Union vs Non Union My Response

[WoRkInG]

Hey WorkinG,
Speaking of bottom of the industry (compensation), the AFA just filed with the NMB for representational purposes for the DL/NW flight attendants. Knowing Delta, that means we're right around the corner for PAY INCREASES!

Yep! That's the delta difference We get increases in the midst of struggle, but we got to keep the ONION out so make them happy!

 

[lineguy43]

The mechanics at NWA followed the very poor advice of their representation, by doing so they put their livelihood at risk. AMFA blinked, mechanics lost their jobs.

Seems that NWA did just what Reagan did in the '80s with the ATC union. A strike in this day and age is nothing more than blackmail.



Man I can see the hate responses coming from that one already.

Hey man do some research before you make blanket statements...Did AMFA make a mistake? Yep several. But make no mistake NWA FORCED THIS STRIKE. AMFA was agreeable to all the NW demands and that still was not good enough. NW wanted AMFA GONE. They would not have spent millions of dollars and almost 2 yrs training replacements if that was not their intention to replace most all the mechanics. I think this was the plan from the begininng. NW knew it was going to merge with DL long before they forced the strike. They did not want AMFA to be a part of this merger period. Make no mistake it was NWA not AMFA who killed our careers.

 

[2BlacknBlue]

Hey man do some research before you make blanket statements...Did AMFA make a mistake? Yep several. But make no mistake NWA FORCED THIS STRIKE. AMFA was agreeable to all the NW demands and that still was not good enough. NW wanted AMFA GONE. They would not have spent millions of dollars and almost 2 yrs training replacements if that was not their intention to replace most all the mechanics. I think this was the plan from the begininng. NW knew it was going to merge with DL long before they forced the strike. They did not want AMFA to be a part of this merger period. Make no mistake it was NWA not AMFA who killed our careers.

Yep and then came the good cop, bad cop scenerio. Doug Steenland took the helm of NWA while Richard Anderson disappeared into the open arms of United Healthcare (Dl's medical insurance carrier) only to rise again as DL's CEO (coincidental, SURE) who wouldn't DARE do the things that Doug Steenland (currently serving as a DL board of director) did, even though Richard helped Frank Lorenzo kill Eastern Airlines. And the ugliness, well, it ain't over!

DAL Mech, where have you been?

 

[tech2101]

DAL Mech, where have you been?

Obviously not around in 1988 to see the EAL debacle.

The Delta CEO was Larenzo's Legal Counsel.

Richard Anderson (DAL/NWA) - previously Northwest CEO and currently Delta’s CEO. Now leads the company.
Anderson joined Continental Airlines in 1987 and worked under Frank Lorenzo as Staff Vice President and
Deputy General Counsel. He worked for Lorenzo when pieces of Eastern Air Lines were being bought by and
transferred to CAL. Anderson was hired by Ben Hirst Joined Northwest in November 1990, left in 2004. Joined
Delta in 2007.

Look Here...

 

[2BlacknBlue]

Obviously not around in 1988 to see the EAL debacle.

The Delta CEO was Larenzo's Legal Counsel.


Look Here...

...and these anti-union knuckle heads run around here talking about a Delta culture, a Delta family, and an open door policy. Times have changed. Ron Allen killed Delta and Leo Mullin/Michele Burns buried it. The hedge funds call the shots and the employee centric, feel good environment is merely words.

This leadership team is chompin' at the bit, hoping there is no more unionization coming to Delta Air Lines. I've said it before and I'll say it again. SMART MONEY IS THAT DELTA DID NOT WANT NORTHWEST PEOPLE! DELTA WANTED THE ROUTE STRUCTURE AND THE NWA MONEY IN THE BANK! IF NORTHWEST PEOPLE CAN FIND A WAY TO HOLD ON TO THE UNIONS, THEY WILL HAVE A JOB! IF THEY CAN'T, DELTA/NW EMPLOYEE GROUPS WILL BE WHITTLED DOWN TO PRE-MERGER DL LEVELS, WITH THE REST OF THE JOBS BEING OUTSOURCED. IAM + AFA IN, RHS AND FOREIGN NATIONALS OUT! OTHERWISE, THE UNEMPLOYMENT IN ATL AND MSP WILL GROW!

(***The reason I typed this in CAPITAL LETTERS is that I want you to remember this!)

 

[WoRkInG]

...and these anti-union knuckle heads run around here talking about a Delta culture, a Delta family, and an open door policy. Times have changed. Ron Allen killed Delta and Leo Mullin/Michele Burns buried it. The hedge funds call the shots and the employee centric, feel good environment is merely words.

This leadership team is chompin' at the bit, hoping there is no more unionization coming to Delta Air Lines. I've said it before and I'll say it again. SMART MONEY IS THAT DELTA DID NOT WANT NORTHWEST PEOPLE! DELTA WANTED THE ROUTE STRUCTURE AND THE NWA MONEY IN THE BANK! IF NORTHWEST PEOPLE CAN FIND A WAY TO HOLD ON TO THE UNIONS, THEY WILL HAVE A JOB! IF THEY CAN'T, DELTA/NW EMPLOYEE GROUPS WILL BE WHITTLED DOWN TO PRE-MERGER DL LEVELS, WITH THE REST OF THE JOBS BEING OUTSOURCED. IAM + AFA IN, RHS AND FOREIGN NATIONALS OUT! OTHERWISE, THE UNEMPLOYMENT IN ATL AND MSP WILL GROW!

