Pilot Pension Anger is Growing & Enormous

[ClueByFour]

I'm a bit baffled by this "Dave screwed us in front of the Senate" routine.

Did ALPA (the MEC, the membership, both) really think that nobody would ever _ask_ Dave what the alternatives are? Or that Congress would bail out _1_ underfunded pension? If so, I'm not entirely comfortable with the judgement of some of these individuals.

If not, then it's all a farce to precipitate labor unrest on ALPA's part. I'd say that the real fault here probably lies with the Airways MEC--they saw the books, and had to have seen this coming down the pike.

If the place gets burned down by actions on the pilot's part, the irony is that the PBGC minimum is all any pilot will ever see. Again, I thought ALPA was typically the most rational of the unions. We'll see.

 

[cat 111]

I guess the pilot group was the only one who thought Dave was "LABOR FRIENDLY".As Chipper would say $28,000 from the pbgc is better then $0.

 

[AIRMAIL]

Chip,
Welcome to the BOHICA CLUB.

 

[cat 111]

Welcome to the real world.

 

[autofixer]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 1/17/2003 948 AM cat 111 wrote:

Welcome to the real world.
----------------
[/blockquote]The "real world" is out here starting a business so that I can hire people so that they may have jobs.

My pension will be what I create, after Dave terminates my "vested" U retirement.

 

[michael707767]

[blockquote]
----------------
The distress termination of the pilots pension plan is a windfall to the Company in that it no longer has the ongoing responsibility of a defined benefit plan for pilots. The Company will retain responsibility, however, for managements’, AFA’s and the IAM’s current retirement plans.

[/blockquote]

This is Bulls##t. Frankly, if they have to cut the pilots plan, then they should cut all the plans.

 

[chipmunn]

This is Roy Freundlich with a US Airways MEC update for Thursday, January 16 with two new items:

Item 1. President and CEO David Siegel sent a notice today to all pilots stating that the Company was actively pursuing a legislative solution to the pilots pension plan and, if that fails, will pursue a distress termination of the plan with the PBGC and create a different pension plan to conform with the funding schedule in its ATSB business plan.

While this alternative would provide benefits from two plans to many pilots, under this distress termination scenario your total pension benefit will be exposed to significant reductions even with two plans--with currently retired pilots exposed to loosing significant portion of their pension income from the terminated plan.

Even with the Company saying it is committing the 30-year funding schedule to a new pension plan for pilots, ALPA remains skeptical of any Company-generated alternative.

The distress termination of the pilots pension plan is a windfall to the Company in that it no longer has the ongoing responsibility of a defined benefit plan for pilots. The Company will retain responsibility, however, for managements’, AFA’s and the IAM’s current retirement plans.

The MEC has not authorized negotiations with the Company to displace the current plan. Your MEC officers, Legislative Affairs and Communications committees will continue to pursue a legislative solution to preserve the current plan.

 

[wings396]

The pilots have been the biggest financial drain on this company for years and everyone knows it. Most of us lost our pensions in 1991 and now will be working for such a low wage that we won't be able to retire until we are 70...maybe. It was O.K. with Chip for most of us to bite the bullet and take the MDA or Express poverty scale. In the back of his mind was his BIG $$$$ pension, well kiss it goodbye buddy. Lets not try to fool everyone with how much money the pilots have already given up. If you cant live with your 100k salaries, then someting is wrong. Most of us have worked countless hours of OT just to make 50-60k a year. My heart goes out to you bunch of OVERPAID BUS DRIVERS........

 

[BottomFeeder]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 1/17/2003 11:02:47 AM Biffeman wrote:

Why should they? Your plan is the over 70% of the short fall, lets do the math, 70% of $3.1 billion is
$2,170,000,000 all the other plans combined is $930,000,000. Too bad so sad, guess you guess are getting a taste of what everyone else has had to eat for years.
----------------
[/blockquote]
Hey Biffeman,

You need to stop drinking the BLUE FLUID. Your brain is getting brain freeze from the BLUE SLURPIE.

Now since your are a BOSS. You seem to think you have a position of superior status. YOU DON'T

Well my freind, the numbers can be made to show what ever the bean counter whats to show. SILLY BIFFE

In reguards to the eating thing. BIFFE, IT'S NOT A SNICKERS BAR. STOP EATING IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[atlmd80]

I would like to make two observations. 1) If the ALPA leadership thought they would get through this bk with their pension intact they were just nuts. 2) If the PBGC does a distressed termination a couple of things are going to happen. First the actuaries will guess at the PBGC liability for the pilots pension. Next, the PBGC will check that number against U's amount paid into the fund so far. If there is a difference U is responsible (in BK or out). If I were Bronner I would be a little bit nervous. I think the PBGC gets to bump in line for the pick of assets to cover the shortfall.

 

[ua767fo]

Wings396,

Sadly, you suffer from lack of maleness syndrome, relating your self worth to the salary you receive. No, the quality of life I demand for my family requires over $100K/year. I guess yours doesnt. But thats my choice, not yours. If you felt all these years that you could have/should have done better, than you should have. You are exactly what management wants. A member of labor who will go out and bash other labor. You need to grow up and get a life.

The biggest financial drain on AAA hasn't been the pilots. Not by a long shot. Its been the inept management and poor business decisions, going back to the days of Ed Colodny and Schofield. I could write a book on this, but then, you probably could also.

Chill out .....DENVER,CO

 

[Biffeman]

Why should they? Your plan is the over 70% of the short fall, lets do the math, 70% of $3.1 billion is [BR]$2,170,000,000 all the other plans combined is $930,000,000. Too bad so sad, guess you guess are getting a taste of what everyone else has had to eat for years.

 

[Justaramper]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 1/17/2003 7:43:43 AM ISN wrote:

Chip, welcome to the BOHICA club. I joined 10 years ago when I donated my pension to you. Now my pay is being cut from $22.00 an hour to $13.05, I can't even save for my own retirement now. This while WN pays agents $25.00 an hour to do less than I, and their pension is GREAT! This is a systematic screwing of all employees. We were first to bend over, now it's your turn.
----------------
[/blockquote]
Southwest has a 401K plan like we used to have

 

[Winglet]

Dave knows what he's doing with his slow leak approach to cutting compensation . . . just like boiling a frog.

With U setting the standard, Carty's just this morning turned on the burner on his employees.

 

[BottomFeeder]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 1/17/2003 1150 AM Justaramper wrote:

[blockquote]
----------------
On 1/17/2003 7:43:43 AM ISN wrote:

Chip, welcome to the BOHICA club. I joined 10 years ago when I donated my pension to you. Now my pay is being cut from $22.00 an hour to $13.05, I can't even save for my own retirement now. This while WN pays agents $25.00 an hour to do less than I, and their pension is GREAT! This is a systematic screwing of all employees. We were first to bend over, now it's your turn.
----------------
[/blockquote]
Southwest has a 401K plan like we used to have
----------------
[/blockquote]
************************************

Chip give him his money back**** that you have. What a fool to think the pilots have his money.

Go to WN and get your job that you deserve.
BOHICA[img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/11.gif']