US Pilots Labor Discussion 7/13- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[767jetz]

Art, look at where he works, and the number of posts. It is ALL about the fact we bolted from his "association". He can't handle it and STALKS us with every waking moment.

If we even dared step into his airline "territory" he reports it to try and stifle it, yet he pretty much lives here, yet really knows nothing about the reality of THIS airline.


Typical of the poster and his attempt to spin it.

He used to also constantly ask "when is the damages trial starting?"

Another bitter rant by someone who can't stand disagreement or opposing opinions and points of view.

I guess I will just respond to the parts that are flat out lies. The rest speaks for itself, and I doubt you'll find sympathy from any reasonable or moderate person out there.

I couldn't care less that US "bolted" from ALPA. Quite the opposite, I am pleased not to have your venom associated with a ALPA and IMO ALPA is better off without you.

I know enough about your airline, this particular merger integration, and the history of the east pilots, and most importantly those who have run your union (even when it was ALPA) to form an educated opinion about what you have been doing to the west pilots. That's all it is... opinion. Sorry if that you get SO upset that others have an opinion about what you are doing that doesn't conform to your view of things. I suggest you get over it since I do not plan on running away just because you would like it to be.

By the way, I have suggested many possible solutions to your dilemma over the years, as have many others. The problem is that anything that doesn't meet your criteria of complete capitulation to your desires, falls on deaf ears.

I have NEVER reported anyone or even talked badly about anyone who comments on the UA board or on this board about UA. Prove me wrong. It's a free country and I don't waste time wondering what an anonymous person's motivation for having an opinion on a subject is.

Spin? You're kidding. Right? How many times have I stated that the outcome will be determined when the final result stands unchallenged, and that until then nothing here is anything more than speculation?

Finally, how many times did I ask about the damages trial? (Here's your answer... exactly ONE) I seriously asked the question of a west poster, ONCE. Again, prove me wrong and re-post ALL the times you claim I did so. Until then, your lies fool no one.

 

[767jetz]

Art, remember, this is a UAL disgruntled ALPA guy,vs the opinion of the 9th, you know, judges,who had a TOTALLY different opinion on this.

My, my... your credibility sinks even further with stuff like this.

Who is the one altering what the 9th said? NOT RIPE. That is all. From that you sure have gone a LONG way to add additional interpretations and opinions that don't exist in their conclusion. Seems like an effort to control the conversation, and silence any disagreements to your opinions. In fact you seem awfully concerned with the opinions of others. Why is that? Sounds alot like some disgruntled tendencies on your part. Talk about playing fast and loose with the facts.

So you have a choice who you are going to believe, The 9th Court of Appeals, San Francisco, or disgruntled ALPA UAL first officer who has one thousand what ever posts on the USAIRWAYS board.

I've been around here for 8 years discussing things that affect our industry. You are convincing no one with this tantrum. As to credibility and your talent of obscuring facts to fit your needs, lets do some math. Since 12/13/09 you've have 721 posts here... about 96 posts per month. Since 8/20/02 I've had 1284 posts here... about 13.5 posts per month.

96 to 13&1/2. See what happens when you shine a light on your "facts?" Talk about spin! Who do you think people will believe?

 

[767jetz]

I am sure your threat has them shaking in their boots...

WOW! That was quite a mouthful. I guess you were writing that novel while on vacation? (Just kidding actually.)

A word of warning though... There are those who will admonish you for spending "every waking hour" on this forum even though you have no skin in the game and have no idea what goes on at USAirways. They will chase you away and tell you to spend more time with the family. You are an outsider after all, and they don't ever go on the "Longshoreman" forum to tell you your business. (unless you take their side of course.)

Welcome back from vacation, by the way.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

WOW! That was quite a mouthful. I guess you were writing that novel while on vacation? (Just kidding actually.)

A word of warning though... There are those who will admonish you for spending "every waking hour" on this forum even though you have no skin in the game and have no idea what goes on at USAirways. They will chase you away and tell you to spend more time with the family. You are an outsider after all, and they don't ever go on the "Longshoreman" forum to tell you your business. (unless you take their side of course.)

Welcome back from vacation, by the way.

Actually I've been on that forum , what a knowledgeable group getting outside opinions and all! MM!

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

My, my... your credibility sinks even further with stuff like this.

Who is the one altering what the 9th said? NOT RIPE. That is all. From that you sure have gone a LONG way to add additional interpretations and opinions that don't exist in their conclusion. Seems like an effort to control the conversation, and silence any disagreements to your opinions. In fact you seem awfully concerned with the opinions of others. Why is that? Sounds alot like some disgruntled tendencies on your part. Talk about playing fast and loose with the facts.



I've been around here for 8 years discussing things that affect our industry. You are convincing no one with this tantrum. As to credibility and your talent of obscuring facts to fit your needs, lets do some math. Since 12/13/09 you've have 721 posts here... about 96 posts per month. Since 8/20/02 I've had 1284 posts here... about 13.5 posts per month.

96 to 13&1/2. See what happens when you shine a light on your "facts?" Talk about spin! Who do you think people will believe?

Quick question in your years as an informational source , "How many times in the past 25 years has the ALPA majority changed their "MERGER POLICY?"MM!

 

[cleardirect]

Quick question in your years as an informational source , "How many times in the past 25 years has the ALPA majority changed their "MERGER POLICY?"MM!

ALPA merger policy 1991. AWA/AAA merger 2005. 14 years to read and understand what the policy was. 14 years to gain support and change it if you thought it needed changing. 14 years of doing nothing.

