Negotiations........why?

[cltrat]

yep they are sympathetic only when the cash is right

 

[Overspeed]

5L,
Chuck believed that the line locals had control but they did not. They were fighting amongst themselves, the ATD, and the Int'l while at the same time we had AMFA organizing drives going on during 2003 and 2010. No plan and no focus is why the line local and 567 plans could not be fulfilled.
 
Stall on negotiations? Maybe but not likely. Scope and work rules must be reconciled. Pay isn't everything. AA (US really) mgmt wants greater outsourcing. Isom intimated that during several of the town halls.

 

[Real tired]

 
 
 
The immediate issue is to what extant can the TWU Contract provisions be reconciled with the IAM Contract provisions in the fairest and most expedient way to both parties. The inability to do that will put us on the same path as the USAir and America West Pilots experienced. Years of frustration with no resolution that served to bring both Union groups together, so they could mutually deal with a Management who took advantage of the opportunity given them by the Unions fighting each other.
 
TWU members have elected Local Presidents who are on the Negotiating Committee, and represent the majority of members in most Title groups. Members, whether TWU or IAM, have the same career goals & aspirations. There is no doubt it will take a lot of common sense and leadership on both sides to find the most appropriate solutions, and adjustments will have to be made. However, a divided work force will not get us the contract we’ve all earned and deserve.
 
We’re all focused on correcting the inadequacies in our current agreements and the Negotiating Committee knows that. But anyone one who believes we can rush the process and not give our Committee Members at least a reasonable opportunity to achieve that goal may find themselves with a less than acceptable agreement. 

Let me shorten it for 'ya.
 
"Big raise coming."
"Huge increase in the pension multiplier"
 
Years later....................
 
"It's the best we could do."
"They were tough negotiators."

 

[Buck]

5L,
Chuck believed that the line locals had control but they did not. They were fighting amongst themselves, the ATD, and the Int'l while at the same time we had AMFA organizing drives going on during 2003 and 2010. No plan and no focus is why the line local and 567 plans could not be fulfilled.
 
Stall on negotiations? Maybe but not likely. Scope and work rules must be reconciled. Pay isn't everything. AA (US really) mgmt wants greater outsourcing. Isom intimated that during several of the town halls.

Pay might not be everything to you but I guarantee pay means a lot to the membership. The Association is 4% and DL +7% behind the Pilots and FA's , let alone the Gain sharing. I see it as theft.

 

[Chuck Schalk]

5L,
Chuck believed that the line locals had control but they did not. They were fighting amongst themselves, the ATD, and the Int'l while at the same time we had AMFA organizing drives going on during 2003 and 2010. No plan and no focus is why the line local and 567 plans could not be fulfilled.
 
Stall on negotiations? Maybe but not likely. Scope and work rules must be reconciled. Pay isn't everything. AA (US really) mgmt wants greater outsourcing. Isom intimated that during several of the town halls.

wrong again overspun,  we were not fighting amongst ourselves, were you there?
I was fighting my own union rail road a concessionary contract to the members.  the worst part about it that the twu atd had no fight, no plan, and only one direction to give the company all their concessions!   that is what was really going on.   We did not negotiate with the company face to face, only ATD officials would go upstairs talk to management and then come back and say what they said.  The TWU ATD was only pushing what concessions to give back to satisfy the company.  That is what i was upset about and fighting against.  The memebers were being lied to as well.   Fact:  Sonny Hall told us all at the presidents council to go back to our members and tell them that we are fighting for them and we did not do anything all week!   wouldn.t you be upset over this?
 
if you are going to tell a story.......tell the whole story

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

Stall on negotiations? Maybe but not likely. 

?
 

 Pay isn't everything. 

?
 

AA (US really) mgmt wants greater outsourcing.

What they really want is cheap labor.
 
Some things should not be bought on the cheap. Life and death mechanical repairs are one of those things.
 
I don't want cheap labor working on the aircraft I am traveling on, I want a professional. I am a big believer in you get what you pay for. 

