Tulsa AMT movement.

[WorldTraveler]

Interesting that TULE is the largest maint. facility in North America but somehow WT says not only is Delta (who farms out all kinds of maint.) comparative but it is superior.  I did some work (in Tulsa) for the superior Delta airlines that they couldn't handle in Atlanta. Then their crack mechanics were calling me wanting to know how we did what they couldn't. I referred them to the tech department who is about as stupid as they are. The TWU also let them overhaul some 727s back in the day and then we had to work on them for two weeks apiece to make them flyable for the paying passengers when the ace mechanics at Delta were done with them.  WT you don't know dick about maintenance so quit trying to act like you do.  I swear Delta should be paying you to sing their friken company song.  You just don't know when to shut up about anything.  We are AMTs and licensed by the FAA and we know what we are talking about.  Delta is a glorified scab airline and their maintenance is nowhere near AAs and never has been.  Go haunt someone else's blog and quit pretending to know anything about maintenance.  My cousin is a retired gate agent for Delta and even he agrees they are scabs.  Now go look at your Weekly Reader and leave the adults alone.  The fact is TULE is superior to any other maintenance base in the U.S. and that is known throughout the industry.  Even in Atlanta.  Now go away.

first of all, you didn't even quote what I said correctly so it is no surprise that you came to the wrong conclusion.

I did not say that DL has the largest maintenance facility.

I said that DL Tech Ops is the largest airline maintenance MRO in the western hemisphere.

your argument is no different than arguing that AA is the largest airline because it has the most aircraft.

the number of aircraft in the fleet does not mean anything until those aircraft are used to generate revenue. DL and UA have far fewer aircraft but generate comparable revenue - which says they use their fleet more efficiently for revenue production. AA is still early in the merger process but the reason why DL and WN have had such high Return on Invested Capital is in part because they use their fleet more efficiently.

and having DL's major maintenance base in a city that is their largest hub helps; AA has maintenance and fleet inefficiencies because TUL is so far from a hub. Don't think that AA hasn't quantified that cost and figures it into total cost of doing business there.

and in terms of the "superiority" of what DL produces, show us the comparable stats regarding maintenance efficiency. There isn't an airline in the US and perhaps in the world that is generating reliability AND cost stats as good as what DL Tech Ops is doing.

 

[JFK Fleet Service]

http://www.lufthansa-technik.com/about-us

 

[WorldTraveler]

not sure of your point but LH is not based in the western hemisphere or have the majority of its operations there.

btw, you do know where Lufthansa Technik Component Services is headquartered?

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

http://www.lufthansa-technik.com/about-us

 
I know exactly what you were saying, but, and this is very very very important here, you missed the qualifier / disclaimer, without which the DL is the best narrative does not work.
 

I did not say that DL has the largest maintenance facility.

I said that DL Tech Ops is the largest airline maintenance MRO in the western hemisphere.
 

 
And ofcourse World Fraudster nicely reminds you of that here (thrown in a nice backhanded compliment at no extra charge).
 

not sure of your point but LH is not based in the western hemisphere or have the majority of its operations there.

btw, you do know where Lufthansa Technik Component Services is headquartered?

 
Now, if one wants the Whole Truth, then check this out:
 
1)  mighty DL does not make this list (2012 total airframe man-hours by corporate entities): 
 
2012 total airframe man-hours by corporate entities
1. Singapore Technologies Aerospace / 11.5 million
2. Haeco Group / 7.4 million
3. AAR Corp. / 4.6 million
4. SIA Engineering Co. / 4.2 million
5. Lufthansa Technik / 4.1 million
6. AFI KLME&M / 3.9 million
7. Timco Aviation Services / 3.2 million
8. Ameco Beijing / 2.8 million
9. Mubadala Aerospace* / 2.5 million
10. Iberia Maintenance / 2.3 million
* Includes ADAT and SR Technics
http://aviationweek.com/mro/aviation-week-ranks-biggest-airframe-mros
 
 
 
2)  mighty DL does not make this list either:  http://aviationweek.com/awin/aviation-week-ranks-biggest-airframe-mros
 2012 Highest Revenues of MRO Providers in millions of $ U.S.
Company 2012 Revenue 2012 Gross/Operating Profit
Lufthansa Technik $5,210 $4131
AFI KLM E&M 3,134 143
AAR Corp. 2,065 1312
Singapore Technologies Aerospace 2,019 3043
Mubadala Aerospace 1,140 n/a
SIA Engineering Co. 907 101
Haeco Group4 751 61
Iberia 589 n/a
Ameco Beijing 488 n/a
Timco n/a n/a
 
