Industrial vs. Craft

[Buck]

Wow. A bust !

And your claim to fame?

 

[Anomaly]

PDX had one, and a nice following of Vance security goons taking photos of it all. SEA had one, including staging one at Cargo, with drivers supporting it by turning around. And of course, MSP & DTW both did.

Kev, my point is this one or two members on a picket line does not do much to make the public aware of the issues. I believe you said you were a NWA mechanic? Either way, would you just answer this question.

If you had a strike fund, do you thing it would be easier to survive a strike? The Teamster strike fund from the international is four times your monthly dues per week. In addition, many Locals pay strike funds on top of the international rate and some of them pay at the same rate. If you are in one of the larger locals you could also get 4 times your union dues. So lets say dues are $65.00 per month. If you were on strike with the Teamsters, you could get as much as $260.00 from the International Strike Fund + $260.00 from the Local Strike Fund each week. Now to get the pay you have to walk a picket line. Please realize, in most states, if not all, there is no unemployment pay for walking out on strike.

My question is simple. Do you think you NWA mechanics would have gotten more participants for the picket line if the members were paid $520.00 per week just to show up and walk the picket line? Yes or no? How about you Ken? What do you think?

AMFA paid NOTHING

 

[Anomaly]

Kev, my point is this one or two members on a picket line does not do much to make the public aware of the issues. I believe you said you were a NWA mechanic? Either way, would you just answer this question.

If you had a strike fund, do you thing it would be easier to survive a strike? The Teamster strike fund from the international is four times your monthly dues per week. In addition, many Locals pay strike funds on top of the international rate and some of them pay at the same rate. If you are in one of the larger locals you could also get 4 times your union dues. So lets say dues are $65.00 per month. If you were on strike with the Teamsters, you could get as much as $260.00 from the International Strike Fund + $260.00 from the Local Strike Fund each week. Now to get the pay you have to walk a picket line. Please realize, in most states, if not all, there is no unemployment pay for walking out on strike.

My question is simple. Do you think you NWA mechanics would have gotten more participants for the picket line if the members were paid $520.00 per week just to show up and walk the picket line? Yes or no? How about you Ken? What do you think?

AMFA paid NOTHING

You guys can hate or criticize me all you want. The facts remain the same, but you hate those too.

AMFA will not help you.

 

[Anomaly]

And your claim to fame?

Not my point. Why does he only ask the name of those who post opinions opposite of him? he will not answer this question. What are you all afraid of?

Who are you Buck? I have not seen Ken whine that you are not in the open. How about TWU Informer? Who is he? aapitbull? Kev? Third Seat Hero? xUT?

You hate my position because it frightens you that I am correct. You want to know who I am because you are afraid that every UAL mechanic has figured out what I have. AMFA lied about their representation.

News for you, most of us have, and we kicked them out.

 

[Anomaly]

Here's a question for you. Why isn't the twu complaining about the teamster's raid here at AA?

As a child I learned when you are the first to call the other person a liar, somehow people believe you most. I never understood that then, and I m not sure how you believe it works now?? All my info is verifiable through the internet. Just google it is you like.

I began with my opinion. You beat me over the head for doing that and said I was trying to influence others towards the IBT. Until YOU named me the PAID speaker for the IBT. Many of you over and over again. OK, fine, you win. I am trying to influence others, against AMFA. What else can I help you out with?

As for your question, YOU are in the TWU and better suited to answer that with all your experience. You tell me? My Guess? The Teamsters have not announced an official card drive yet. Not according to the internet at least. But you are there, right? What do you see? Tell the truth if you can. Are you hearing about Teamster support from the floor? Something has you very scared. What is it?

 

[TWU informer]

Kev, my point is this one or two members on a picket line does not do much to make the public aware of the issues. I believe you said you were a NWA mechanic? Either way, would you just answer this question.

If you had a strike fund, do you thing it would be easier to survive a strike? The Teamster strike fund from the international is four times your monthly dues per week. In addition, many Locals pay strike funds on top of the international rate and some of them pay at the same rate. If you are in one of the larger locals you could also get 4 times your union dues. So lets say dues are $65.00 per month. If you were on strike with the Teamsters, you could get as much as $260.00 from the International Strike Fund + $260.00 from the Local Strike Fund each week. Now to get the pay you have to walk a picket line. Please realize, in most states, if not all, there is no unemployment pay for walking out on strike.

My question is simple. Do you think you NWA mechanics would have gotten more participants for the picket line if the members were paid $520.00 per week just to show up and walk the picket line? Yes or no? How about you Ken? What do you think?

AMFA paid NOTHING

Does it really matter how much is being paid to walk the picket line when the industrial unions are providing scabs to management to protect the greed and artificial power of their worthless and corrupt institution? The NWA AMFA picket line never failed because AMFA members ran out of money, that strike failed becuase the TWU, IBT, and the IAM provided scab labor to management.

Again all you have to spread is fear of failure, and negative opinions about craft unionism. Yet, it is clear that the industrial unions have been the majority representation in this industry for over 60 years, have failed us, and lead us to this point, and will do anything including scab a picket line to insure the craft union never gets to be the majority. Because if that were to succeed the industrial union institution of greed and false power would be proven a failure.

One big hurdle that is encountered when attempting cultural change is institutional politics, that is who you are, that is what you represent, and you should be considered one of many hurdles that needs to be ignored and rejected as one step in the process of positive change.

