IAM Stepping Up campaign
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Kev3188
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robbedagain said:
At that point. AMFA was free to withhold their labor (and did), and NW was free to impose their own terms (and did)...
Kev3188
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And?southwind said:
In other news, the sun rises in the east...
ThirdSeatHero
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700UW said:
I don't need to ask Kevin about it.
AMFA went out on strike. At that moment everything that was contained in their agreement be came struck work. NWA changing the CBA/imposing a new agreement after the strike commenced changes nothing.
The IAM performed struck work, period.
Kev3188
Veteran
That's true; you don't.
This topic has been covered hundreds of times from every possible angle. And yet, every so often, someone feels the need to rehahsh it in the hopes that we will all form a circular firing squad.
You, myself, and everyone else on here that's intellectually honest knows:
- What language the IAM CBA had.
- What language the AMFA one contained (prior to imposed terms)
- The overlapping language in both
- The stations that had AMT's
- The ones that had cleaners
- The ones that had both
- The ones that had neither
And so on and so on.
WorldTraveler
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- Dec 5, 2003
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it is no more valid to continue to rehash the AMFA strike, esp. in isolation, than it is to consider what happened during 7.5 and yet exclude other periods of industry history when other carriers cut jobs and imposed wage reductions despite the efforts of unions to stop it.
Either you continue to rehash the past or you use the past as an indicator as to what can reasonably be expected for the future.
the reality is that DL employees have and will make their decision about further unionization based not just on the track record of the past but also based on what labor is doing TODAY.
Given that DL employees are receiving more pay raises more often and are at above average compensation levels TODAY than their peers who are seeing jobs lost, DL people don't have to focus solely on events like the AMFA strike and how the IAM responded to it.
The evidence that exists TODAY is more than sufficient to prove that DL people's decision to maintain their current employment relationship is not likely to change.
Either you continue to rehash the past or you use the past as an indicator as to what can reasonably be expected for the future.
the reality is that DL employees have and will make their decision about further unionization based not just on the track record of the past but also based on what labor is doing TODAY.
Given that DL employees are receiving more pay raises more often and are at above average compensation levels TODAY than their peers who are seeing jobs lost, DL people don't have to focus solely on events like the AMFA strike and how the IAM responded to it.
The evidence that exists TODAY is more than sufficient to prove that DL people's decision to maintain their current employment relationship is not likely to change.
robbedagain
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- Oct 13, 2003
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thanks guys.. Good luck with the card drive. personally its just me but I for one would like to see the union represent you folks at DL so that you all can have a stronger voice in say in matters.
WorldTraveler
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why would you as a US employee have ANY interest in what DL employees do? Representation is a decision that belongs to DL employees and the decision should be theirs and theirs alone.
the only obvious comparison is that DL people have fared far, far better than union represented employees at other airlines.
The only even close to valid comparison of how well a union has done is between DL and NW rampers during BK - and they fared as well as they did because AMFA miscalculated strategy and allowed the company to eliminate 5000 of the highest non-pilot personnel at the company, dramatically reducing the cost reductions that had to come from other workgroups.
once again, DL and NW had IDENTICAL labor cost CASMs at the time of the merger. they came to the same conclusion but had very different strategies.
No entire DL workgroups then or since have participated in a job action which is one of the key examples of how badly airline labor relations have been.
If you want to look back very far in history, then you (and DL employees) can't ignore the reality of the labor issues which have existed thruout the US airline industry for years.
There are a huge number of DL people who are very aware that DL occupies major portions of ATL that were once occupied by Eastern Airlines.
the only obvious comparison is that DL people have fared far, far better than union represented employees at other airlines.
The only even close to valid comparison of how well a union has done is between DL and NW rampers during BK - and they fared as well as they did because AMFA miscalculated strategy and allowed the company to eliminate 5000 of the highest non-pilot personnel at the company, dramatically reducing the cost reductions that had to come from other workgroups.
once again, DL and NW had IDENTICAL labor cost CASMs at the time of the merger. they came to the same conclusion but had very different strategies.
No entire DL workgroups then or since have participated in a job action which is one of the key examples of how badly airline labor relations have been.
If you want to look back very far in history, then you (and DL employees) can't ignore the reality of the labor issues which have existed thruout the US airline industry for years.
There are a huge number of DL people who are very aware that DL occupies major portions of ATL that were once occupied by Eastern Airlines.
Kev3188
Veteran
No you don't. Those that want to waste time going 'round in circles can have at it.WorldTraveler said:
DL employees will make their decisions based both on what their reality is today, and what they want their future to look like.
WorldTraveler
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I can agree with that.
then arguments about what happened in 7.5 are not valid and instead what is valid is what has happened this year at UA and what airlines have been "able to get by with" when dealing with unions TODAY
When UA, a profitable airline who is not in BK is able to cut scores of cities from job protection under contract scope, then how can anyone argue that the IAM or any other union can provide something which DL people need or don't have?
then arguments about what happened in 7.5 are not valid and instead what is valid is what has happened this year at UA and what airlines have been "able to get by with" when dealing with unions TODAY
When UA, a profitable airline who is not in BK is able to cut scores of cities from job protection under contract scope, then how can anyone argue that the IAM or any other union can provide something which DL people need or don't have?
Kev3188
Veteran
Thanks! I trust you're sharing the value of representation with those DL employees you run into at your station...robbedagain said:
WeAAsles
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- Oct 20, 2007
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+1000Kev3188 said:
Hey Kev let me ask you direct. Meaning these questions are just for you who currently works for DL.
How many people do you work with by percentages actually reach that "Top Out" rate?
Do you ever notice what the turnover rate is? Does the company find creative ways to get rid of people to prevent them from reaching that "Top Out" rate?
What remedies does an employee have to fight an unjust termination especially if he lives in a "Right To Work" State?
And anyone who's reading this should only consider the answers given by Kev since he is currently in Fleet and would be the only TRUE reliable source to answer these questions. But do take note if someone else responds and how it will be spun to favor the company's position.
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I have never and will never cross a picket nor perform struck work.southwind said:
I was one of the leaders when we were on strike against US Air in 1992.
I bet you would run across a picket line to keep Massa Company in business, so how many NW planes did you work on when they were on strike?
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