3)  mighty DL does not make this list either:  http://aviationweek.com/awc/top-10-airframe-mros
 
Rank Company 2010 Third-party Airframe Man-hours By Corporate Entities
1 Singapore Technologies Aerospace 8.78 million
2 Haeco/Taeco/Staeco 6.02 million
3 AAR Corp. 3.46 million
4 Israel Aerospace Industries/Bedek Aviation Group** 3.1 million
5 Aveos Fleet Performance*** 2.6 million
6 Abu Dhabi Aircraft Technologies/SR Technics**** 2.54 million
7 Malaysian Aerospace Engineering 2.5 million
8 Timco Aviation Services 2.22 million
9 SIA Engineering Co. 2.07 million 1
0 Aviation Technical Services 2 million
10 Sabena technics 2 million  
 
Company 2010 Revenue (USD) 2010 Gross/Operating Profit (USD)
Singapore Technologies Aerospace $1,519,766,513 $280,148,613
Haeco Group $548,832,079 $90,185,056
Malaysian Aerospace Engineering $820,000,000 $170,000,000
SIA Engineering Co. $900,365,773 $110,382,825
AFI KLM E&M releasing May 19 releasing May 19
AAR Corp.* $1,661,000,000 $288,000,000
Israel Aerospace Industries $3,148,000,000 $455,000,000
Aveos Fleet Performance would not disclose would not disclose
EgyptAir Maintenance & Engineering would not disclose would not disclose
Abu Dhabi Aircraft Technologies/SR Technics would not disclose would not disclose
Lufthansa Technik** $5,771,926,192 $385,365,075  
 
Company % Capacity Utilized in 2010
Singapore Technologies Aerospace 96%
Haeco/Taeco/Staeco 75%
Malaysian Aerospace Engineering 91%
SIA Engineering Co. would not disclose
AAR Corp. 87%
AFI KLM E&M 96%
Israel Aerospace Industries/Bedek Aviation Group 95%
Aveos Fleet Maintenance 88%
Egyptair Maintenance & Engineering 85%
Abu Dhabi Aircraft Technologies/SR Technics would not disclose
Ameco Beijing 83% Timco Aviation Services 84%
Aviation Technical Services would not disclose
Sabena technics 80%
Pemco World Air Services ~46%
TAP Maintenance & Engineering 46%
 
 
While I'm not surprised that a crappy company like AA doesn't make the list isn't it amazing that DL, such a super duper mighty global carrier, a 5 continent and omni-directional hub operator, doesn't make it in the top 10.
 
Get ready for some major spin and deflections in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, ......

 

[WorldTraveler]

DL does not publish its revenues or operational stats from TechOps on an MRO basis.

All they do is separate out the size of their total non-airline revenues which amounted to $850 million in 2014.

We have several other businesses arising from our airline operations, including aircraft maintenance, repair and overhaul (“MRO”), staffing
services for third parties, vacation wholesale operations and our private jet operations. In 2014, the total revenue from these businesses was
approximately $850 million.
- Delta SEC form 10K, page 5, dated 2/11/15

DL Tech Ops clearly does not choose to release statistics that allow it be ranked with other global MROs.

And yet DL Tech Ops makes the statement that it is the largest airline MRO in the Americas. If you believe they have told a lie, please report them to the appropriate governmental authorities.

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

DL Tech Ops clearly does not choose to release statistics that allow it be ranked with other global MROs.

But that hasn't stopped you from comparing & ranking DL Tech Ops with others.
 

And yet DL Tech Ops makes the statement that it is the largest airline MRO in the Americas. If you believe they have told a lie, please report them to the appropriate governmental authorities.

I think you're attacking a straw man here.

 

[WorldTraveler]

no, you are attacking a straw man.

DL has repeatedly made the size claims regarding its size.

They do not have to reveal the exact size of their revenues from other sources given the size of each of those sources other than to note them and provide them in total.

DL lists its MRO services first in the list of other revenue sources which is consistent with accounting practices as that MRO services are first but publicly has not been revealed.

in contrast, I don't believe AA or UA list its MRO revenues to be any significant amount. feel free to provide the quote otherwise if you have data otherwise. AA lists TAESL as a subsidiary but does not provide any value for its revenues that are credited to AA's financial statements.

again, you can't accept that DL actually does a significant amount of MRO work which other US airlines do not do.

save the personal attacks... it is all part of the way you are known to operate.

and MRO revenues are only a side part of this conversation.

the MRO side of the equation is relevant because the cost of major facility upgrades can be paid for by TUL or by a maintenance joint venture partner (such as Rolls Royce for TAESL).

or it can be paid for by AA totally from its own resources and solely for maintenance of AA's own fleet.

