UA/CO Merger Thread-Post Announcement

[767jetz]

I wondered how long it would take before this issue reared it's ugly head! UAL will no doubt change everything again so benefits earned and rules adhered to for an entire career are pitched for the benefit of the newbies.
Just a point, you don't need 30 years to get a seat on united metal, although it helps! Best of luck to everyone and I sincerely mean it..

IMO I never liked the idea of retirees boarding before active employees. But what ever is decided is fine with me either way. This is not the "hill I want to die on." Pass travel that we all once enjoyed is a thing of the past in this new world of passenger loads and squeezing every last penny from every seat. Honestly, when I travel with my family I don't have the time or energy to worry whether we will all get on the flight or not. We just buy tickets, ID90's or even regular fare if necessary.

Sure retirees put their time in. But they also had their "moment in the sun." Retirees also usually have more flexible schedules to get on the next flight. Active employees usually need to get where they are going and get back during limited days off, or they are commuting to work. But with pay and benefits for active employees going so far backward compared to what our retired counterparts enjoyed, I believe pass travel should favor those still slugging it out to make a living day in and day out. Additionally, keeping the active front line employees happy with perks like this will reflect on their job satisfaction and in return reflect in how they interact with our customers. This is a service industry after all.

Like I said I can see both sides. I guess I'm split about 60/40 in favor of active employees. But in the end this is more of a distraction from the important work we have ahead of us.

One last thought... Perhaps there is some compromise. For example maybe retirees who worked 10 years or less go behind actives, 10-20 years have a slightly higher priority, etc. Same with actives. Maybe if you have less than 10 years you go behind and over that you go ahead. There is always some middle ground to be found.

 

[CALFLYBOY]

I understand UAL's pass policy regarding retirees, and I think it's wonderful. However, one must keep in mind that UAL has had employees stationed in cities where most employees wanted to live for the most part.

Over at CO, it's been a different story since the Lorenzo days, and two bankruptcies later. Outstations have been outsourced to vendors, crew domiciles and maintenance bases have been closed, etc. So what CAL has now is a huge population of commuters around their system. Well over 60% of all pilots and FA's commute. A good number of mechanics and ramp agents do the same. I even know a gate agent who commutes.

So retirees after active employees is not only understandable, it's crucial for many to get to work.

 

[Borescope]

Retirees also usually have more flexible schedules to get on the next flight. Active employees usually need to get where they are going and get back during limited days off, or they are commuting to work.

This says it all. I'm with Jetz, I usually buy tickets if we are going to go somewhere on vacation. The last thing I want to be doing the last few days of a vacation is trying to figure out how to get home. Plus it's nice to board with the rest of the cattle in my flip flops and shorts.

 

[767jetz]

Plus it's nice to board with the rest of the cattle in my flip flops and shorts.

 

[T5towbar]

My guess is that UA will move out of it's current terminal at EWR. It just makes sense. EWR is a fortress hub for CO, and UA has been a minor player there for quite some time. It would be easy for CO's operation to absorb UA's and it's associated employees without much trouble. I'm sure this will be the case in all the big hubs, including ORD, DEN, IAH, IAD, etc.

With all the downsizing in recent years at both airlines, they have the infrastructure to handle a much bigger operation at most airports. Ever since UA's BK people have criticized that UA did not shed enough of their infrastructure assets. Post BK it has been said that UA still has the facilities to accommodate an airline much larger in size. Maybe this was always part of the master plan considering Tilton's advocacy for consolidation.

Keep in mind that from the perspective of employees, the new UA will be about the same size it was at UA's peak in 2000-2001. Of course now that everything is understaffed and productivity has greatly increased we can do more with the same number of people. So as far as departures, passenger miles, fleet size, etc. the new UA will be even bigger than before... But not by that much.

IMO all employees, UA and CO should focus on the big picture and work together to make the most of this great opportunity. Assuming management takes the initiative to engage us, we should let them know that working together with us instead of treating us like a liability is the first step. I honestly believe CO's management understands this much more than UA's does. But for employees we should not worry about paint schemes, call signs, logos, uniforms, terminal buildings, headquarter locations, or any other petty distractions. These things will work themselves.

As far as EWR (since I work there) goes. We actually don't use three terminals.
We only use Terminal B (B-2) for some international arrivals since it has a bigger FIS facility than C-3. We have a recheck facility there for bag transfers, since the transferring bas have to be cleared by customs, but otherwise the planes are moved back to Terminal C for departure.(DL and AF does the same thing and tows their planes back to B-1 for departure) Otherwise, we use all of Terminal C and A-2 (express) and 1 gate (Gate 10 - L&R) in A-1. UA has gates there along with AC - their pre-clear fights. Before the merger was announced, UA was supposed to move their ops into Terminal C. (They were going to be given 3 gates). But now that is changed with the merger. I can see all of the mainline flights in Terminal C, and the Express operation (sprinkled in with a couple of 737 & 320's and or Q200/Q400 into A-1 & A-2. AC can stay at A-1 as well. This depends on what the Port Authority decides. The balance of power would be the same, but I am hoping that B6 would move out of A-2 over to A-3, since AA has a couple of gates they are not using. (Haven't they formed some sort of partnership of sorts?) Alaska can move in with DL at B-1. AA & US are set at A-3, so I don't see a whole lot of moving around. If any slots were to be given up, I would think that B6 would get the old FL slots. They are the only LCC at EWR, so that should not be a problem. I can't see WN coming here. They want to come in to LGA.

