TWU negotiations.........what?

[Frank Szabo]

Bob, the one industry that can paralyze this nation is the airline industry. This presents huge leaverage to union leaders, such as yourself, to apply enormous pressure on management to come to the table and negotiate in good faith. I just don't undertand why our leadership continuously fails to use this leaverage to achieve a fair agreement. There are 10,000 soldiers waiting for your word, and I gaurantee AA management will buckle under pressure. It's very simple.....just do your JOB VERBATIM! No need to picket or strike.

Mr. Strikeforce:

You are correct - those clamoring for a strike are more on the side of the company - ie, the bean counters get an out to file for bankruptcy and blame someone else for their problems. Personally, I do my job the best way I know how and follow the rules set forth by those who "knoweth not WTF they do".

We have been trained to do our jobs verbatim by the company's computer based training (aka CBT, insituted after the failure of engineering to specify a tolerance re: wire tie spacing) and I feel it's time we paid attention to that training which the company decided we needed as a CYA measure for them. As said training rightfully points out, not following all technical pubs, GPM, and other other directives is cause for "corrective action" and we certainly wouldn't want that to happen to anyone in our ranks who actually works for a living.

That said, let the FAs and pilots do their thing as they are the only groups that can actually do anything re: pressure on the company via job actions - we, the Title 1 Mekaniks, are too easy to replace with third-world residents unable to speak the English language (with the FAA's approval, of course).

We should simply do our jobs, VERBATIM (per the company's CBT) and keep on truckin'.

verbatim
adverb
exactly - to the letter - word for word - closely - precisely - literally - faithfully

 

[Bob Owens]

Bob, the one industry that can paralyze this nation is the airline industry. This presents huge leaverage to union leaders, such as yourself, to apply enormous pressure on management to come to the table and negotiate in good faith. I just don't undertand why our leadership continuously fails to use this leaverage to achieve a fair agreement. There are 10,000 soldiers waiting for your word, and I gaurantee AA management will buckle under pressure. It's very simple.....just do your JOB VERBATIM! No need to picket or strike.

Actually labor has a significant presence in the entire Transportation industry, not just the airlines but Trucking, Rail and maritime as well. Strategically Labor is still in a very good position. What are the first two primary economic targets in warfare?Transportation and Communication. Labor still has a presence in communication as well. But instead of reorganizing its strenghts and making gains for workers in these industries, taking care and focusing their efforts on the members they already have, thus showing the rest of the working class what Unions can do, they concentrate of trying organize new members while losing the hearts and mids of the ones they have. If current members are not happy with their representation then the likelyhood of recruiting new members is less. That point should be loud and clear after the recent disasters at Delta.

 

[strikeforce]

Mr. Strikeforce:

You are correct - those clamoring for a strike are more on the side of the company - ie, the bean counters get an out to file for bankruptcy and blame someone else for their problems. Personally, I do my job the best way I know how and follow the rules set forth by those who "knoweth not WTF they do".

We have been trained to do our jobs verbatim by the company's computer based training (CBT) and I feel it's time we paid attention to that training which the company decided we needed as a CYA measure for them. As said training rightfully points out, not following all technical pubs, GPM, and other other directives is cause for "corrective action" and we certainly wouldn't want that to happen to anyone.

That said, let the FAs and pilots do their thing as they are the only groups that can actually do anything re: pressure on the company via job actions - we, the Title 1 Mekaniks, are too easy to replace with third-world residents unable to speak the English language (with the FAA's approval, of course).

We should simply do our jobs, VERBATIM (per the company's CBT) and keep on truckin'.

I would like to remind you that it's virtually impossible to replace 10,000 members overnight. Plus, the company can't replace you if your doing your job! Especially in mediated sessions. The problem is the unity amongst the troops. There is none. Unfortunately, we the people have our own agendas, and not neccessarily the agenda that will satisfy all the troops. Although we call ourselves a union, the bottom line is ......it's about me! Just look at the differences between the line stations and the bases, and between the title groups.
Let's go back to 2003. Title 2 proposal for 1/2 pay for sick time in exchange to save 1300 positions. Well, we all got the shaft and title 2 lost a bunch of jobs anyway. How did we benefit by that ridiculous manuever.

 

[odie01]

Mr. Strikeforce:

You are correct - those clamoring for a strike are more on the side of the company - ie, the bean counters get an out to file for bankruptcy and blame someone else for their problems. Personally, I do my job the best way I know how and follow the rules set forth by those who "knoweth not WTF they do".