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

Chuck believed that the line locals had control but they did not. They were fighting amongst themselves, the ATD, and the Int'l while at the same time we had AMFA organizing drives going on during 2003 and 2010. No plan and no focus is why the line local and 567 plans could not be fulfilled.

wrong again overspun,  we were not fighting amongst ourselves, were you there?
I was fighting my own union rail road a concessionary contract to the members.  the worst part about it that the twu atd had no fight, no plan, and only one direction to give the company all their concessions!   that is what was really going on.   We did not negotiate with the company face to face, only ATD officials would go upstairs talk to management and then come back and say what they said.  The TWU ATD was only pushing what concessions to give back to satisfy the company.  That is what i was upset about and fighting against.  The memebers were being lied to as well.   Fact:  Sonny Hall told us all at the presidents council to go back to our members and tell them that we are fighting for them and we did not do anything all week!   wouldn.t you be upset over this?
 
if you are going to tell a story.......tell the whole story

I guess it comes down to which one of you people find more credible.

 

[Overspeed]

5L,
Well we know Chuck wasn't there. He quit his position as an officer. He was never there at the table during any part of negotiations since early openers. Sonny Hall left in 2004 and Schalk and Owens were removed in August 2003. A judge even agreed that your's and Owens actions were unbecoming of officers of the union. You guys were too busy hate and discontent trying to get AMFA in instead of trying to do anything at the table.
 
https://casetext.com/case/schalk-v-transport-workers-union-of-america
 
"The Court finds that the discipline imposed was not in retaliation for the exercise by Schalk and Owens of their membership rights as union members; and no rational jury could find otherwise. Instead, they were removed from office because of their conduct that was unbecoming to their office. This determination was made only after adequate notice of the charges was provided, and was followed by a fair hearing at which all charges and defenses could be aired."

 

[Chuck Schalk]

5L,
Well we know Chuck wasn't there. He quit his position as an officer. He was never there at the table during any part of negotiations since early openers. Sonny Hall left in 2004 and Schalk and Owens were removed in August 2003. A judge even agreed that your's and Owens actions were unbecoming of officers of the union. You guys were too busy hate and discontent trying to get AMFA in instead of trying to do anything at the table.
 
https://casetext.com/case/schalk-v-transport-workers-union-of-america
 
"The Court finds that the discipline imposed was not in retaliation for the exercise by Schalk and Owens of their membership rights as union members; and no rational jury could find otherwise. Instead, they were removed from office because of their conduct that was unbecoming to their office. This determination was made only after adequate notice of the charges was provided, and was followed by a fair hearing at which all charges and defenses could be aired."

again not the whole story overspun:
1- the judge did not agree with the charges only that the charges were conducted properly under the twu constitution and our claim of retaliation was not proven.
2- I witnessed at the table in 2003 how the TWU ATD had their hands in the negotiations.  How many roll calls were used against counter proposals we made?
3- how many times was debate eliminated on a hot issue by use of "calling for the question" which ended any debate and the proposal got voted on right then and there?
4- how many times did Randy Macdonald and title 2 take a break when things got hot and immediately after the break have a new game plan? who did they meet with on the break?  Oh yeah, Yingst and gless our atd reps
5- how many times did Art Luby the TWU attorney pull me out of the meeting to tell me I am disrupting the negotiations?
6- what was i disrupting?  I was vehemently arguing to keep system protection, shift differential, 2 weeks vacation for new hires, the pension, scope, benefits cap and trying to stop the slaughter of our contract without a fight by our union.
7- how we came to the concessions was simple and disturbing to me:  we were give a laundry list of of our contract with a cost to every part of our contract.  Everything had a dollar amount attached to it.  all we were told to do was pick from the list to reach 315 million dollars what the company wanted in concessions, thats it!
no fight, just pick your poison and screw your members.
8- I was extremely against this one way type of negotiation and I was told i was disrupting negotiations.
9- yes , I was upset and still I am upset that the whole story is not told  by TWU loyalist as to what really goes on.
10- That is why I coined the phrase "TWU is the leading concessionary union"  there is proof
11- just look at the industry now, management using all the TWU concessions in their negotiations at SWA and United.
12-  Just what i was afraid of happened,  we have set the bar so low for the industry in so many areas.
13- so yes, if doing my job and fighting for the members is considerd "conduct unbecoming" under the TWU watch. then so be it.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

Overspeed you lost the crowd when you said this.

