference, and it's unlikely there's going to be a contract by the end of the year with a retro check (if there's a retro at all), so they might as well retire now and get the best part of the summer off.

 

[jimntx]

May, 2009 Year-to-date:
Dom----------17------649
Intl------------11-------76
Total----------28------725
Retirees -----19--------72

Though the monthly total was down from previous months (not counting the big spike from the furloughs in April), note that the retirements as a percentage of the monthly total are way up. 68% of the monthly attrition was retirements. Does this signify anything? Probably not. Just an interesting factoid.

Update:
May, 2009 Year-to-date:
Dom----------18------650
Intl------------25-------90
Total----------43------740
Retirees -----19--------72


Additional 15 attrition-1 domestic, 14 International. None were retirees.

 

[FA Mikey]

Whatever additional they accrue towards their pension in the next six months probably won't make much of a difference, and it's unlikely there's going to be a contract by the end of the year with a retro check (if there's a retro at all), so they might as well retire now and get the best part of the summer off.

Its time some people wake up and realize, its obviously not about the money. For a lot of SR people I am friends with, They come to work to be with their other friends, their other family, their social network. Its as much about doing their thing in London as well as sometimes doing absolutely nothing at all. Some people retire and joins groups and clubs, some of the people I know have made there own right here and are enjoying their lives just the way they are.

 

[Skymess]

Its time some people wake up and realize, its obviously not about the money. For a lot of SR people I am friends with, They come to work to be with their other friends, their other family, their social network. Its as much about doing their thing in London as well as sometimes doing absolutely nothing at all. Some people retire and joins groups and clubs, some of the people I know have made there own right here and are enjoying their lives just the way they are.

I agree. A friend and I were talking yesterday and we said that when some of those people retire and the groups are left flying with strangers, or junior people they have nothing in common with, we'll see some movement.

 

[eolesen]

They might not be working for the money, but I do think most people would pay attention to what they stand to earn for the rest of their live in terms of a pension...

 

[FA Mikey]

The pension is only a 1/3 of what they will earn. Another 1/3 is social security and another 1/3 is their 401k or IRA. Since most are also married, they are a 2 income family, with the FA income not usually the larger of the two. The amount that will be gained or lost in the best of 10 is incremental compared to value they put on the lifestyle and friendships and traveling.

The best of 10 will be of more importance to the people who started in the 80's and beyond. These are the people I worked with, who were more head of household or two income airline families. But again they are also have a 401k and IRA's which will make a larger more important part of their retirement.

 

[nbmcg01]

I got a clarification this morning from HDQ.

1. The 323 01APR furloughees are included in the total. AMR does not consider furloughed f/as as employees despite the fact that they are eligible for recall. If you ain't on this month's payroll, you ain't an employee.
2. They stand by the exceptionally high number for April. They had 237 already furloughed f/as take the vacation separation package. (I find it interesting that f/as who have been on furlough since 02JUL04 are counted in the attrition, but f/as furloughed 01APR09 are not counted as employees. Evidently, you can have your cake and eat it too. But, I decided not to debate the point further.)

Of course, the numbers still don't quite add up. 323+237+10 (retirees), the total is 570 which is the number my correspondent from HDQ is using. However, if you subtract the last YTD total posted in March from the current YTD total, the difference is 587. Oh well. Close enough for government work as they used to say.

Interesting since this is the opposite position taken with the pilots. Also, how can you be on a recall list if you're not an employee? How can one retain voting and office holding rights if not considered an employee. There is a BIG diffference in being an ACTIVE employee vs furloughed. This could also be a individual interpretation from one HR employee vs fact. They don't have a well known reputation for correct information.

 

[L1011Ret]

Interesting since this is the opposite position taken with the pilots. Also, how can you be on a recall list if you're not an employee? How can one retain voting and office holding rights if not considered an employee. There is a BIG diffference in being an ACTIVE employee vs furloughed. This could also be a individual interpretation from one HR employee vs fact. They don't have a well known reputation for correct information.

