TWU negotiations.........what?

[strikeforce]

US, UA, DL and NW slashed their employee pay and benefits, and yet their employees show up for work every day. Is everything rainbows and unicorns at those airlines? No. But they keep showing up for work. Your post implies that AA is all alone on this front, and the reality is that Arpey spared you from it for nearly nine years.

The managing director said the exact same thing about slashing pay and benefits, and showing up for work. And, he's right, workers will show up for work, but at other airlines you didn't hear about F/A's going beserk and cars being pelted with bb's. Labor relations at AA is at historical lows, so low in fact that the company sent their management teams to workplace violence classes.

If this was my company I would do exactly what AA is doing if my labor represented employees didn't agree to consensual agreements. But, instead of raping all employees, even the ones left standing, and then having to worry about the ramifications.....including work place violence. I would instead cut the fat, and REWARD the remaining employees with some type of incentive so they come to work with a smile on their face.

It's the horrible labor relations between workers and management that will kill AA. Instead of management embracing their employees, they call them bricks in the media. And, that's the most notable difference between AA's BK and that of UA, DL & US.

 

[Duke787]

I voted no because the ta was filled with cocessions and was very devisive (splitting the over 50 against the under 50 yr olds). It is better to take a stand and fail than to go through life grovelling on your knees.

So you want to be like the NWA mechs, "full pay to the last day" which is what they got until they were all replaced and now those replacement guys are making about $38 an hour. In protest to the BK contract, all you "I'm voting NO regardless of what is in the contract", I'm sure you all will be resigning rather then providing your services to AA while a dues paying member of the TWU. You will be showing AA what's what, by working for AA as the lowest paid mechs, and you'll be showing the TWU what's what by paying your union dues on time every month........ya you guys are real principled...................listening to S##T house lawyers rather then to an actual BK lawyer.......AA must be shaking in their boots, If you listened to the yes voters, we would all have more then $15k in our pockets. Now your going to listen to the vote NO guys again, only to have a very severe contract forced upon us. The Judge doesn't care about labor, only the creditors.

 

[TWU informer]

The managing director said the exact same thing about slashing pay and benefits, and showing up for work. And, he's right, workers will show up for work, but at other airlines you didn't hear about F/A's going beserk and cars being pelted with bb's. Labor relations at AA is at historical lows, so low in fact that the company sent their management teams to workplace violence classes.

If this was my company I would do exactly what AA is doing if my labor represented employees didn't agree to consensual agreements. But, instead of raping all employees, even the ones left standing, and then having to worry about the ramifications.....including work place violence. I would instead cut the fat, and REWARD the remaining employees with some type of incentive so they come to work with a smile on their face.

It's the horrible labor relations between workers and management that will kill AA. Instead of management embracing their employees, they call them bricks in the media. And, that's the most notable difference between AA's BK and that of UA, DL & US.

The one that sticks in my craw the worst is the most recent.
And that is the rejection of binding arbitration.
I now know AA management does not seek fair, they seek more than fair, and they feared what would be brought out in arbitration.

Rejection of binding arbitration was a mistake on management's part and now they are working double time at mental manipulation of the work force.

I see right through that and reject that as sound management.

I could see the arguement that our defined pension was of vlaue compared to the competition. But nobody could place an accurate dollar value to it.
Now that the define pension is gone, they are seeking a $1 billion cost advantage over the competition.
That is much different than "competetive" cost structure.

 

[TWU informer]

So you want to be like the NWA mechs, "full pay to the last day" which is what they got until they were all replaced and now those replacement guys are making about $38 an hour. In protest to the BK contract, all you "I'm voting NO regardless of what is in the contract", I'm sure you all will be resigning rather then providing your services to AA while a dues paying member of the TWU. You will be showing AA what's what, by working for AA as the lowest paid mechs, and you'll be showing the TWU what's what by paying your union dues on time every month........ya you guys are real principled...................listening to S##T house lawyers rather then to an actual BK lawyer.......AA must be shaking in their boots, If you listened to the yes voters, we would all have more then $15k in our pockets. Now your going to listen to the vote NO guys again, only to have a very severe contract forced upon us. The Judge doesn't care about labor, only the creditors.

I am making my decision on this based on management actions not any mouth from our work group.
Including your mouth.


There is no long lived cost advantage in this industry.

Management wants to sell you a variable compensation package called profit sharing. Their management degrees and consultants are in a belief that with a $1 billion plus cost advantage that they will steam roll the competition. Not true! History says the other carriers will either obtain consensual matching concessions or they will re-visit Bankruptcy Court and...poof... the cost advantage is gone once again and it is time for another round of raping the employees.

Where do you think this spiral of destruction should end?

What is even more sickening is the Union's taking money from your paycheck for politics and losing the battle to reverse the laws and regulations that are allowing this. The Union is failing us both at the negotiating table and the political arena. And that is happening because they are whores to one party instead of using our power to advance change via economic distruptions.

