US Pilots Labor Discussion 2/10- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[Metroyet]

If it is not ripe, Wake didn't happen. You get to start over when it is ripe - whenever that might be - and whether it is Wake again, if and when you get it back onto the docket, will be up to the luck of the draw.

Dig down deep, you're going to need it.

The work is done and paid for. The main players just return to their daily lives waiting until USAPA is dumb enough to try and cash their self granted Lotto ticket of DOH. When they do, back to court, all research already done, with the full knowledge of how the Jury ruled THE LAST TIME. Bon Chance. The additional cost is nominal...nothing compared to 3 more years of LOA 93 and it's draconian work rules. Oh well. A ripeness issue is no "win" for usapa. Nothing changes.

 

[CallawayGolf]

If it is not ripe, Wake didn't happen. You get to start over when it is ripe - whenever that might be - and whether it is Wake again, if and when you get it back onto the docket, will be up to the luck of the draw.

Dig down deep, you're going to need it.

Glad you backed off your statement of absolute certainty about the ninth. No one knows how the most overturned federal appellate court in the nation will rule, but a USAPA win by my definition is by far the least likely outcome. Hard to conceive of a federal judge who made discrimination the hallmark of her career ruling that USAPA has failed to harm the minority class by its actions thus far, but there is a slight possibility that she could go off her usual course.

Either way USAPA is far from exonerated. On the contrary, they and their supporters arrogantly take pride in sidestepping the law and blatantly ignore their fiduciary responsibilities. For USAPA, in other words murder, robbery, adultery or any other crime is perfectly okay to engage in so long as the law isn’t fast enough to catch up with you? It’s the “eat, drink and be merry for tomorrow you may dieâ€￾ philosophy from a group of professionals that hold the lives of hundreds in their hands every day that is so troubling to me. Regardless of the minutia of who gets or doesn’t get what, shouldn’t professionals care about their personal integrity above a temporal gain?

 

[nic4us]

You are going to lose in the 9th

Well, at least as the home team, we get the last at bat.

"Let Me root..root..root..for the home team,
if they don't win, its a shame,
"For its ONE(Addington)TWO(LOA93)THREE(damages trial) strikes,,you're out,,
at the ole ball game!!!!!!!

Gentlemen, start your engines...usapa has left the building!!!

 

[inverted]

The work is done and paid for. The main players just return to their daily lives waiting until USAPA is dumb enough to try and cash their self granted Lotto ticket of DOH. When they do, back to court, all research already done, with the full knowledge of how the Jury ruled THE LAST TIME. Bon Chance. The additional cost is nominal...nothing compared to 3 more years of LOA 93 and it's draconian work rules. Oh well. A ripeness issue is no "win" for usapa. Nothing changes.

Dream Weaver,

"The work is done and paid for"

I am sure your attorney will not agree with that statement.....are you serious. He will be paid handsomely for any and all future work on your behalf.



Inverted

 

[nycbusdriver]

In fact, the Nic award is now etched in stone whereas it wasn't with ALPA.

Didn't I recall one of the umpteen vice presidents of ALPA National hand delivering the Nicolau shame to Parker's office with much fanfare?

Didn't Prater's myriad of "Blue Ribbon Committes" and the Wye River waste demonstrate exactly where this was going to fall under ALPA's "leadership?"

Don't I recall the umpteen thousand times the west pilots remind us of that delivery, and continue to do so?

Now, somehow, you claim that under ALPA the Nicolau shame was not written in stone? Is this the flip, or the flop? Or don't you even know?

 

[nycbusdriver]

Quit? And miss all the fun? I just hope you dont turn 65 before we get a chance to fly together.

Personally, I will be just fine either way. Somewhere over the Atlantic I hope to hear about your glorious days flying the DC-9 from PIT to SYR.

From the looks of the "Major" Airline pilots walking around in CLT/PHL....it appears you all dont like yourselves much either. Rather depressed group.


Freebird
Int'l Pilot

I like the way that sounds. Next time I'm at Starbucks in CLT, I'll introduce myself with the new moniker. Is there such a thing as E-190 International Captain? Save me a place in line at Bojangles ! Ahead of you, of course...

Well, yes. We are rather depressed by the fact that your troop of morons in Tempe get to call the shots, and they almost always get them fired into their collective foot.

And we are a bit depressed over the thought that we may have to fly with those who would, after the company has stolen most everything else, steal our seats, seniority and attrition.

And I am sorry to disappoint, but you will never hear a DC9 story from me. Only took one ride on the jumpseat of that thing to know I never wanted to fly it.

And you might truly hope that I am retired before you are honored with the opportunity to pull gear for me.

 

[Metroyet]

Dream Weaver,

"The work is done and paid for"

I am sure your attorney will not agree with that statement.....are you serious. He will be paid handsomely for any and all future work on your behalf.



Inverted

The Case was tried and won already. They didn't throw out their work. It will cost a fraction of what it did to stomp all over USAPA the first time. It's common sense really, which would explain your confusion.

 

[Metroyet]

Didn't I recall one of the umpteen vice presidents of ALPA National hand delivering the Nicolau shame to Parker's office with much fanfare?

Didn't Prater's myriad of "Blue Ribbon Committes" and the Wye River waste demonstrate exactly where this was going to fall under ALPA's "leadership?"

Don't I recall the umpteen thousand times the west pilots remind us of that delivery, and continue to do so?

Now, somehow, you claim that under ALPA the Nicolau shame was not written in stone? Is this the flip, or the flop? Or don't you even know?

