Negotiations........why?

[Overspeed]

 
You say that it was all answered then tell me How many Holidays are we as a collective bargaining unit going to have?  What is the rate of Pay for those Holidays? Is AA going to keep the IAMNPF and the current 401k programs? Are we all going to get the double time back or is the US side going to give it up and take what we here at AA have? How is the Crew chief seniority issue been settled. Which sides C/S Policy are we going to work under.
 
If you have all the answers then Post it for all to see.  I will never take Mgmt side  I just want the answers just like every one else.  

 
It seems as if the Association is holding their cards very close to the vest. It seems the best way to look at it is there is a negotiation (reconciliation in TWU/IAM speak) going on first before the negotiation between the Assoc and the Company.

 

[Buck]

They arent negotiating with two unions, the Association is one union.

Wow, the two unions are an Association and it only takes one group outside the AFL-CIO to form an Association at Southwest Airlines.....

 

[Buck]

 
It seems as if the Association is holding their cards very close to the vest. It seems the best way to look at it is there is a negotiation (reconciliation in TWU/IAM speak) going on first before the negotiation between the Assoc and the Company.

Yes, as long as the International's and the AFL-CIO can see those cards.

 

[700UW]

Wow, the two unions are an Association and it only takes one group outside the AFL-CIO to form an Association at Southwest Airlines.....

International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers.

And your point it?

 

[Traymark]

Ok...I apologize for the management comment if you took offense to it, but I am tired of everyone in this station giving management a free ride and helping them out, and then blaming the union for everything, and from your name you must be in Miami too.  So my bad on that if you are one of the few here with their eyes open...
 
As far as answers, I will go off of my notes from the meeting.  I tried scanning but the attachment is too large for this website.
 
On the holidays, they said we can't tell you how many the company will agree to or propose, but they did say on holidays and holiday pay that they intend to  secure USAir at a minimum--although they want more on pay and number of holidays because the USAir guys obviously want more. 
 
On the 401k, they said that they intend to keep the match and want it increased.  The IAM plan may be there as an option for new money for those who choose to want to be in it, but we would not be forced in it is their position.  Question was asked about getting the old pension back, and the answer is that it is highly unlikely the company would be agreeable to bring back the frozen pension plan.  But they will ask once at the table
 
They want double time on overtime like the old days.  
 
Crew chief issue was raised and is still being discussed.  They said local has proposed getting a mediator or arbitrator on the issue if it can't be resolved--something like that. They don't know the company position on the issue is either
 
C/S policy was talked about and they said they want a policy that is in the book but better than the USAir policy.  The same with a single day vacation policy.
 
They also want USAir line language where very little gets outsourced.  They don't know where the company is at with it till they see the company proposal.
 
And they want anything else, like sick, benefits, etc that are better on the USAir side.  They don't intend to have USAir concede anything that is better than ours
 
 
I took like 4 pages of notes and talked with them for a while after the meeting...
 
Here's a few more not contract related...there was some new medical return to work policy on jetnet they suggested reading that the local won through a grievance or something like that, something about a big grievance that the local won on the 401k match if you had a grievance, I already knew about our 401k changing plans, the union guys here get info to talk about every Friday from the president (have yet to see this here--said we should be having weekly crew meetings with the union guys--we had this at AFW and LAS(this local)), a bunch of guys complained about job continuance being a scam here and after they said what job continuance is supposed to be used for it looks like job continuance was being used wrong here, the union guys here know it, and that we should file grievances for overtime bypasses, there are lots of grievances at DFW, a few here, and almost none in LA. There was more, but that is about all of it that I wrote down.

You just posted way more info than anyone else had heard of.
What was said about the Title II issue?
AA has Title II , US has mechanic is a mechanic, no different title groups.

 

[Buck]

International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers.
And your point it?

Well, if you think it through you will get it. I said Southwest

 

[700UW]

The IAM is on WN property.