 

[Duke787]

Everybody's reasons for the way they vote are good ones, but to let AA just go to the judge and have a contract imposed on us because of some grand disillusioned idea is just insane, we are not voting against sharia law, we're voting on pay, benefits, and jobs. Voting against a consensual contract could cost us that are left, thousands of dollars and thousands of jobs.

Lets not castrate ourselves, just to avoid being punched in the face.

 

[TWU informer]

Everybody's reasons for the way they vote are good ones, but to let AA just go the judge and have a contract imposed on us because of some grand disillusioned idea is just insane, we are not voting against sharia law, we're voting on pay, benefits, and jobs. Voting against a consensual contract could cost us that are left, thousands of dollars and thousands of jobs.

Lets not castrate ourselves, just to avoid being punched in the face.

Ever think about the possibility that castration might be the only thing that will motiviate that unions and their members to finally take a uniified stand?

Where do you think this downward spiral should end?

How many jobs did the 2003 concessions save?

I remember post like yours claiming we saved 3 maintenance bases and 10,000 jobs.

I think history shows that was the only grand disillusional thinking around.

Your thinking will be proven the same.

AS long as deregulation of this industry and the bankruptcy laws stay in place, we only have one choice. And it is outside legal authority.

 

[Overspeed]

I suspect that I am right there with you and that we will see an even larger NO vote this time around.

That's probably what AA and the creditors want. Then they can impose the items in the term sheet.

 

[TWU informer]

That's probably what AA and the creditors want. Then they can impose the items in the term sheet.

Do you have any information that insures we are looking at anything better than the term sheet in value?

 

[Duke787]

Ever think about the possibility that castration might be the only thing that will motiviate that unions and their members to finally take a uniified stand?

Where do you think this downward spiral should end?

In 2001 the TWU got us the best contract of any carrier, and we did all maint in house. Now we are in the worst contract envirment ever and our company is in BK, does anyone really expect to get an industry leading contract. For the guys that want $50 an hour expect to give up scope clause, for the guys expecting never to work weekends or holidays, get out of the ariline industry.

Make the best out of a horrible situation, rather then make it it even worse. the UAL FA had a contract forced on them now they are finally reaching up to our FA.

 

[TWU informer]

In 2001 the TWU got us the best contract of any carrier, and we did all maint in house. Now we are in the worst contract envirment ever and our company is in BK, does anyone really expect to get an industry leading contract. For the guys that want $50 an hour expect to give up scope clause, for the guys expecting never to work weekends or holidays, get out of the ariline industry.

Make the best out of a horrible situation, rather then make it it even worse. the UAL FA had a contract forced on them now they are finally reaching up to our FA.

I believe it was AMFA that got you that 2001 contract, and AA took less than two years to take it back from you.
In fact I attended and testified at the P.E.B. that led to that contract after NWA/AMFA changed the industry standard.

And BTW, AA never has done ALL maintenance in house. You are living a dream of non-facts.

I am not seeking $50 per hour.

In fact, I have laid out a path to the future and it did not include a $50 request at all.

Do you have any idea what is happening in negotiations? DO you have any idea where negotiations are at right now?
Do you have any idea what we will be voting on?

I don't!!!
I am not part of the secret society.

 

[Duke787]

I remember post like yours claiming we saved 3 maintenance bases and 10,000 jobs.

Sense 2003 the other legacy airlines have outsourced their OH maint, war with iraq that lasted 7 years, continued war in afganastan, the $100 + per barrel of oil in 2007, now 2012 oil prices, and the finacial collapse of 2008. If anybody could have predicted that in 2003 who knows what would have happened. I think AA and the TWU made a valent attempt to save jobs.

 

[TWU informer]

Sense 2003 the other legacy airlines have outsourced their OH maint, war with iraq that lasted 7 years, continued war in afganastan, the $100 + per barrel of oil in 2007, now 2012 oil prices, and the finacial collapse of 2008. If anybody could have predicted that in 2003 who knows what would have happened. I think AA and the TWU made a valent attempt to save jobs.

You must be related to users CIO and HSS

Always deflecting attention away when the TWU fails.

When this was happening at NWA and UAL it was AMFA's fault. But it when happens here it AA, it is everyone's and everything's fault but the TWU's.

Why is that? Do you think we are stupid or something?

 

[Duke787]

I believe it was AMFA that got you that 2001 contract, and AA took less than two years to take it back from you.
.

I think your right about AMFA, but AMFA had outsourcing where we did not, and the AMFA mechs are no longer working at NWA or Delta. They were all replaced.

 

[TWU informer]

I think your right about AMFA, but AMFA had outsourcing where we did not, and the AMFA mechs are no longer working at NWA or Delta. They were all replaced.

Quit deflecting attention away from the TWU's failures and stick to what we are living..NOW

 

[Buck]

I think your right about AMFA, but AMFA had outsourcing where we did not, and the AMFA mechs are no longer working at NWA or Delta. They were all replaced.

Where are the AMFA mechanic's working now and for how.much?