I will never accept another man's fear and negative opinions as reason not to change. The mechanics at American Airlines are entitled to try craft unionism, if it does not work out, then we change again. You expect us to not experience it for ourselves, by claiming we will fail, and it will be a negative experience. You are nobody, your opinions are as worthless as our current union. We will change and we sure as hell do not need an institutional fear monger to save us from ourselves. You are nothing more than a alias on a forum, and all you bring are negative overtures and fear of failure. you have been identified as just that and nothing more. you can repeat your fear and negativity over and over and over, but you will not be heard.

We will experience craft unionism for ourselves, and if it fails we will change again.

 

[Kev3188]

I believe you said you were a NWA mechanic?

You're gonna have to show me where you go that idea. I've never stated that I was an AMT.

My question is simple. Do you think you NWA mechanics would have gotten more participants for the picket line if the members were paid $520.00 per week just to show up and walk the picket line? Yes or no? How about you Ken? What do you think?

Maybe, maybe not. In my experience the AMT's were so committed to what they were doing, that they didn't need to be paid to show up.

 

[DNTULSA]

Not my point. Why does he only ask the name of those who post opinions opposite of him? he will not answer this question. What are you all afraid of?

Who are you Buck? I have not seen Ken whine that you are not in the open. How about TWU Informer? Who is he? aapitbull? Kev? Third Seat Hero? xUT?

You hate my position because it frightens you that I am correct. You want to know who I am because you are afraid that every UAL mechanic has figured out what I have. AMFA lied about their representation.

News for you, most of us have, and we kicked them out.

Anameless,

You are an excellent example of why we need to get rid of the industrial unions. Even if you change to a different industrial union, the same people float to the top and become officers in the new union.( like you!) I was disgusted by people like you when I was a mechanic. They would not do much (if any) work, and were proud of the fact. They could talk to others , talk on the phone, and finger dance on the computer.

Work however, frightened them.

And the @#$% twu protected them!

I don't hate unions, but I despise industrial unions.

the pilots and the fa's have craft unions, and they do quite well.

What are the industrial unions giving you to rattle on over here?

 

[TWU informer]

Got a call from a Hartford Survey firm that was pro-TWU and pro-IBT and anti-AMFA


Intersting that the both IBT and TWU were placed in positive view and only AMFA was attacked.
Just more verification of the alliance.

I answered every question and lied on every one of them.

Every answer I gave them was 180 from my true beliefs or just false.

Enjoy your time when they call you, make it a waste of their time and resource by answering but not honestly.

Let them pay big bucks to compile bullshit

 

[DonnaU]

Got a call from a Hartford Survey firm that was pro-TWU and pro-IBT and anti-AMFA


Intersting that the both IBT and TWU were placed in positive view and only AMFA was attacked.
Just more verification of the alliance.

I answered every question and lied on every one of them.

Every answer I gave them was 180 from my true beliefs or just false.

Enjoy your time when they call you, make it a waste of their time and resource by answering but not honestly.

Let them pay big bucks to compile bullshit

Informer, I got the same call.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

There were two RALLIES that I remember, but are you saying there was an active 24 hour picket line in SFO? Was there a picket line at the other stations where NWA mechanics worked?

There were two active picket lines. One at the terminal the other at the NWA cargo facility.

No they were not 24 hour picket lines. NWA had a small footprint in SFO so the lines were staffed from before the first flight of the day landed to after the last flight left.

And again, from someone who professed to (at one time) be an AMFA supporter and was looking to help, I find it difficult to believe the ignorance you claim now.

If you truly were someone involved or wanted to be you would have already known these things.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

I am amazed by your ignorance. AMFA has done nothing to organize the MRO mechanics. The industrial unions are fighting only the ignorance that AMFA continues to post. Just like this lying statement. If "ALL" AMT's were all under AMFA, pay and seniority "could" be portable.

It would take a lot more than that. It would take the creation of a national contract. AMFA is limited to extending or editing adopted contracts.

I'm sorry, and just what has the mighty teamsters with all their so called political power and resources be able to do? Have they been beating the bushes and organizing MROs?

You critique rings a bit hollow.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

Wow. A bust !

Yes, a bust.

Its called promoting and bringing wider recognition and understanding of our class to the public at large.

The fact that you attempt a slight at such an endeavour is just one more shining example of why your "opinion" and the obvious flawed reasoning behind it, hold little to no value here.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Wow. A bust !

Your point?

 

[xUT]

There were two RALLIES that I remember, but are you saying there was an active 24 hour picket line in SFO? Was there a picket line at the other stations where NWA mechanics worked?

No need for a 24 hour picket as NWA didn't fly 24 hours out of SFO.
We had a morning shift and an afternoon shift. Van pickup and drop off from the MOC and the local 9 office. Morning shift was awesome!

The 'rallies' you might be referring to would be the SFO MOC 'Save our Pension' rally that had less than 300 people including about 3 IAM storekeepers. It was encouraging to have the van pools pull out of the parking lot laughing and waving at us.

Then the 'Labor Day' rally at the old international terminal where we had more people from other unions than United's. No IAM, no IBT. AMFA 9 bought everyone a cup of coffee from Starbucks by the NWA gate. When we were passing out flyers for the 'Labor Day' rally, I had an IAM shop rep tell me we shouldn't have a rally on a holiday...

B) xUT