US Pilots Labor Discussion 3/19- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[cactusboy53]

Yeah - we can all see what a happy camper you are.

I knew you would get it.! R-rock is a happy camper. Although I have not flown with him (likely), I have no doubt that those that do fly with him enjoy his company. When he gets done with work he goes home and takes care of & loves those people & pets that are of utmost importance. He rolls in the door & changes into his civilian clothes; eats a home cooked meal. He goes out and enjoys the outdoors, neighbors, and friends.

R-rock is simply thinking out loud how our position at the new US Airways has most recently degraded (specifically since the age 60 change & the downturn in the economy). The America West employee base was PROMISED by Doug Parker that no America West employee would suffer as a result of the acquisition of the old US Air. Since that promise over 144 AWA pilots have been furloughed out of seniority order, Captains have been downgraded to first officers, line holders have been sent to reserve lines. Meanwhile many of our east counterparts that were FURLOUGHED at the time of the "merger" remain employed, and perhaps may even hold a Captain's seat.

R-rock simply voices the same sentiments that nearly all "westies" have: Time has run out. The Ninth will rule soon. If the Ninth affirms Judge Wakes courtroom proceedings, Judge Wake will then put the injunction back in motion AND will rule on Leonidas' request for legal fees. Then the "fun" begins....DAMAGES. That will likely start in the late Spring...early Summer (provided of course that the Ninth affirms). Whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

I believe I noticed that R-rock had only a couple of posts, so you know that he doesn't really spend a great deal of time here. I do, but it is for entertainment value only (that and the slimmest chance that folks like Hate & Swanny can be edumicated on what "final and binding" actually mean).

 

[cleardirect]

The one that cracks me up is doesn't want anything from the EAST but commutes from there, hear it over and over again, The RICO suite, I'll side with him there but I can understand why you want someone to pay for what WAS DONE! And as far as addington, well we'll just wait and see, regardless being out WEST all these years furloughed, from 2 other carriers if this franchise was valuable we would have expanded, made tons of money , and ventured out and I cryed when the columbus hub experiment failed, what great mngmnt! MM! PS, CLEAR why do you think the EAST voted away ALPA they got tired of being spit at!

JAA welcome to the board.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

JAA welcome to the board.

Got , no clue who that is, MV but maybe you do! MM!

 

[EastUS]

Yeah, shame on me for going to college, getting a degree and working my way up,...

At least you stopped sending me death threats via PM.

1) Who didn't?

2) Out right Lying seems to be a consistent trademark within west management.

 

[Black Swan]

Just because I don't get a paycheck from either airline doesn't mean I don't get EXACTLY what is going on here and what the East is trying to perpetrate against the West. I actually am an airline pilot and USAPA makes me Sick and for how ALPA treated the HP pilots, I have no love for them either. The West was cut loose and set adrift. The East and the Company hoped they'd just quietly drown. It's an understatement to say, "that didn't happen". Every time USAPA get's in shoved back up their nether regions I have to laugh. This is their Mess, they can't clean it up, and they think the entire world is too stupid to see it. Welcome to North Korea.

OH METRO! You have got to be kidding me. I thought from all the gas you have expended, you were a Westie! This is so interesting, how this thing so upsets you that you log more time than the actual players! It has got to be rooted in ALPA. Let me remind you of what we did, SMOKING HOLE!!!!

 

[Black Swan]

See I was very active in my union, was a shop steward, attended every training class at the IAM's education center in MD, served as the district communicator as well as the editior for my local, was trained by the man who organized the IAM at US and was a member of the negotiating committee, your job title is irrelevant to experience and education, but like a lot of pilots you believe your superior to everyone else, which makes you ignorant.

This explains a lot of the ranting. 700UW, you had a good career, and did some interesting things. Sorry some pilot pissed you off for some reason or another.

 

[Black Swan]

If the east pilots would wrest control from the Cleara Nostra that continues to embarass and imperil the members of USAPA, you would see the beef is with a union on a juggernaut to disenfranchise it's western constituents (members or not, it doesn't matter) not necessarily with the east pilots themselves.

Their failure to summon the courage to overthrow Cleary proves they are willing to tar themselves with his brand of self-serving devisiveness.

Now tell me why a west pilot ( or better yet an east pilot) should enthusiastically support such destructive behavior.

I am not totally sure you have been able to unpack the issues in this dispute.

Courage to overthrow Cleary? Why? We love the guy.

