Industrial vs. Craft

[Anomaly]

That was the intention of AMFA, but the industrial unions fought it and are still fighting it.
If "ALL" AMT's were all under AMFA, pay and seniority "could" be portable.
The IBT can not and will not help in that philosophy.


---- philosophy --- edited by me ---

I am amazed by your ignorance. AMFA has done nothing to organize the MRO mechanics. The industrial unions are fighting only the ignorance that AMFA continues to post. Just like this lying statement. If "ALL" AMT's were all under AMFA, pay and seniority "could" be portable.

It would take a lot more than that. It would take the creation of a national contract. AMFA is limited to extending or editing adopted contracts.

 

[Anomaly]

"Above most others who have posted on this site, you seem to be one of intelligence. Can't you at least understand the true power we could all have as A&P mechanics if that power was put under one single contract?"

I stand corrected. You proved me wrong on my first sentence. Of course I am trying to influence. I have never denied that. AMFA deceived us at UAL. I have no problem proclaiming that I am doing everything I can to stop them from doing the same with another airline. It is you all who keep pretending my message is something more than it is. You are the ones who turned me in to the IBT cheerleader. I came here to expose the truth about AMFA. Nobody has to pay me to do that. I bought in to their lies, and will never fall in to them again. If I can convince just one person to take a real look at this group, and their failures, it makes all the crap from you and your little buddies all worth it. AMFA is simply not the CRAFT union they pretend to be. Nor can they offer any benefit to MY craft.

 

[Anomaly]

Word I am getting is that if the Teamsters win, Tulsa will be spilt between the ORD and DFW locals. :blink:

You made this up

 

[TWU informer]

I stand corrected. You proved me wrong on my first sentence. Of course I am trying to influence. I have never denied that. AMFA deceived us at UAL. I have no problem proclaiming that I am doing everything I can to stop them from doing the same with another airline. It is you all who keep pretending my message is something more than it is. You are the ones who turned me in to the IBT cheerleader. I came here to expose the truth about AMFA. Nobody has to pay me to do that. I bought in to their lies, and will never fall in to them again. If I can convince just one person to take a real look at this group, and their failures, it makes all the crap from you and your little buddies all worth it. AMFA is simply not the CRAFT union they pretend to be. Nor can they offer any benefit to MY craft.

You are nothing more than an Institutional Political Advocate that is here to spread negative opinions and fear of failure if we change directions.

You claim to have our best interest in your actions, but it is clear you are here to protect the institutional greed and power, even it does mean detriment to the profession.

Well guess what, we are failing now, we have experienced years and years of negative outcomes, we are failing and the industrial unions have had over 50 years to correct that and have failed us all.The industrial unions IAM, IBT, TWU, have been the majority of all representation during these years of destruction of our profession.

You simply want us to continue the same path of destruction, and you use negatives and fear of failure as the basis for your beliefs, I say we need to change.

Your negative opinions and expressions of fear of failure mean nothing to me, because that is what we have all experienced for years with the industrial unions representing the craft and class.

I see you for what you are. I do not fear change, I welcome change when I am witnessing decimation of a profession.

I have no interest in protection of the failing institution, their greed, their falsely perceived power.

One big hurdle that is encountered when attempting cultural change is institutional politics, that is who you are, that is what you represent, and you should be considered one of many hurdles that needs to be ignored and rejected as one step in the process of positive change.

 

[Anomaly]

Actually there were TWO. One at the terminal, and the other at the NWA cargo facility.

As both strike lines were coordinated out of the Local, a place most every REAL concerned AMFA member would go to seek info on such an event, one could be forgiven for simply doubting your entire story.

There were two RALLIES that I remember, but are you saying there was an active 24 hour picket line in SFO? Was there a picket line at the other stations where NWA mechanics worked?

 

[Anomaly]

You are nothing more than an Institutional Political Advocate that is here to spread negative opinions and fear of failure if we change directions.

You claim to have our best interest in your actions, but it is clear you are here to protect the institutional greed and power, even it does mean detriment to the profession.