We have been trained to do our jobs verbatim by the company's computer based training (aka CBT, insituted after the failure of engineering to specify a tolerance re: wire tie spacing) and I feel it's time we paid attention to that training which the company decided we needed as a CYA measure for them. As said training rightfully points out, not following all technical pubs, GPM, and other other directives is cause for "corrective action" and we certainly wouldn't want that to happen to anyone in our ranks who actually works for a living.

That said, let the FAs and pilots do their thing as they are the only groups that can actually do anything re: pressure on the company via job actions - we, the Title 1 Mekaniks, are too easy to replace with third-world residents unable to speak the English language (with the FAA's approval, of course).

We should simply do our jobs, VERBATIM (per the company's CBT) and keep on truckin'.

verbatim
adverb
exactly - to the letter - word for word - closely - precisely - literally - faithfully

First of all we should all be using 100% compliance with all maintenance procedures and the GPM, that's what the the flying public, FAA, and the company requires, and exspects. Second, why is it considered a job action if our local union presidents formally remind their members to do this?
Bob, have you utilized the twu lawyer?

 

[strikeforce]

First of all we should all be using 100% compliance with all maintenance procedures and the GPM, that's what the the flying public, FAA, and the company requires, and exspects. Second, why is it considered a job action if our local union presidents formally remind their members to do this?
Bob, have you utilized the twu lawyer?

It's considered a job action anytime you're doing your job, except during a CASS or FAA Audit.

 

[787nightmare]

It's considered a job action anytime you're doing your job, except during a CASS or FAA Audit.

Be that as it may...they(the company)would be hard pressed to get any traction with the feds, or a court for that matter, making that accusation against an employee('job action"). But I hear ya...I know the deal.

 

[Frank Szabo]

Be that as it may...they(the company)would be hard pressed to get any traction with the feds, or a court for that matter, making that accusation against an employee('job action"). But I hear ya...I know the deal.

... especially after the computer based training we had to do telling us to do follow the books exactly ... were they "just kidding" by making us complete the CBT??

 

[Interested]

It's considered a job action anytime you're doing your job, except during a CASS or FAA Audit.

We were told by our supervisor a couples days ago to follow the paper word for word. If we run across something not right, stop until it gets corrected.

 

[odie01]

We were told by our supervisor a couples days ago to follow the paper word for word. If we run across something not right, stop until it gets corrected.

Unfortunately, following the paperwork and working by the rules requires effort, and some may not want to jeopardize the sweet deals they cut with management ie; two doubles and a single, unlimited CS's, adjusted start and stop times, etc. Remember it's a ME, ME, union, run by the company, for those of us who do our job we are held hostage by the twu, for those of us who cut deals, we are under the preverbial thumb.

 

[Bob Owens]

You are correct - those clamoring for a strike are more on the side of the company - ie, the bean counters get an out to file for bankruptcy and blame someone else for their problems.

That said, let the FAs and pilots do their thing as they are the only groups that can actually do anything re: pressure on the company via job actions - we, the Title 1 Mekaniks, are too easy to replace with third-world residents unable to speak the English language (with the FAA's approval, of course).

I disagree on both counts.

They dont need to blame anyone if they want to file, and they dont want a strike. There isn't enough savings to be had in maintenance anyway, if there was AA would not have over 1000 people on payroll without system protection with plans to try and add 900 more, they would have sent the work out if they could get it done cheaper.

If you are not willing to strike then you are willing to accept more concessions, its as simple as that.

You can take the position of "I want it but I dont want to fight for it" thinking that you are being safe but then the pilots could go on strike and shut the place down anyway. So you see there is no "safe way"because there are so many variables that we have absolutely no control over, you can not avoid the risk, you can only avoid the potential gain.

Pilots are the hardest to replace, after that its mechanics. I think AA would have a very hard time replacing 3000 mechanics let alone 9,000. Stop devalueing yourself, remember that what comes so easy to you does so because you've been at it for 20plus years. You are not as easily replaced as they have led you to believe. AA had initially planned to start the I-checks (CFP) Jan 1, but they had to push it back to Feb because they could not get the manpower in place. Now, from what I've seen it doesnt look like Feb 1 will pan out either. 15 million would rather stay unemployed than work for the airlines. At least they can spend weekends and holidays with their families.

