US Airways Pilots Labor Thread 4/21-4/28

[exB717Flyer]

They {USAPA} have also argued that no union that has pushed for date-of-hire has ever been found guilty of not fairly representing its members.

That's my favorite line. No union pushing for DOH has ever done so after a list was arbitrated either.

 

[Metroyet]

That's my favorite line. No union pushing for DOH has ever done so after a list was arbitrated either.

I wonder what it must feel like when the crosshairs are slowly centering on your forehead...

 

[prechilill]

That's my favorite line. No union pushing for DOH has ever done so after a list was arbitrated either.

Parsing words, half-truths and outright contradictions is pretty much all the infrequent USAPA updates are composed of now days. Looking back on when that smug USAP group landed in Phoenix to sell their "you have no choice but to accept DOH" road show to the AWA pilots, it is comical to think about how wrong they were. In two days the road to justice ends up in a Federal Court room and it is here where we will see the once pompous collection of aging and bitter pilots have their underhanded ways of treating fellow pilots be smacked down once and for all. It is unbelievable we even had to go this far past the arbitration. Besides themselves, who did they think they were kidding?

 

[pilotn79]

Looking back on when that smug USAP group landed in Phoenix to sell their "you have no choice but to accept DOH" road show to the AWA pilots, it is comical to think about how wrong they were. In two days the road to justice ends up in a Federal Court room and it is here where we will see the once pompous collection of aging and bitter pilots have their underhanded ways of treating fellow pilots be smacked down once and for all. It is unbelievable we even had to go this far past the arbitration. Besides themselves, who did they think they were kidding?

I remember the curtains closing on their railroad roadshow and showing them the door. The doors will be wide open in room 504, downtown Phoenix.

Welcome back, enjoy your time in Arizona.

 

[prechilill]

I remember the curtains closing on their railroad roadshow and showing them the door. The doors will be wide open in room 504, downtown Phoenix.

Welcome back, enjoy your time in Arizona.

Just remembering their arrogant, callous attitude towards us as if we had some sort of ultimatum to answer for them. What a flippin' joke they were! Those guys actually thought they had something on us and now *I think* reality is finally sinking in to their thick skulls that their little forray into the wrong side of ethics is about to meet a court appointed end. Mark my words, after their defeat they will start playing the "poor me" line about how terrible their careers have gone and how abhorant it is to have a guy with two years longevity at AWA placed above their furloughed pilots. Imagine that- a guy with a couple of years at a job is actually placed above an east pilot who didn't have a job and had no chance of ever having one. Oh the humanity! They will continue to play on misconceptions and complete mistruths to paint a picture of solemn dispair and bad luck for the east all because the greedy punks out west wouldn't give away their careers to help them. You will hear "lottery ticket" in every crying sentence that dribbles out of their whining mouths. Pathetic. Truly pathetic. What an embarrassment to the profession.

 

[nycbusdriver]

As I'm sure you're aware the bifurcation means if the West prevails in this trial another trial will be conducted to determine damages. Damages. Damages. Damages. (Repetition just in case your eye wanders.) Are you SURE the worst Judge Wake can do is tell you to use the Nicolau list? My guess for possible damage is $1 million/day from USAPA to the Class of West pilots until you decide on your own to codify the Nic list. Judge Wake put this trial on the fast-track because he recognized the West was suffering under USAPA. I'm glad you're so confident about the worst he can do to you.

The only thing that would accomplish is to force this pilot group into being non-union. $1 million/day would bankrupt USAPA, to be sure. That's one way to get rid of it, I suppose. If you think somehow the rank-and-file pilots of the east can be held financially liable for your pipe dreams, you are sadly mistaken. Certainly USAPA can be held liable, but such a reward would simply mean they would close up shop.

Management wins BIG TIME, and you, my friend, join us in LOA 93 heaven because there will no longer be a signatory to your contract (or the east's.) No signatory, no contract.

 

[prechilill]

Deleted by moderator.
What part of DO NOT MAKE IT PERSONAL do you not understand.

 

[Edward]

I have decided to start the new thread for the week today rather than wait until tomorrow.

