Industrial vs. Craft

[TWU informer]

Informer,
Did you post the Jim Little letter to the Continental Fleet service workers in 2009 supporting the Teamsters, and the IAM sellout of the SFO and IND maintenance bases before AMFA was on property. I posted these at AFW and some of the sheep here are starting to ask questions.

Yes Odie here are the links again...

James C Little Letter:

http://www.amfa-aa.com/docs/teamsters/Teamster_TWU_CAL_ramp.pdf



It OAK and INDY to save SFO....See Page 8

http://www.amfa-aa.com/docs/teamsters/IAM_Gives_Away_OAK_INDY.pdf

 

[Duke787]

I think it is saying something when UAL mechs now want to lose the IBT, and bring back AMFA, but I don't think you can blame a union when a company decides to outsource their work. I believe every union has been hit by that.

 

[TWU informer]

I think it is saying something when UAL mechs now want to lose the IBT, and bring back AMFA, but I don't think you can blame a union when a company decides to outsource their work. I believe every union has been hit by that.

That is correct DUKE, I have been supporting a change to AMFA for years, and none of the Unions have stopped outsourcing.
TWU had it in check for while in exhange for 25% of the maintenance bases using $9.00 per hour unskilled labor, but now the health care cost has erased that cost advantage and that work group now being topped out even at a lower pay has made that idea still uneconomical.

IT is the AMFA bashing industrial unionist that move the debate away from craft union vs industrial union, by murking the discussion with single issues that are hot button emotional issues.

Outsourcing and Bankruptcy Laws appear to be two issues that is detrimental to the profession regardless of which union the employee belongs. But Democracy, Accountability, and where the Union Resources and Time are sepnt is obviously a huge difference maker.

 

[Anomaly]

LMAO! What does that date have to do with anything??

Well lets review:

I said this:



Which you tried to twist by posting this:



Then you followed with this:



So to sum it all up now...

I made a post concerning an agreement the ibt made with Horizon management, where among other things, they agreed to never speak against the outsourcing in public.

You cant refute it so you have and continue in a pathetic attempt to spin that position and insinuate I'm thereby a liar by citing news articles that took place BEFORE that contract was signed.

You posted the IBT agreed to no public statements about the outsourcing.

I showed you a public statement. Whether or not the agreement comes before or after does not make it less public. The fact remains the the IBT did collect "thousands" of signatures and made the issue absolutely public. They were able to get the company to sit down with the mechanics and it would seem create an agreement to satisfy them. At the end, and agreement was made to settle the issue by not bringing it up again. The members received what they wanted, as jet wash said, so why not?

Don't play the fool. You made the comment either knowing the whole story, and hoping nobody called you on it, or through it out without reading the issues first. Either way, you are arguing points made BY SOMEONE WHO WAS THERE? Jet Wash indicated that the majority of members had no problem with it and since there was an election that reaffirmed the Teamsters, I would have to agree with him.

You are merely wipe off the pile of crap you stepped in to. You may have to get your hands dirty on this one.

 

[Anomaly]

That is correct DUKE, I have been supporting a change to AMFA for years, and none of the Unions have stopped outsourcing.
TWU had it in check for while in exhange for 25% of the maintenance bases using $9.00 per hour unskilled labor, but now the health care cost has erased that cost advantage and that work group now being topped out even at a lower pay has made that idea still uneconomical.

IT is the AMFA bashing industrial unionist that move the debate away from craft union vs industrial union, by murking the discussion with single issues that are hot button emotional issues.

Outsourcing and Bankruptcy Laws appear to be two issues that is detrimental to the profession regardless of which union the employee belongs. But Democracy, Accountability, and where the Union Resources and Time are sepnt is obviously a huge difference maker.

I think it is saying something when UAL mechs now want to lose the IBT, and bring back AMFA, but I don't think you can blame a union when a company decides to outsource their work. I believe every union has been hit by that.

I would agree Duke, except that these guys have never changed. For the majority of us, it was the opposite. Many of us wanted AMFA and fought hard to get them. Once we had them as our representatives, we realized the mistake. We got out quick.

Guys like TSH are either former reps wishing their jobs back, management, or those that loved the chaos that AMFA representation brought to the workplace. In other words the third group loves the continuing never ending fight. I'll bet TSH has been on sites like this for YEARS. You think he does not love this crap? He is the exact example of what AMFA representation is like. Always fighting. When you can't fight the company any more, fight each other. It turned our stomachs, and our views.

The vast majority of us are satisfied with the IBT. We DO NOT want to loose them.

 

[Buck]

Then why try to force then on workers from another airline?

 

[Anomaly]

where the Union Resources and Time are sepnt is obviously a huge difference maker.

You have to have Union resources in order to spend them. AMFA has so very little if any at all.

 

[TWU informer]

You have to have Union resources in order to spend them. AMFA has so very little if any at all.

You are an ignoramous, the Mechanic and Related Dues Base at AA is $500,000.00+ per month. Tulsa alone is $225,000.00+

That is using the TWU 2 hours pay per month, not the Teamsters 2.5 or 3 Hours pay per month figure.

If we are not having Big Splash Parties, Labor Fest Parties, Free Sporting Event Tickets, Lost time abuse, and AFL-CIO and Labor Council per capita dues, and campaign financing and yard sign factory expenses, there should plenty of resources.