After the Nicolau, temper tantrum and shock at what the merger policy said. the most experienced group at mergers certainly knew what and how the policy worked.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

ALPA merger policy 1991. AWA/AAA merger 2005. 14 years to read and understand what the policy was. 14 years to gain support and change it if you thought it needed changing. 14 years of doing nothing.

After the Nicolau, temper tantrum and shock at what the merger policy said. the most experienced group at mergers certainly knew what and how the policy worked.

No temper, tantrum , shock, cool heads prevailing in this one I say! MM Gain support, so it was changed by a group with special interests or the MAJORITY, imagine that!

 

[FL430]

You guys should really hope that unions can not just redo seniority at the will of the majority. Otherwise in about 10 years when the west has the majority what do you think will happen? When the next contract comes up we will determine that for the good of the entire bargaining unit seniority would have to be negotiated to put it back to the agreed to arbitrated list.

I sure hope you junior east guys enjoy your moment in the sun now. that will go away when your older pals bail out leaving you with this mess. Once again they are going to get there's at the expense of yours. And you know after 10 years of dealing with the east we may want a little repayment and interest. retire on reserve but at least the old guys got some.

WOW, RoaClt's post must have really enlightened you - you go from defending the Nic at all costs to well.......maybe it will actually go DOH.!
Dont worry Clear, I think he is a very articulate and well informed poster with some good connections in the legal field too. Thanks for the info RoaClt, your research, knowledge, and insight here are most appreciated here by me because I simply dont have the time to research it. Your posts demonstrate a true comprehension of the situation here unlike any I have seen from any west posters, Their lovely uninformed posts pale in comparison to that of yours. Thanks for the legal leson.

 

[luvn737s]

Actually jetz, USAPA's existence will likely make contract negotiations far more difficult for all other carriers.

USAPA will have to bargain away everything but the kitchen sink (long standing contract provisions earned by ALPA, byproducts of standing in solidarity with other major airlines) in order to purchase the Holy Grail of DOH. But the contents will be bitter as they find that implementing that contract will be impossible and they will be stuck having made concessions for nothing. Those concessions will be your new "market rates" from which yuo will have to try and lift yourselves.

There is a term for those who trample on the careers of others on selfish pursuit of a personal gain. Care to guess the term I'm thinking of? It doesn't start with a "W", I'll give you that hint.

 

[traderjake]

No temper, tantrum , shock, cool heads prevailing in this one I say!

Ask a few Captain's how cool the F/O's were from the time the NIC award was announced until the recent 9th ruling.

 

[traderjake]

Are you accusing a USAPA supporter of attacking a flight attendant??

"Well you "ha ha" or your good buddy is in a heap of trouble and now wants representation with his latest altercation with a flight attendent, would love to see him lose his job along with alot of other people!!!!!"

I'm accusing him of being a low life for wanting to see his political enemies lose their jobs.

 

[cleardirect]

WOW, RoaClt's post must have really enlightened you - you go from defending the Nic at all costs to well.......maybe it will actually go DOH.!
Dont worry Clear, I think he is a very articulate and well informed poster with some good connections in the legal field too. Thanks for the info RoaClt, your research, knowledge, and insight here are most appreciated here by me because I simply dont have the time to research it. Your posts demonstrate a true comprehension of the situation here unlike any I have seen from any west posters, Their lovely uninformed posts pale in comparison to that of yours. Thanks for the legal leson.

No have not changed my mind at all. usapa will not get DOH.

I was pointing out that if usapa did manage to get around arbitration the repercussion would be severe and unintended. The same bottom the seniority list, the furloughed that are trying so desperately to steal from the west to make up for a bad career. If there are still here 10 years from will be in worse shape then, then they would be if they just accepted Nicolau now and moved on.

The old east pilots will get theirs and leave them holding the bag as the minority. Be careful what you wish for. When you make up the rules those same rules can be used against you.

As far as a legal lesson, I prefer someone that has attended law school. Not just spouts off a bunch of tripe that weak minds agree with.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

No have not changed my mind at all. usapa will not get DOH.

I was pointing out that if usapa did manage to get around arbitration the repercussion would be severe and unintended. The same bottom the seniority list, the furloughed that are trying so desperately to steal from the west to make up for a bad career. If there are still here 10 years from will be in worse shape then, then they would be if they just accepted Nicolau now and moved on.

The old east pilots will get theirs and leave them holding the bag as the minority. Be careful what you wish for. When you make up the rules those same rules can be used against you.

As far as a legal lesson, I prefer someone that has attended law school. Not just spouts off a bunch of tripe that weak minds agree with.

Baptiste, Wilder and Seham, your education is growing day by day! MM!

 

[Phoenix]

...long standing contract provisions earned by ALPA, byproducts of standing in solidarity with other major airlines..

You owe me a coke.. and a new key board. Bill Crosby couldn't make me laugh that hard.

SouthWest, FedEx, and American just wish they could have invented the notion of "earning" "long standing" contract "provisions." ALPA is the epitome of "long standing" and do plenty of "provision" on their dues members.

 

[Phoenix]

USAPA has for some time been advocating to Management that staffing levels were unsustainable, with particular emphasis on the 190 workload, flight times, reserve compliment and pressure that these pilots are under. With that, the Company has today announced the recalls of 80 pilots; 40 pilots to the West and 40 pilots to the East operation. The Company has indicated that the recall notices would go out Monday and that they would begin scheduling classes Sept. 1, with all 80 to be trained by year end. USAPA has advised the Company that the information for compliance with contractual obligations.

GREAT NEWS FOR BOTH SIDES!!!!!!!!!!

Is there a proofreader at USAPA?