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

You just posted way more info than anyone else had heard of.
What was said about the Title II issue?
AA has Title II , US has mechanic is a mechanic, no different title groups.

 
Have not heard what was said or what the plan is for the title 2 guys here at AA, but when they attempt to merge the two seniority list per the McKaskill bond I think the Utility/Facility/automotive guys will have their own list seperate from the title 1 guys. You should ask GP at local 591 that question.
 
 

 
It seems as if the Association is holding their cards very close to the vest. It seems the best way to look at it is there is a negotiation (reconciliation in TWU/IAM speak) going on first before the negotiation between the Assoc and the Company.

 
 
If this is true who are the paticipants and why haven't we been asked for input and been told what each side has in plan.
 
Are they going to give us its a secret and what we want will come out during negotiations and we don't want to give the company any idea early? 
 
The TWU has in in the past been sworn to say nothing and my question has been who do they work for US the membership or AA.?

 

[Buck]

The IAM is on WN property.

Yes, but I am referring to AMFA being an Association. 

 

[700UW]

Duh, I know that.

 

[MetalMover]

The association agreement put the IAM in control for the first two years, your union agreed to it.

The IAM has certain things that were scheduled already that some on the NC need to attend too, especially the person running negotiations.

So the IAM is in control for the first two years.......Keep in mind, should the IAM decide to bring back  a contract which is Unacceptable to the LAA/TWU members, it will get voted DOWN!  The TWU numbers will dictate what gets voted in NOT the IAM.

 

[MetalMover]

Someone is running them and he is from the IAM, go ask your TWU reps about it.

So how about telling the membership exactly WHAT the TWU and IAM disagree on and what they reached consensus on? Is that too much to ask of an Association which was anointed bargaining agent without a vote?
 
And the same goes for Petersen..He puts a long winded letter out about how the company has not put their money where there mouths are, but yet he failed to mention what is going on between the TWU and IAM as far as their issues go.
 
Yet another reason why the association is a farce.

 

[1AA]

^^^ Could not agree more.

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

So the IAM is in control for the first two years.......Keep in mind, should the IAM decide to bring back  a contract which is Unacceptable to the LAA/TWU members, it will get voted DOWN!  The TWU numbers will dictate what gets voted in NOT the IAM.

 
MetalMover
 
Shouldn't we be thinking why the IAM was placed in charge of the Assoc. the first 2 yrs?
 
Was it done by a vote or done to prevent the TWU from having yet another failed contract here at AA. The IAM has had dealings with Parker so just maybe the assoc. felt it would be better for them to have the familiar Union in place first go around. The IAM won't be bringing back the contract the assoc. will be and as far as it getting voted down just Think about what we as a group voted in last time. Here at AA just throw a slice of pizza with a T-shirt and
bam the deal is done.
 
700UW is not even an airline employee any longer, this deal does not effect him at all he is here on this forum to stir the pot. He says he has all the inside info a secret source. We as members can't get either union to tell us but he knows, come on.
 
The unions can't force the opening of the contract, unless the company feels it will benefit them or the investors what is the incentive to open up contract early to give us anything?
Why should the company invest in negotiations when the assoc. still is infighting about what is going to be negotiated?
 
If the assoc. has some of the key points they are going to bring to the table why aren't they sharing those with the members? Shouldn't that be demanded since they work for US.
What are they (assoc.) going to dig in and say we won't accept less than this?
 
Why isn't the TWU putting out what the IAM feels is sticking point for them. Why is it all a guess?
 
If the IAM is going to be in charge why aren't they telling the AA employees that the TWU is, in their opinion not looking out for the best interest of the total group? This can be done with constructive criticism. It is to benefit the assoc. against the company during the negotiation process.
 
Unless the dues paying members from the IAM/TWU assoc. demand to know we as a group will get just what DP and AA feel we deserve. Our voting history proves that.

 

[700UW]

It does effect me.