IAM Stepping Up campaign

[700UW]

The problem is you.
 
You cant tolerate anyone who is pro-union or pro-worker.
 
You believe that Massa Delta can do no wrong and the employees should be grateful to have a job and should pay DL to work for them.
 
You spin and twist facts unlike no other poster.
 
You arent at DL anymore and havent been in years, you dont know what is going on with the workers.
 
Yes I left US on my own, I have a pension and retirement when I choose to collect it.
 
You dont know me, nor my history.
 
But hey keep on preaching.
 
Why is it ok for Anderson and his cronies to have an employment contract and not the employees, you know those employees that actually do the work and earn the money and profits that delta has?

 

[WorldTraveler]

Wrong.

I engage in fact-filled discussions, not chase dreams that are devoid of reality. I bring real facts in totality and not just hearsay and a few data points that you extract from the blogosphere and paint as truth.

you NEVER have been at DL and yet you choose to push yourself into a discussion that is best left to DL's active employees - yet you can't stand on the sidelines and let them make their decision.

DL people are capable of deciding what is best for themselves. They value what they have now more than they value the paper promises that other airlines have shredded repeatedly and which still come nowhere close to exceeding what DL people have, paper promise or not.

The simple fact whether you can GRASP it or not is that DL employees are capable of making their own decisions, have repeatedly chosen to reject further unionization, and there is no real evidence that the labor movement is any closer to seating unions at DL than they ever have been.

in news that matters, let's see what country Russia invades to regain its self esteem after being defeated in one of global soccer's most storied stadia.

 

[700UW]

"new entrant"
 
"legacy"
 
Etc.....
 
And why is DL spending millions with Ford and Harrison if its DL's employees choice?
 
And are you an active Delta employee?
 
Are you on the ramp five days a week or in the plane being a flight attendant?

 

[700UW]

Once again you avoid what is asked of you.
 
Why is it ok for Anderson and the executives to have employment contracts and not the rank and file employees who do the work, and earn the profits for Delta?

 

[Kev3188]

Kev,
I don't live in the past...

Your posts indicate otherwise...

Guess you stupid enough to believe someone should walk in off the street and automatically be topped out without proving their worth and being paid the same as someone who's been there for 20 years!
Hmmm.....I looked at the "ACTUAL" DL pay scale for ramp!

Good for you. And when you did, the glaring disparity in income should've leapt off the page...
 
 

You posted max salary and you dont have the brain power to compute and comprehend the Ready Reserves who NEVER reach top out pay nor that every one in ACS of Inflight are topped out.

Bingo. It's one thing to start at the bottom and know better days are ahead if you just stick it out. It's another to be a part of a permanent underclass of employee(s). Even the company has noted that the program has gotten away from it's original intent...
 

 

Just ask Kevin, 15 agents at his station are at the low end of the scale.

...And 1000's more just like them system-wide...
 
 

I engage in fact-filled discussions, not chase dreams that are devoid of reality. I bring real facts in totality and not just hearsay and a few data points that you extract from the blogosphere and paint as truth.

As Josh would say, "saved for future reference."

 

DL people are capable of deciding what is best for themselves.

Indeed, and right they are deciding to sign cards in ever increasing numbers.


 

The simple fact whether you can GRASP it or not is that DL employees are capable of making their own decisions, have repeatedly chosen to reject further unionization...

Wait, I thought you didn't in the past? What gives?

 

[WeAAsles]

Going to be some great selling material that in the new TA for US guys that "Ready Reserve" is gone. That and the rumor floating around is no more double medical either.

If I was a ready reserve SLAVE I'd sign up in a heartbeat.

 

[WeAAsles]

DAL employees unionizing is not in the interests of shareholders or customers not to mention management.

For shareholders some of the money that is now allocated to pay down debt and offer dividends could wind up going to improvements for the now organized workgroup or groups. Meaning more money in a workers pocket.

For customers now that the industry is profitable and capacity has been taken out through mergers, prices start to rise. If the entire industry is now represented they will most certainly work together to gain improvements for all. The airlines now have the ability to raise fares to cover those costs like no time since before deregulation.

I guess Joe Fatty Pants with his Big Gulp is not going to be able to afford to fly anymore.

 

[WorldTraveler]

Going to be some great selling material that in the new TA for US guys that "Ready Reserve" is gone. That and the rumor floating around is no more double medical either.

If I was a ready reserve SLAVE I'd sign up in a heartbeat.

given that AA/US has a massive surplus of workers right now, it is easy to chop RR. They need to get rid of people, not hire more.