 

[odie01]

Dear Brothers and Sisters,
Your fellow employees that make up the Association of Maintenance
Professionals Organizing Committee would like to wish all of you a
Happy New Year. It is our hope that 2011 will finally be the year that
we get a chance to vote on who should represent our craft and class. As
most of you know, we started the AMP drive in July of last year, and it will
run through the end of June this year. Your Organizing Committee has worked
very hard these past six months of the drive, and is happy to report that we currently have more
than ⅔ of the required signed authorization cards to file for a representation vote. Being this close
to a representation vote, it is time that we redouble our efforts to spread the word to earn the trust
of those who have yet to make up their minds, so that our collective voice will finally be heard. We
would like to take a moment to address some of the half-truths and outright lies that the TWU has
said about the AMP.
1) TWU Lie: AMP is only for A&P mechanics.
This is totally false. AMP will represent all workers within the Mechanic and Related craft and class
as defined by the National Mediation Board. In addition, those workers in the Stores craft and class
are welcome to join. Above all, our goal is that everyone in our craft and classes will feel welcome as
part of the union. The Organizing Committee even designed the name to include all “Maintenance
Professionals.”
2) TWU Lie: AMP is just a bunch of radicals.
We are not radical, unless you think expecting to get a fair contract after nearly 8 years of
concessions is considered radical. Can we expect to get everything back we lost in 2003? Probably
not, but we should expect to make some real gains back towards where we were in 2003. Do we
think that working together is a bad thing? No, not necessarily, however there has to be real value to
our Members if we are going to do it. Finally, we do not think that it is radical to demand that our
union be democratic, and that the salaries of its leaders are tied directly to the wages of the
Members.
3) TWU Lie: AMP is not registered with the government and has no backing.
Again, both are false. The Organizing Committee has filed the paperwork required by law to be
recognized as a union. Also, we have lawyers on retainer to do whatever is required to represent
your interest when we file the cards and win the election. Ironically, the law firm that we retained is
also the same law firm that helped the AA pilot’s breakaway from ALPA back in 1963 by forming the
APA.
4) TWU Lie: AMP wants to combine title 1 and 2 seniority list.
This is completely false. We don’t know where this came from, but for the record we have no
intention of combining the 2 groups.
In conclusion, your Organizing Committee believes that maintenance, whether it be an electrician,
plumber, machinist, welder, carpenter, or a mechanic, both licensed and unlicensed, are shrinking
professions, which make our skills more valuable with every passing day. In fact, in the next 10 to 15
years most of us are going to reach retirement age. What this means is that the company will need to
start hiring the next generation of maintenance professionals, so that we can pass our knowledge
onto them. The Organizing Committee believes that we need to start using the OSM position as an
apprenticeship, and not just an excuse to pay people less. Finally, we believe the time has come for
the voice of the Members to be heard, so that all of us, regardless of our particular job title can be
united and move forward together with a union created by the Membership, run by the
Membership, and held accountable by the Membership. With this in mind, we ask you to go to our
website www.ampnational.org and read the constitution, ask questions, and please sign a card so we
can call for a vote. Cards can be printed from the AMP website if you need more.
Fraternally,
The AMP Organizing Committee

 

[Deleted member 14439]

"follow the manual". "verbatim" "by the book" we do this then the operation grinds to a halt. Dailey we are expected to find a way to "get it done". The most recent debacle at AFW...they took nearly all safety harness ots for inspection/calibration. Completely stupid. Yeah, we stopped on that one.Slowed things down quite a bit as only a handful of harnesses were available. Brake bleed carts...lmao if it was not so so sad. Nearly everytime we have to canibalize from 3 or 4 carts to get 2 servicable. That is is we have that many carts. Personally I refuse to jump thru hoops and fix tool room junk. We have people to do that. Ground equipment is in the same sorry state of disrepair or we just don`t have it.
Why do I vent my frustration? Because I`m sick of hearing how "unproductive" we are. We need productivity improvements to compete? If we have what we need when we need it then the productivity is there. It`s comical when I bring these concerns to local operational management. "Generate a B.I.G. ticket" they say or "call it in". This is where the disconnect begins. Local management has zero clue as to what is needed.
I`m tired of banging my head against the wall. However some of my fellow AMTs continue to "find a way". ARRRGGGGHHHHHHH........................Rant over...That is all

 

[midnights]