 

[nic4us]

Hmmm...Do I have this right?:

1) Company management/marketing determines where aircraft are placed? True or False?
2) The east pilot group, through it's vile "unethical behavior" really are the ones who determine the placement and routing of arriving aircraft? True or False?
3) There's really a huge, super-secret, untapped market for wide body flying from PHX? True or False?
4) "I tell you it's ALL the east's fault!!" Ummm....WTF? Over?
5) "That is why usapa is going to lose large in the damages trial." Work through 1) to 3) again and get back to us.

1. Marketing determines where aircraft are placed, True.
2. The east pilot group determine placement.False.
3. There is a huge widebody market from PHX. Huge? False, Market? True.

I never said the seats usapa stole were PHX based. I also understand that the e190 and 757 seats went to arbitration and the West has no immediate claim on them, just an IOU that usapa is ensuring will never be paid (further theft). However, when the merger happened the east had 9 330s, the top payscale aircraft. Now the east has what 14?, a 40% increase in those top pay seats, this is "new equiptment" not replacement, as you did not have it pre-merger, and an A330 with its higher pay does not simply replace a retired 757 international slot.. The West has the right to 1/3rd of those additional seats. usapa's intent is to take from West pilots what is their right to have, and give it to east pilots who have absolutely no legitimate legal claim. In my book that is theft, and I believe the court will see it the same way.

 

[nic4us]

Courage to overthrow Cleary? Why? We love the guy.

Keep him then. I am sure f/o Cleary loves you too, as you guarantee his otherwise unobtainable captain pay at lineholder rates with an overide to boot.

On a completely different subject. I believe oral arguements were scheduled yesterday in the 4th circuit. Any news on how the master litigator embarrassed himself yet again before an appealate court?

Also, watched the CLT crew news with Doug, as was suggested by BS. My question is very simple. Why do you east posters always see a conspiracy behind the most simple of statements? Hemenway puts out a letter saying, "here are the facts of the LOA93 grievence, just wanted you to know so you are not real disappointed when you lose", and rather than take that at face value, you see some kind of admission that the company is worried they are going to lose, etc....Doug says "hey, just want to nip this whole change of control thing in the bud", and again, rather than take it for what it is worth these big conspiracy theories of why the east is in control surface, downright laughable.

Nevermind, just thought about some of my prior post. You folks have absolutely no idea of the position you are in, and are incapable of understanding why the rest of the world is going to move on without you. So I will quit trying to give you a heads up on just how big that assesment is going to be, and how much the RICO countersuits are going to devastate your pay.

 

[hp_fa]

I sure hope the 9th issues a ruling soon so we can move this wonderful exchange of opinions forward.

 

[Black Swan]

Keep him then. I am sure f/o Cleary loves you too, as you guarantee his otherwise unobtainable captain pay at lineholder rates with an overide to boot.

On a completely different subject. I believe oral arguements were scheduled yesterday in the 4th circuit. Any news on how the master litigator embarrassed himself yet again before an appealate court?

Also, watched the CLT crew news with Doug, as was suggested by BS. My question is very simple. Why do you east posters always see a conspiracy behind the most simple of statements? Hemenway puts out a letter saying, "here are the facts of the LOA93 grievence, just wanted you to know so you are not real disappointed when you lose", and rather than take that at face value, you see some kind of admission that the company is worried they are going to lose, etc....Doug says "hey, just want to nip this whole change of control thing in the bud", and again, rather than take it for what it is worth these big conspiracy theories of why the east is in control surface, downright laughable.

Nevermind, just thought about some of my prior post. You folks have absolutely no idea of the position you are in, and are incapable of understanding why the rest of the world is going to move on without you. So I will quit trying to give you a heads up on just how big that assesment is going to be, and how much the RICO countersuits are going to devastate your pay.

If the east gets LOA 84 pay rates, game over for the west. You will get no help from us. Guaranteed. What goes around, comes around.

 

[Black Swan]

I sure hope the 9th issues a ruling soon so we can move this wonderful exchange of opinions forward.

USAviation.com is loving this board. More hits than any other hands down. Highest rates going for the sidebar ads. Keep it coming........

 

[luvn737s]

If the east gets LOA 84 pay rates, game over for the west. You will get no help from us. Guaranteed.

And Plan B? Oh, I forgot the USAPA Taurus doesn't even carry a spare. "We can drive on this flat tire forever!!"

 

[Black Swan]

And Plan B? Oh, I forgot the USAPA Taurus doesn't even carry a spare. "We can drive on this flat tire forever!!"

Well, better than the ALPA bus we got thrown under that ran on Kool Aide.............

 

[hp_fa]

USAviation.com is loving this board. More hits than any other hands down. Highest rates going for the sidebar ads. Keep it coming........

That's funny, I actually thought about that a day or two ago.

See, we can agree on something.