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

Pointing out valid flaws in your DL rules the world narrative, including the fact that DL Tech Ops is not the be all and end all of MROs your are making it out to be is now considered a personal attack?

 

[WorldTraveler]

no one said that discussing DL Tech Ops is a personal attack.

attacking other users because they highlight things you do not want to see is the problem.

the topic is TUL and as a side issue MRO operations.

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

Then why did you attack me for posting the Aviationweek  data highlighting your mis-representation of DL Tech Ops?

 

[WorldTraveler]

Then why did you attack me for posting the Aviationweek data highlighting your mis-representation of DL Tech Ops?

I'm sorry but if you think there is any personal attack of you in this post, then you need to get psychological help.

 

DL does not publish its revenues or operational stats from TechOps on an MRO basis.

All they do is separate out the size of their total non-airline revenues which amounted to $850 million in 2014.

We have several other businesses arising from our airline operations, including aircraft maintenance, repair and overhaul (“MRO”), staffing
services for third parties, vacation wholesale operations and our private jet operations. In 2014, the total revenue from these businesses was
approximately $850 million.
- Delta SEC form 10K, page 5, dated 2/11/15

DL Tech Ops clearly does not choose to release statistics that allow it be ranked with other global MROs.

And yet DL Tech Ops makes the statement that it is the largest airline MRO in the Americas. If you believe they have told a lie, please report them to the appropriate governmental authorities.

you and others have repeatedly demonstrated that you wear your loyalty to AA way too close to your own chest that you can't engage in a civil discussion and your post here highlights.

the internet is clearly not the place for you to engage in conversation with other people.

Hang around with people that will not say anything that won't ruffle your feathers or say anything critical about organizations to which you belong.

once again, DL has made the statement that Tech Ops is the largest airline MRO in the Americas. If you do not believe that is true, challenge them or file a complaint with the appropriate government authorities.

the topic here is TUL and inhouse and airline MRO services.

plz return to it.

 

[Buck]

first of all, you didn't even quote what I said correctly so it is no surprise that you came to the wrong conclusion.

I did not say that DL has the largest maintenance facility.

I said that DL Tech Ops is the largest airline maintenance MRO in the western hemisphere.

your argument is no different than arguing that AA is the largest airline because it has the most aircraft.

the number of aircraft in the fleet does not mean anything until those aircraft are used to generate revenue. DL and UA have far fewer aircraft but generate comparable revenue - which says they use their fleet more efficiently for revenue production. AA is still early in the merger process but the reason why DL and WN have had such high Return on Invested Capital is in part because they use their fleet more efficiently.

and having DL's major maintenance base in a city that is their largest hub helps; AA has maintenance and fleet inefficiencies because TUL is so far from a hub. Don't think that AA hasn't quantified that cost and figures it into total cost of doing business there.

and in terms of the "superiority" of what DL produces, show us the comparable stats regarding maintenance efficiency. There isn't an airline in the US and perhaps in the world that is generating reliability AND cost stats as good as what DL Tech Ops is doing.

The flight distance from Tulsa International Airport (TUL) to Dallas Fort Worth International Airport (DFW) is 238 miles (383 kilometers,207 nautical miles).

Flight Duration
Estimated flight time is 0 h 57 min.

Time Difference
Time difference between Tulsa and Dallas is 0 Hours. Current local time in Tulsa is 2015-03-26, 15:21 CDT and time in Dallas is 2015-03-26, 15:21 CDT.

 

[WorldTraveler]

Can you tell us how many major global MROs are at airports that don't have scheduled widebody service (to cost efficiently carry engine cores) and/or where the nearest airport with scheduled int'l service is a 4 or more hour drive by truck away?

 

[Buck]

Can you tell us how many major global MROs are at airports that don't have scheduled widebody service (to cost efficiently carry engine cores) and/or where the nearest airport with scheduled int'l service is a 4 or more hour drive by truck away?

No, waiting on you?

 

[700UW]

Singapore Technologies at Berkeley field at Mobile (BFM).

They do work on all kinds of wide bodies and there is zero scheduled flights.

AA runs trucks several round trips a day between DFW and TUL.

SAT has several MROs and no wide body flights.

Gateway airport in PHX, Timco at INT, GSO and Lake City, FL

Shall I continue?