Well guess what, we are failing now, we have experienced years and years of negative outcomes, we are failing and the industrial unions have had over 50 years to correct that and have failed us all.The industrial unions IAM, IBT, TWU, have been the majority of all representation during these years of destruction of our profession.

You simply want us to continue the same path of destruction, and you use negatives and fear of failure as the basis for your beliefs, I say we need to change.

Your negative opinions and expressions of fear of failure mean nothing to me, because that is what we have all experienced for years with the industrial unions representing the craft and class.

I see you for what you are. I do not fear change, I welcome change when I am witnessing decimation of a profession.

I have no interest in protection of the failing institution, their greed, their falsely perceived power.

One big hurdle that is encountered when attempting cultural change is institutional politics, that is who you are, that is what you represent, and you should be considered one of many hurdles that needs to be ignored and rejected as one step in the process of positive change.

You forgot to respond to this one ...

Look at the bottom of the Wiki Craft Union page you posted.

http://en.wikipedia..../Craft_unionism
Persistence

Craft unionism has receded in many industries as a result of changes in technology, the concentration of ownership and jurisdictional conflicts between craft unions. Craft unionism has not, however, disappeared: it is still the norm in the airline industry, survives despite much upheaval in the construction industry, and even appears, in very muted form, in some mass production industries, such as automobile manufacturing, where skilled trades employees have pressed their own agendas within the union.

Just above that is a more detailed explanation of the "small potatoes" incident I mentioned.

You are so intent on side stepping my posts that you rare willing to say anything to derail other readers.

I am not afraid of change, and in fact changed twice. Started at bad-IAM, changed to worse-AMFA, changed again to better-IBT. Too bad that pisses you off.

 

[TWU informer]

You forgot to respond to this one ...

Look at the bottom of the Wiki Craft Union page you posted.

http://en.wikipedia..../Craft_unionism
Persistence

Craft unionism has receded in many industries as a result of changes in technology, the concentration of ownership and jurisdictional conflicts between craft unions. Craft unionism has not, however, disappeared: it is still the norm in the airline industry, survives despite much upheaval in the construction industry, and even appears, in very muted form, in some mass production industries, such as automobile manufacturing, where skilled trades employees have pressed their own agendas within the union.

Just above that is a more detailed explanation of the "small potatoes" incident I mentioned.

You are so intent on side stepping my posts that you rare willing to say anything to derail other readers.

I am not afraid of change, and in fact changed twice. Started at bad-IAM, changed to worse-AMFA, changed again to better-IBT. Too bad that pisses you off.

This is my response

You are nothing more than an Institutional Political Advocate that is here to spread negative opinions and fear of failure if we change directions.

You claim to have our best interest in your actions, but it is clear you are here to protect the institutional greed and power, even it does mean detriment to the profession.

Well guess what, we are failing now, we have experienced years and years of negative outcomes, we are failing and the industrial unions have had over 50 years to correct that and have failed us all.The industrial unions IAM, IBT, TWU, have been the majority of all representation during these years of destruction of our profession.

You simply want us to continue the same path of destruction, and you use negatives and fear of failure as the basis for your beliefs, I say we need to change.

Your negative opinions and expressions of fear of failure mean nothing to me, because that is what we have all experienced for years with the industrial unions representing the craft and class.

I see you for what you are. I do not fear change, I welcome change when I am witnessing decimation of a profession.

I have no interest in protection of the failing institution, their greed, their falsely perceived power.

One big hurdle that is encountered when attempting cultural change is institutional politics, that is who you are, that is what you represent, and you should be considered one of many hurdles that needs to be ignored and rejected as one step in the process of positive change.

 

[DNTULSA]

Most would rather be non-union if a choice was AMFA.

I see they've called out the third string!

 

[Kev3188]

Was there a picket line at the other stations where NWA mechanics worked?

Yes.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

I stand corrected. You proved me wrong on my first sentence. Of course I am trying to influence. I have never denied that. AMFA deceived us at UAL. I have no problem proclaiming that I am doing everything I can to stop them from doing the same with another airline. It is you all who keep pretending my message is something more than it is. You are the ones who turned me in to the IBT cheerleader. I came here to expose the truth about AMFA. Nobody has to pay me to do that. I bought in to their lies, and will never fall in to them again. If I can convince just one person to take a real look at this group, and their failures, it makes all the crap from you and your little buddies all worth it. AMFA is simply not the CRAFT union they pretend to be. Nor can they offer any benefit to MY craft.