We will see what happens in the upcoming months what takes place. I'm pretty sure that things between the two forces will smooth themselves out. As long as we talk to each other and management does the right thing. BTW, we are understaffed as well since we had downsizings in 2008 & 2009.

 

[Dont call me Shirley]

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-05-06/u-s-should-deny-ual-continental-deal-oberstar-says-update1-.html

U.S. Should Deny UAL-Continental Deal, Oberstar Says (Update1)

By John Hughes
May 6 (Bloomberg) -- United Airlines’ merger with Continental Airlines Inc. should be rejected by the U.S. Justice Department because it would reduce competition, House Transportation Committee Chairman James Oberstar said

Is "the Senator from NWA now "Senator from DL (North)?

 

[JFK Fleet Service]

Maybe the gentleman from Minnesota hadn't noticed,but the airline industry is getting the snot knocked out of it these past few years.

Shouldn't he be off on a lobbyist paid for junket or something?

 

[ZMAN777]

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-05-06/u-s-should-deny-ual-continental-deal-oberstar-says-update1-.html

U.S. Should Deny UAL-Continental Deal, Oberstar Says (Update1)

By John Hughes
May 6 (Bloomberg) -- United Airlines’ merger with Continental Airlines Inc. should be rejected by the U.S. Justice Department because it would reduce competition, House Transportation Committee Chairman James Oberstar said

Is "the Senator from NWA now "Senator from DL (North)?

Actually he's not a Senator but rather a Rep. of the House. Of course he has no favorites in this issue. Not!

Cheers,
Z B)

 

[gatemech]

Where this is one of the points that we have to work on. That means no one is getting on a flight then. Of course, any retiree should be taken care of, but we have been making sure that the active employee who has put his time in should also get on a flight too. Judging by your system, it would take me another 12 or 13 years (on top of my 17) before I can get on a flight. But this will be worked out someway or another.

I do agree with you both about management......... They should be the last to get on before any frontline employee!

I didn't say management after frontline. Off the clock they should go by DOH. Believe it or not they are
human and have feelings. I think?

This will be interesting. A great drama/comedy/action story.

 

[767jetz]

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-05-06/u-s-should-deny-ual-continental-deal-oberstar-says-update1-.html

U.S. Should Deny UAL-Continental Deal, Oberstar Says (Update1)

By John Hughes
May 6 (Bloomberg) -- United Airlines’ merger with Continental Airlines Inc. should be rejected by the U.S. Justice Department because it would reduce competition, House Transportation Committee Chairman James Oberstar said

Is "the Senator from NWA now "Senator from DL (North)?

No surprise here. Someone always hates consolidation. I'm confident in the end it will pass.

 

[Borescope]

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-05-06/u-s-should-deny-ual-continental-deal-oberstar-says-update1-.html

U.S. Should Deny UAL-Continental Deal, Oberstar Says (Update1)

By John Hughes
May 6 (Bloomberg) -- United Airlines’ merger with Continental Airlines Inc. should be rejected by the U.S. Justice Department because it would reduce competition, House Transportation Committee Chairman James Oberstar said

Is "the Senator from NWA now "Senator from DL (North)?

This guy is an idiot. Now that NWA is up and running with DL, he's trying to make sure no one else can.

 

[boxer]

Regarding UA's retirees:

Those with 25 years or more are boarded ahead of actives.

Those with 10 years or more and over 55 years of age are boarded by years of service along with actives. They do not acquire more seniority as time goes by.

Many of the old timers, me included, that I know don't use their pass privileges much any longer and buy tickets on Southwest, Jet Blue or Virgin America.

 

[Pi brat]

This guy is an idiot. Now that NWA is up and running with DL, he's trying to make sure no one else can.

I would be expecting the Honorable Charles Schumer to be chiming in any second now.

 

[FA Mikey]

This guy is an idiot. Now that NWA is up and running with DL, he's trying to make sure no one else can.

Except for the fact that he opposed that merger as well. He is an advocate for the people not airline employees and managers.

 

[767jetz]

Except for the fact that he opposed that merger as well. He is an advocate for the people not airline employees and managers.

Regardless of who he is or what he represents, he is just one voice of many.