(***The reason I typed this in CAPITAL LETTERS is that I want you to remember this!)

Couldn't of said it better '2blacknblue'

 

[john john]

I think any experienced airline employee knows that the airline business is extremely fickle and it's a very risky proposition to bank on having a life long career with the same airline and build seniority in a unionized system.

Unlike a retire government employee getting a define pension and full medical benefits
Good for you the airline employees had the same. But your non-union analysis help it go away.

 

[Delta Technician]

...and these anti-union knuckle heads run around here talking about a Delta culture, a Delta family, and an open door policy. Times have changed. Ron Allen killed Delta and Leo Mullin/Michele Burns buried it. The hedge funds call the shots and the employee centric, feel good environment is merely words.

This leadership team is chompin' at the bit, hoping there is no more unionization coming to Delta Air Lines. I've said it before and I'll say it again. SMART MONEY IS THAT DELTA DID NOT WANT NORTHWEST PEOPLE! DELTA WANTED THE ROUTE STRUCTURE AND THE NWA MONEY IN THE BANK! IF NORTHWEST PEOPLE CAN FIND A WAY TO HOLD ON TO THE UNIONS, THEY WILL HAVE A JOB! IF THEY CAN'T, DELTA/NW EMPLOYEE GROUPS WILL BE WHITTLED DOWN TO PRE-MERGER DL LEVELS, WITH THE REST OF THE JOBS BEING OUTSOURCED. IAM + AFA IN, RHS AND FOREIGN NATIONALS OUT! OTHERWISE, THE UNEMPLOYMENT IN ATL AND MSP WILL GROW!

(***The reason I typed this in CAPITAL LETTERS is that I want you to remember this!)

So enlighten us anti-union knuckle heads. Which of your capitalized scenerios can a union stop from happening?

 

[Airlinelifer]

So enlighten us anti-union knuckle heads. Which of your capitalized scenerios can a union stop from happening?

I hope your freshening up on your Mandarin, Cantonese or Sczechuan....because thats were your jobs are headed. "Oh, we signed a contract to maintain Hawaiian, or XYZ Air... big deal. your jobs are gone.

PS you made your choice, keep out of our fight.

 

[UAL_TECH]

I am tired of fighting the obvious.

If you ‘knuckleheads’ believe that corporate will take care of you then there is no further need of discussion.
The US industry (not just airlines) digresses to meet a global equilibrium of the labor pool.

So what does that infer?

B) xUAL_TECH

 

[WoRkInG]

I am tired of fighting the obvious.

If you ‘knuckleheads’ believe that corporate will take care of you then there is no further need of discussion.
The US industry (not just airlines) digresses to meet a global equilibrium of the labor pool.

So what does that infer?

B) xUAL_TECH

You are right 'UAL_TECH'. If these guys don't want to take time and research the past and present to have some type of sense of how the system of corp works I say let the sheep follow. I have sent plenty of facts and even links to books that tells the real reason why they do not want unions in the workplace and the new way of business is done now of days (society as a company) to some of these scabs and they never sent me back one argument because their isn't one. I think I will just take my hat out the box and remove myself from this forum. I hope I made a difference to someone on here, but I doubt it.

 

[Kev3188]

I posted these questions on another website. I they're important for everyone in ACS to ask themselves when considering wether (sp?) or not having a collective voice in the workplace is worth it.


*Does DL not have a long history of outsourcing?

* Did NW not look to outsource all ACS positions outside of the hubs?

* Is much of that same team now part of the CLT at DL?

* Is DL not in the outsourcing business?

 

[Delta Technician]

I am tired of fighting the obvious.

If you ‘knuckleheads’ believe that corporate will take care of you then there is no further need of discussion.
The US industry (not just airlines) digresses to meet a global equilibrium of the labor pool.

So what does that infer?

B) xUAL_TECH

It infers that you still didn't answer the question. I'm not naive enough to think this corporation will "take care" of anyone. A union can't stop any of what you say from happening. The only thing it could do is provide bumping rights if any of the above should happen and there is still a company left. Not worth paying dues for in my opinion.

 

[Delta Technician]

I posted these questions on another website. I they're important for everyone in ACS to ask themselves when considering wether (sp?) or not having a collective voice in the workplace is worth it.


*Does DL not have a long history of outsourcing?

* Did NW not look to outsource all ACS positions outside of the hubs?

* Is much of that same team now part of the CLT at DL?

* Is DL not in the outsourcing business?

Good questions but my oppinion once again is these economic times brings trouble for any organized work force trying to bargain anything. Should I bring up NWA mechanics again? Times are even tougher now.

 

[700UW]

Hey DAL tech,

How much say did you have when DL outsourced your work, cut your pay, closed hangars, canceled benefits during bankruptcy?

How many times did they negotiate with mtc?

Oh thats right, DL did whatever they wanted to do cause your just an employee at will with no rights.

Why is it ok for your CEO and other Executives to have contracts yet you dont want to work under one which guarantees your compensation and benefits.

Oh and by the way union dues are tax deductible