"follow the manual". "verbatim" "by the book" we do this then the operation grinds to a halt. Dailey we are expected to find a way to "get it done". The most recent debacle at AFW...they took nearly all safety harness ots for inspection/calibration. Completely stupid. Yeah, we stopped on that one.Slowed things down quite a bit as only a handful of harnesses were available. Brake bleed carts...lmao if it was not so so sad. Nearly everytime we have to canibalize from 3 or 4 carts to get 2 servicable. That is is we have that many carts. Personally I refuse to jump thru hoops and fix tool room junk. We have people to do that. Ground equipment is in the same sorry state of disrepair or we just don`t have it.
Why do I vent my frustration? Because I`m sick of hearing how "unproductive" we are. We need productivity improvements to compete? If we have what we need when we need it then the productivity is there. It`s comical when I bring these concerns to local operational management. "Generate a B.I.G. ticket" they say or "call it in". This is where the disconnect begins. Local management has zero clue as to what is needed.
I`m tired of banging my head against the wall. However some of my fellow AMTs continue to "find a way". ARRRGGGGHHHHHHH........................Rant over...That is all

And I thought it was just the equipment at DFW that was crap........

 

[strikeforce]

"follow the manual". "verbatim" "by the book" we do this then the operation grinds to a halt. Dailey we are expected to find a way to "get it done". The most recent debacle at AFW...they took nearly all safety harness ots for inspection/calibration. Completely stupid. Yeah, we stopped on that one.Slowed things down quite a bit as only a handful of harnesses were available. Brake bleed carts...lmao if it was not so so sad. Nearly everytime we have to canibalize from 3 or 4 carts to get 2 servicable. That is is we have that many carts. Personally I refuse to jump thru hoops and fix tool room junk. We have people to do that. Ground equipment is in the same sorry state of disrepair or we just don`t have it.
Why do I vent my frustration? Because I`m sick of hearing how "unproductive" we are. We need productivity improvements to compete? If we have what we need when we need it then the productivity is there. It`s comical when I bring these concerns to local operational management. "Generate a B.I.G. ticket" they say or "call it in". This is where the disconnect begins. Local management has zero clue as to what is needed.
I`m tired of banging my head against the wall. However some of my fellow AMTs continue to "find a way". ARRRGGGGHHHHHHH........................Rant over...That is all

calm down my brother! not worth having a grabber over AA!

Management hasn't had a clue in decades, and they never will. In my original message about "doing your job" and how AA doesn't want you to do your job verabatim unless it's during a CASS or FAA Audits", this is exactly what the membership needs to do in order to 1) protect your license with the feds i.e. CYA 2) send AA a message that we are unified. 3) pressure management to come to the table and negotiate. Period.
Look, if we stand around and expect AA to just give you a contract with realized gains in wages and benefits, your fooling yourselves. It's pretty obvious that our TWU Leadership works for the company and not you or me. So, we have to help ourselves and take the bull by the horns. It's been 8 years of concessions.....how long are the mechanics willing to wait for a real deal, and not one that continuously bring back more concessions? I was ready for war back in 2003! Now fast forward 8 years.....what has changed? Nothing! Management continues to benefit from the concessions....every day that passes, management saves a million dollars. Why would they be in any hurry to negotiate a deal? I keep saying it "we need to bring AA to the table"....the only way is when you hurt this company in the pocketbook! Period!

 

[DallasConehead]

"follow the manual". "verbatim" "by the book" we do this then the operation grinds to a halt. Dailey we are expected to find a way to "get it done". The most recent debacle at AFW...they took nearly all safety harness ots for inspection/calibration. Completely stupid. Yeah, we stopped on that one.Slowed things down quite a bit as only a handful of harnesses were available. Brake bleed carts...lmao if it was not so so sad. Nearly everytime we have to canibalize from 3 or 4 carts to get 2 servicable. That is is we have that many carts. Personally I refuse to jump thru hoops and fix tool room junk. We have people to do that. Ground equipment is in the same sorry state of disrepair or we just don`t have it.
Why do I vent my frustration? Because I`m sick of hearing how "unproductive" we are. We need productivity improvements to compete? If we have what we need when we need it then the productivity is there. It`s comical when I bring these concerns to local operational management. "Generate a B.I.G. ticket" they say or "call it in". This is where the disconnect begins. Local management has zero clue as to what is needed.
I`m tired of banging my head against the wall. However some of my fellow AMTs continue to "find a way". ARRRGGGGHHHHHHH........................Rant over...That is all

And I thought it was just the equipment at DFW that was crap........

These kinds of problems, tooling, equipment, parts.. IMO every airline experiences the same problems. Its part of the business. Go with the flow, don't have a coronary over it, if management keeps their blood pressure low, or even if they got excited about it, why bother raising yours? Life is to short brothers. Follow the manuals, stay safe, do what you can and leave the rest.