That is my point to begin with.

If you cannot function and represent the membership on 2 hours pay per month then you need to get the hell out as the representation service provider. Only reason it should cost more than 2 hours pay per month, is because you have bunch of appointed lost time idiots running amuck doing nothing. (Sound Familiar)?

You are one of the brain washed cultist who think you have to have millions to succeed yet the ibt fails worse than anyone else, and all that money does is apparently attract the feces flies known as organized crime bosses and get your union under Government over sight!

In other words trying earning those dues instead of waste and ignorance and there will be plenty.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

You posted the IBT agreed to no public statements about the outsourcing.

I showed you a public statement. Whether or not the agreement comes before or after does not make it less public. The fact remains the the IBT did collect "thousands" of signatures and made the issue absolutely public. They were able to get the company to sit down with the mechanics and it would seem create an agreement to satisfy them. At the end, and agreement was made to settle the issue by not bringing it up again. The members received what they wanted, as jet wash said, so why not?

Don't play the fool. You made the comment either knowing the whole story, and hoping nobody called you on it, or through it out without reading the issues first. Either way, you are arguing points made BY SOMEONE WHO WAS THERE? Jet Wash indicated that the majority of members had no problem with it and since there was an election that reaffirmed the Teamsters, I would have to agree with him.

You are merely wipe off the pile of crap you stepped in to. You may have to get your hands dirty on this one.

LOL! Damn you are so desperate you actually believe you can float this inane blather.

First you try and call me a liar for pointing out the deal the teamsters cut a deal and now look...

At the end, and agreement was made to settle the issue by not bringing it up again.

You admit it now because you can't defend it.

The teamsters continue to chest thump on how they are leading the charge in the defense against outsourcing. You have done it repeatedly since your arrival. I'm sorry you can't face it, Horizon was a failure, and it was only a regional...whats gonna be your excuse at American?

The self annointed champions of defending outsourcing cut a deal and the company bought their silence.

Again, from your post above...

You posted the IBT agreed to no public statements about the outsourcing.

And again, from your post above...

At the end, and agreement was made to settle the issue by not bringing it up again

I made the statement, you attacked me, and now you agree with me.


I can hardly wait to see how your story changes next.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

To the AA mechanics on this board,My exchange with Anomaly is just the sort of twisted logic the ibt will quite soon attempt to sell you.

In your coming campaign take the time to verify the information from BOTH sides(or all 3 sides). In the end I'm confident you'll be left with little doubt as to who the LIARS are.

TSH

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

I would agree Duke, except that these guys have never changed. For the majority of us, it was the opposite. Many of us wanted AMFA and fought hard to get them. Once we had them as our representatives, we realized the mistake. We got out quick.

Guys like TSH are either former reps wishing their jobs back, management, or those that loved the chaos that AMFA representation brought to the workplace. In other words the third group loves the continuing never ending fight. I'll bet TSH has been on sites like this for YEARS. You think he does not love this crap? He is the exact example of what AMFA representation is like. Always fighting. When you can't fight the company any more, fight each other. It turned our stomachs, and our views.

The vast majority of us are satisfied with the IBT. We DO NOT want to loose them.

You'd bet, and you'd be wrong, and you'd lose......just as the ibt will.

 

[tech2101]

For the majority of us, it was the opposite. Many of us wanted AMFA and fought hard to get them. Once we had them as our representatives, we realized the mistake. We got out quick....
... It turned our stomachs, and our views.

The vast majority of us are satisfied with the IBT. We DO NOT want to loose them.

Are you sitting there in a room full of IBT operatives? You sure act as though you speak for all with your "us", "we" language.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

I would agree Duke, except that these guys have never changed. For the majority of us, it was the opposite. Many of us wanted AMFA and fought hard to get them. Once we had them as our representatives, we realized the mistake. We got out quick.

Guys like TSH are either former reps wishing their jobs back, management, or those that loved the chaos that AMFA representation brought to the workplace. In other words the third group loves the continuing never ending fight. I'll bet TSH has been on sites like this for YEARS. You think he does not love this crap? He is the exact example of what AMFA representation is like. Always fighting. When you can't fight the company any more, fight each other. It turned our stomachs, and our views.

The vast majority of us are satisfied with the IBT. We DO NOT want to loose them.

Oh and BTW, what am I doing here on this board that you are not?

He is the exact example of what AMFA representation is like. Always fighting. When you can't fight the company any more, fight each other. It turned our stomachs, and our views.

So if we are to follow your twisted reasoning, we can deduce that since you're here on this board doing what I'm doing, and with more frequency, things must truly be dismal at UAL under the teamsters.....and you are correct, the ibt does turn our stomachs, and our views

 

[whoop whoop]

I AM A UAL MECHANIC AND I SAY YES, THE MAJORITY HERE ARE DISGUSTED BY THE ibt. I guess we are in an old fashioned your word vs. mine. I think I am a little more credible than you are.

 

[odie01]

I AM A UAL MECHANIC AND I SAY YES, THE MAJORITY HERE ARE DISGUSTED BY THE ibt. I guess we are in an old fashioned your word vs. mine. I think I am a little more credible than you are.

Whoop,
Start an AMFA drive at UAL, our drive at AA should help you get cards!