Well we know Chuck wasn't there. He quit his position as an officer. 

 
People in an officer position with no integrity just go with the flow.
 
Chuck did not go with the flow.

 

[Overspeed]

5L,
Can't fight for your members when you are a quitter. How well was your position represented (Chuck's) when he threw a temper tantrum and quit? Integrity? Chuck and Bob were both confirmed to be lacking integrity. They weren't representing you, they were too busy being an AMFA mole.
 
Chuck and Bob go with their own flow. That's a given.

 

[Chuck Schalk]

5L,
Can't fight for your members when you are a quitter. How well was your position represented (Chuck's) when he threw a temper tantrum and quit? Integrity? Chuck and Bob were both confirmed to be lacking integrity. They weren't representing you, they were too busy being an AMFA mole.
 
Chuck and Bob go with their own flow. Tha's a given.
,I informed my members well before the vote, if the 2012 concessionary contract passes I will resign my position as VP.   I could no longer defend the membership with a management contract as the 2012.   I could not explain to anyone how and why we voted away our pension and retiree medical.  I could not explain why the TWU ATD leaders were in Tulsa pushing a "yes" Vote.
I did not quit, My union and the company failed me and the members.
 

 

[700UW]

Apparently you dont understand Chapter 11 Section 1113 C process.
 
You arent in any position of leverage.

 

[1AA]

5L,
Well we know Chuck wasn't there. He quit his position as an officer. He was never there at the table during any part of negotiations since early openers. Sonny Hall left in 2004 and Schalk and Owens were removed in August 2003. A judge even agreed that your's and Owens actions were unbecoming of officers of the union. You guys were too busy hate and discontent trying to get AMFA in instead of trying to do anything at the table.
 
https://casetext.com/case/schalk-v-transport-workers-union-of-america
 
"The Court finds that the discipline imposed was not in retaliation for the exercise by Schalk and Owens of their membership rights as union members; and no rational jury could find otherwise. Instead, they were removed from office because of their conduct that was unbecoming to their office. This determination was made only after adequate notice of the charges was provided, and was followed by a fair hearing at which all charges and defenses could be aired."

So taking a photo with Delle Femine was conduct unbecoming a officer? Yet FAT Don had his arm wrapped around Dell and he gets promoted in the ATD. Your pathetic. You just hate Bob and Chuck because they stood out and spoke what every one else was afraid to do.

 

[AA-MRO.COM]

5L,
Can't fight for your members when you are a quitter. How well was your position represented (Chuck's) when he threw a temper tantrum and quit? Integrity? Chuck and Bob were both confirmed to be lacking integrity. They weren't representing you, they were too busy being an AMFA mole.
 
Chuck and Bob go with their own flow. That's a given.

You are such a twu lackey
The only deception ever brought to the members was by the twu international
Without further ratification little
Gless peddling his bs "lower your expectations"
If it was not for the AMFA drives and the actions of real union members the concessions would have been worse.
There was no representational vote between the IAM twu because the twu would have lost because they sux
Now we are back at negotiations after 12 years of concessions for what....
2 things are going to happen
1 it drags out for years (the typical twu way)
2 it's already a done deal (behind the curtain negotiations) (without further ratification)

Overspun I will never understand how a person can support a union that has given its members nothing but concessions. They must have offerd you concessions for jobs.

The unaccountable unelected international has to go they are nothing more than a bunch of crooks who are not effected by the contracts they impose on the members yet
we are powerless to get rid of them
You are a cheerleader for a union who leads the industry in concessions in both pay and benefits keep up the good work