Yes, furloughed pilots are still employees while furloughed F/As are not? Strange...

 

[twaokc]

AA is strange in more ways than one!!!!!!!!!!

 

[jimntx]

Interesting since this is the opposite position taken with the pilots. Also, how can you be on a recall list if you're not an employee? How can one retain voting and office holding rights if not considered an employee. There is a BIG diffference in being an ACTIVE employee vs furloughed. This could also be a individual interpretation from one HR employee vs fact. They don't have a well known reputation for correct information.

Actually, I doubt it was an HR employee. I think it was just whoever on Flight Service staff at Centreport is responsible for updating that page on the Flight Service website. I got the impression that even though a furloughed flight attendant has recall rights, they are not drawing a salary, accruing vacation or pension credit, nor are they eligible for any benefits other than COBRA, nor is there any guarantee that they will ever be recalled; therefore, they are not an employee as far as Flight Service is concerned. Here again, I think it rather odd, that a furloughee is not an employee, but someone who retires from furlough is counted in the retiree statistics.

Oh well. As Kipling said, "Ours not to reason why. Our just to do or die."

 

[sunnywind7]

<< jimntx: "I got the impression that even though a furloughed flight attendant has recall rights, they are not drawing a salary, accruing vacation or pension credit, nor are they eligible for any benefits other than COBRA, nor is there any guarantee that they will ever be recalled;">>

jimntx, AA furloughed F/A's DO HAVE BENEFITS other than COBRA. They have travel pass privileges for 18 mo., & up to 24 mo. if no missed trip occurances 90 days prior to furlough. They aslo ACCRUE Occupational Sr. (not Co. Sr.)
Regarding APFA - if dues current can vote &/or hold office with APFA, with their qualifying Base being the one that they were furloughed from.

 

[jimntx]

jimntx, AA furloughed F/A's DO HAVE BENEFITS other than COBRA. They have travel pass privileges for 18 mo., & up to 24 mo. if no missed trip occurances 90 days prior to furlough. They aslo ACCRUE Occupational Sr. (not Co. Sr.)
Regarding APFA - if dues current can vote &/or hold office with APFA, with their qualifying Base being the one that they were furloughed from.

First off, I was referring to the company's attitude. As far as those wonderful benefits you mention...

Have you tried to non-rev lately? I was trying to make 10 years on the payroll in order to have retiree travel benefits, but I realized that with the capacity cuts it's becoming almost impossible for active employees to nonrev.

Oh gee, the right to vote in APFA! I'd almost forgotten that fabulous benefit. The union that is not interested in protecting the jobs of junior flight attendants. And, if the union doesn't like the outcome of the vote (say for instance, they want a YES vote on concessions), they just reopen the voting and allow Nos to change to Yes, but not allow Yes votes to change to NO. Democracy in action.

 

[jimntx]

Update:
May, 2009 Year-to-date:
Dom----------18------650
Intl------------25-------90
Total----------43------740
Retirees -----19--------72


Additional 15 attrition-1 domestic, 14 International. None were retirees.

June, 2009 Year-to-date:
Dom----------17------667
Intl------------28------118
Total----------45------785
Retirees -----24--------96

Avg. monthly attrition is 131/mo, but don't forget that Flight Service is including the 323 furloughed in April in the attrition numbers. If you remove them from the total, the avg attrition is 77/mo.

 

[ArtTang]

June, 2009 Year-to-date:
Dom----------17------667
Intl------------28------118
Total----------45------785
Retirees -----24--------96

Avg. monthly attrition is 131/mo, but don't forget that Flight Service is including the 323 furloughed in April in the attrition numbers. If you remove them from the total, the avg attrition is 77/mo.

As always, thanks for the information, Jim. When I checked the seniority range of the retiring F/As, I was pleasantly surprised to see that more than a handful of those with 25 + years retired in June. This is much better than what we have seen over the past 6 months.