It still appears some of you choose not to follow the rules of the board. As a reminder, you MAY discuss the issues, but you may not comment on, insult, or otherwise attack the POSTERS. You may NOT call names, you may NOT use profanity, even if disguised, and you may NOT post flame bait.

We have deleted too many posts from the last thread due to violation of the rules above. Please be reminded that ANY post which contains material not conforming to the rules of the board will be DELETED without comment or notification, and the poster subject to further action.

Finally, again, we do realize this is a passionate issue, but we ask you ONE MORE TIME to think before you post. The posts on these pilots' threads do NOTHING to enhance your position or standing, and actually do a disservice to your profession, your company, and whichever side you take on the issue at hand.

PLEASE OBSERVE THE RULES OF THE BOARD.

Everyone RE READ this before you make another post in this thread. Thank you.

 

[exB717Flyer]

The only thing that would accomplish is to force this pilot group into being non-union. $1 million/day would bankrupt USAPA, to be sure.

A bankrupt union is still a legal collective bargaining agent. I don't understand why you think USAPA would go away before an official election.

If you think somehow the rank-and-file pilots of the east can be held financially liable for your pipe dreams, you are sadly mistaken.

Well, I know the judge won't fine y'all individually but USAPA could very well assess y'all to keep the union solvent.

Management wins BIG TIME,...

True. That's what your side started when you withdrew from joint negotiations in 2007. Don't blame us.

 

[BoeingBoy]

A bankrupt union is still a legal collective bargaining agent.

Actually, I think it goes further than that. The contracts are between the company and pilots with the union just being the representative of the pilots, much like a lawyer represents a client. The contract doesn't go away just because the union does any more than a contract signed by a lawyer on behalf of the client goes away just because the lawyer retires.

Jim

 

[ussnark]

The name choice underscored the battle they saw ahead and the sanctity of seniority in the cockpit: Leonidas was a Greek war hero who died helping his underdog troops hold off the advancing Persians in ancient Greece.

Your PHX literary giants didn't study history much, did they, as, in Greek history, Leonidas is considered a moron, outmaneuvered and, as it should be per Darwin, killed off. Like the moth that attacks an open flame, he gets the Darwin Award. Thank you.

 

[exB717Flyer]

Snarky: That's it? An ad hominem attack? Very disappointing. Good luck at the trial. Not.

 

[ussnark]

Snarky: That's it? An ad hominem attack? Very disappointing. Good luck at the trial. Not.

Um, do you have any idea what "ad hominem" means? Simply pointing out that the oped editorialist has no idea what they are talking about hardly qualifies as "ad hominem". Accusing someone of ignorance hardly constitutes a "ad hominem" attack, as you say. Prove the columnist right, if you can.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Actually, I think it goes further than that. The contracts are between the company and pilots with the union just being the representative of the pilots, much like a lawyer represents a client. The contract doesn't go away just because the union does any more than a contract signed by a lawyer on behalf of the client goes away just because the lawyer retires.

Jim

So then, I am a member of a gym, or social club, or a church, which rents space from a landlord. The people that run the organization stop paying rent and just close up shop. The landlord still has an obligation to let me on the premises even though I am not a signatory to the lease?

Yeah, right.

 

[nostradamus]

As of today there are still about 400 West pilots who haven't given a dime to Leonidas, LLC. 1/3 of the pilots are not supporting their cause. 99 percent are not paying union dues.

I will add my advice to the west pilots, that you attend the proceedings wearing your finest and looking your best- suit and tie, or at least a sport coat at a minimum. I would advise against wearing your uniform, as you are not on duty.

The following is a bad attitude from a west pilot leader.

""For the West, this merger has been nothing more than an arranged marriage from hell. If anything, this trial is about the abuse the West has received at the hands of its numerically larger East. In domestic relations this is called spousal abuse. In the context of a union, its called a Breach of the Duty of Fair Representation.""

This is a DFR suit gentlemen, not a claim for a slot machine that did not pay off due to a malfunction in the system. Lack of participation and vandalism, made it very difficult for USAPA to represent you.