So lying is okay if you say "I stand corrected."? In an earlier post you stated that you were NOT trying to influence people, only stating your opinion. Now you say you are trying to influence people's opinion.

Credibility check: -1

You still have not identified yourself.

Credibility check: -2

What craft would you belong to? You can't even state your name! AMFA is so bad yet you fear standing in the light as I do when I say the twu and teamsters are bad.

"IBT cheerleader"? No one made you into that except yourself.

"all the crap from me"?

Care to explain exactly what "crap" I provided you?

I pointed out that you are a liar. You said you didn't come here to influence anyone but now you say you are here to do just that... even if it is just one person.

+1 for me.

I pointed out that you are not capable of identifying yourself while defending something you say you believe in. You continue to proove this point.

+2 for me.

Here's a question for you. Why isn't the twu complaining about the teamster's raid here at AA?

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Yes.

SAN had one and AA AMTs walked the line with them.

 

[aapitbull]

DFW had one sometimes two one up stairs and one down stairs when we had enough guys to man both and If I remember there were only 5 or 6 AMFA members at DFW. We had AA from DFW,AFW and TUL plus FED EX and some NWA Fleet guys.

 

[Anomaly]

So lying is okay if you say "I stand corrected."? In an earlier post you stated that you were NOT trying to influence people, only stating your opinion. Now you say you are trying to influence people's opinion.

Credibility check: -1

You still have not identified yourself.

Credibility check: -2

What craft would you belong to? You can't even state your name! AMFA is so bad yet you fear standing in the light as I do when I say the twu and teamsters are bad.

"IBT cheerleader"? No one made you into that except yourself.

"all the crap from me"?

Care to explain exactly what "crap" I provided you?

I pointed out that you are a liar. You said you didn't come here to influence anyone but now you say you are here to do just that... even if it is just one person.

+1 for me.

I pointed out that you are not capable of identifying yourself while defending something you say you believe in. You continue to proove this point.

+2 for me.

Here's a question for you. Why isn't the twu complaining about the teamster's raid here at AA?

Ken MacTiernan, Director - Ken MacTiernan is a 22-year AMT Line Mechanic with AA in Dallas, TX. He was a U.S.A.F. B-52 Aircraft Mechanic and earned his A&P license during his four-year tour; being Honorably Discharged as an E-4. Hirined on with AA in 1986 in LGA, Ken was a Lead Mechanic for 2 years. He is the founder of the non-profit Aircraft Maintenance Technicians Association, WWW.AMTAUSA.COM. Ken is married with two daughters. MacTiernan single-handedly raised money for placement of several Charles Taylor Bust donations in key locations throughout the country - the most notable at the Smithsonian Museum. Ken is also the Chairman for AMTSociety Scholarship Awards and Chairman for AMTSociety's Maintenance Skills Competition.

 

[Anomaly]

Ken MacTiernan, Director - Ken MacTiernan is a 22-year AMT Line Mechanic with AA in Dallas, TX. He was a U.S.A.F. B-52 Aircraft Mechanic and earned his A&P license during his four-year tour; being Honorably Discharged as an E-4. Hirined on with AA in 1986 in LGA, Ken was a Lead Mechanic for 2 years. He is the founder of the non-profit Aircraft Maintenance Technicians Association, WWW.AMTAUSA.COM. Ken is married with two daughters. MacTiernan single-handedly raised money for placement of several Charles Taylor Bust donations in key locations throughout the country - the most notable at the Smithsonian Museum. Ken is also the Chairman for AMTSociety Scholarship Awards and Chairman for AMTSociety's Maintenance Skills Competition.

Wow. A bust !

 

[Kev3188]

PDX had one, and a nice following of Vance security goons taking photos of it all. SEA had one, including staging one at Cargo, with drivers supporting it by turning around. And of course, MSP & DTW both did.