Dual ratification was etched into stone with ALPA. You guys though you were strategical geniuses when you used your all powerful votes to destroy it...thinking you could then have your way. Didn't quit work out that way did it. I'll never understand why you guys can't see the forest thru the trees. ALPA was your ticket to avoid nic in perpetuity...but Seham spun such a magical tale...Bradford couldn't resist.

 

[nycbusdriver]

I'm posting this here, because it is more germane to this thread. It's thread creep, so I will remove it from that thread:"So what is really going on with USAirways?"

Matthew 20 — ESV
1 "For the kingdom of heaven is like a master of a house who went out early in the morning to hire laborers for his vineyard.
2 After agreeing with the laborers for a denarius a day, he sent them into his vineyard.
3 And going out about the third hour he saw others standing idle in the marketplace,
4 and to them he said, 'You go into the vineyard too, and whatever is right I will give you.'
5 So they went. Going out again about the sixth hour and the ninth hour, he did the same.
6 And about the eleventh hour he went out and found others standing. And he said to them, 'Why do you stand here idle all day?'
7 They said to him, 'Because no one has hired us.' He said to them, 'You go into the vineyard too.'
8 And when evening came, the owner of the vineyard said to his foreman, 'Call the laborers and pay them their wages, beginning with the last, up to the first.'
9 And when those hired about the eleventh hour came, each of them received a denarius.
10 Now when those hired first came, they thought they would receive more, but each of them also received a denarius.
11 And on receiving it they grumbled at the master of the house,
12 saying, 'These last worked only one hour, and you have made them equal to us who have borne the burden of the day and the scorching heat.'
13 But he replied to one of them, 'Friend, I am doing you no wrong. Did you not agree with me for a denarius?
14 Take what belongs to you and go. I choose to give to this last worker as I give to you.
15 Am I not allowed to do what I choose with what belongs to me? Or do you begrudge my generosity?'
16 So the last will be first, and the first last."

It seems Jesus affirmed that a business owner should be free to pay his workers what they agreed to up front. When the workers come back expecting more than what they agreed to the owner rightfully rebuked them. Jesus' model here was to pay more per hour worked to the last person hired - is that what USAPA is fighting for? The two salient points here are:
1) Business owners should be free to pay wages as they see fit
2) Blessing comes to the humble rather than the proud (who probably never recognize a blessing even when it’s been offered)

Being Lord, Creator and God I’m certain He has more wisdom than any of the rest of us.

Of course, like most of the so-called Christian right, you have totally missed the point of the parable. It has absolutely nothing to do with business models or management process.

At any rate, if you must interpret it this way, Hemenway will be happy to hear that if the company decides to test the LOA 93 for the west argument in court, you will accept that without a fight.

 

[cubfan]

Well, at least as the home team, we get the last at bat.

"Let Me root..root..root..for the home team,
if they don't win, its a shame,
"For its ONE(Addington)TWO(LOA93)THREE(damages trial) strikes,,you're out,,
at the ole ball game!!!!!!!

Gentlemen, start your engines...usapa has left the building!!!

You must be ready for summer, baseball, hotdogs, apple pie, and auto racing. Coming to you from the land where it's always summer.........

 

[nic4us]

Didn't I recall one of the umpteen vice presidents of ALPA National hand delivering the Nicolau shame to Parker's office with much fanfare?

Don't I recall the umpteen thousand times the west pilots remind us of that delivery, and continue to do so?

Now, somehow, you claim that under ALPA the Nicolau shame was not written in stone? Is this the flip, or the flop? Or don't you even know?

I know the answere.

Paul Rice on behalf of ALPA, delivered the Nic to the company. Prater, who was committing ALPA to a DFR by holding the West hostage and picking sides by supporting the east in their attempted land grab, I guess felt it below himself to actually do his job. But, even Prater knows who pays his salary, and had to give it up prior to the NMB election.

Not much fanfare, but I did get a letter from Parker acknowledging reciept.

ALPA, usapa, no union, whoever, does not matter, the Nic is not going away, and is the only combined seniority list available to LCC. Written in stone? I guess as a matter of speach, it was etched the day Nicolau first put pen to paper.

I think the flip is, that under ALPA seperate ratification existed, the flop usapa.

 

[cubfan]

I just read sec 1 scope from the neg. comm. Kirby must think we're fools. 353 RJ's of which 153 can be 190's. Addington or no Addington, win or lose in the 9th, this scope + parity + 3%, I might be retired before we agree to a new contract, and I'm only 52. Some one needs to slap some sense into that boy. :down:

 

[Pi brat]

Everyday it becomes more and more embarrassing to part of an airline that includes the East mentality. Your antics make it embarrassing to wear this uniform. Your choices have dug yourselves into a hole and you are blaming the shovel.

Do me a favor, when we fly together, keep your complaining to yourself. It's worn out. You lost.

Put up a contract to vote on, and it WILL PASS !!! What is Cleary afraid of? His days of leading the Angry F.O. Club are coming to an end.

All 6 of his supporters on this web board have the same tired mantra. My guess is its only 3 different Angry F.O.'s with 2 screen names....

This board provides plenty to be embarrassed about, east and west. The angry F/O club seems to be the most popular, east and west as I'd bet about 90% of posters here are members.

 

[boeingplt]

This board provides plenty to be embarrassed about, east and west. The angry F/O club seems to be the most popular, east and west as I'd bet about 90% of posters here are members.

The "angry F/O" thing is a cheap shot just as the "rookie" BS is. Pilots on both sides of the issue are simply fighting to defend what they believe they have rightfully earned.

Those on either side who claim that their side is necessarily more righteous than the other provide the most legitimate source of embarrassment.

 

[luvn737s]

I'm not sure where the idea of dual ratification came from. Anyone want to cite the specific chapter and verse that guaranteed it?