It isn't a surprise that AA is trying so desperately to expand its network because it is trying to find ways to use all of those employees so they can avoid having to lay them off.
 

As Josh would say, "saved for future reference."



Indeed, and right they are deciding to sign cards in ever increasing numbers.




Wait, I thought you didn't in the past? What gives?

You should save it and challenge me on the facts if you disagree. Remember we are having this discussion today because a few people want to take the word of 15 people over cumulative statistics that reflect tens of thousands of employees.

And if they are really signing cards at the pace you say they are, then a vote should be coming, right?

Problem is we have heard this for about 5 years now.

I am completely ok if DL people choose unions.

I don't take kindly to a representation campaign that is run by labor leaders who have nothing invested at DL. Let's be clear that if this thread was entitled "Kev 3188 steps up the campaign" it would be received in a whole different light.

If DL people think a contract is in their best interest, they will decide it and I will support them.

The fact that they have repeatedly chosen not to choose representation and still have not provided the cards necessary to force an election speaks volumes about the status of the IAM's campaign.

 

DAL employees unionizing is not in the interests of shareholders or customers not to mention management.

For shareholders some of the money that is now allocated to pay down debt and offer dividends could wind up going to improvements for the now organized workgroup or groups. Meaning more money in a workers pocket.

For customers now that the industry is profitable and capacity has been taken out through mergers, prices start to rise. If the entire industry is now represented they will most certainly work together to gain improvements for all. The airlines now have the ability to raise fares to cover those costs like no time since before deregulation.

I guess Joe Fatty Pants with his Big Gulp is not going to be able to afford to fly anymore.

except the evidence is overwhelming that DL employees do better than their peers at other airlines. DL has given their employees more raises and given them more often than their peers including WN.

DL people aren't about to cut themselves off of the gravy train so they can join a union that has a worse track record than DL people have.

You also fail to note that DL gets a revenue premium to the industry; they obviously carry a lot less mom and pop traffic than their peers.

 

[southwind]

Please enlighten us and show me where I posted that someone should walk off the street and be topped out.
 
 
But I know you wont, as your own propaganda doesnt suit the real truth.
 
From your post #2598:
Guess you aren't smart enough to figure out not everyone is topped out.

Err....sounds to me like your bitchin' about everyone not being topped out, by your reply, #2598!

And your not spreading pro "Union" propoganda?

And to top it off, for a union you don't represent, at a company you do not work at!

 

[southwind]

Good for you. And when you did, the glaring disparity in income should've leapt off the page...

Not really. I take it topped out at $46,000 , well above poverty level for a family of 8, is not a.......ready....."Living Wage"?

 

[WeAAsles]

given that AA/US has a massive surplus of workers right now, it is easy to chop RR. They need to get rid of people, not hire more.It isn't a surprise that AA is trying so desperately to expand its network because it is trying to find ways to use all of those employees so they can avoid having to lay them off. You should save it and challenge me on the facts if you disagree. Remember we are having this discussion today because a few people want to take the word of 15 people over cumulative statistics that reflect tens of thousands of employees.And if they are really signing cards at the pace you say they are, then a vote should be coming, right?Problem is we have heard this for about 5 years now.I am completely ok if DL people choose unions.I don't take kindly to a representation campaign that is run by labor leaders who have nothing invested at DL. Let's be clear that if this thread was entitled "Kev 3188 steps up the campaign" it would be received in a whole different light.If DL people think a contract is in their best interest, they will decide it and I will support them.The fact that they have repeatedly chosen not to choose representation and still have not provided the cards necessary to force an election speaks volumes about the status of the IAM's campaign. except the evidence is overwhelming that DL employees do better than their peers at other airlines. DL has given their employees more raises and given them more often than their peers including WN.DL people aren't about to cut themselves off of the gravy train so they can join a union that has a worse track record than DL people have.You also fail to note that DL gets a revenue premium to the industry; they obviously carry a lot less mom and pop traffic than their peers.

I would like to see the overall labor cost by percentage in size relation to UAL and the combined AA including if the IAM TA were to ratify their agreements? That's how I would know if those people are truly well compensated or not?


I think it would be very easy to surmise by total value that the non union employees of DAL fall short of their peers.

 

[700UW]

Massive overage?

There you go again, lying.

US has offered a no layoff clause for Fleet and Maintenance so please explain how they are over staffed if they just agreed to no layoffs?

US is hiring FAS and Pilots, AA is hiring FAs.

So please explain how they are over staffed!

And don't let the facts get in your way!

 

[WorldTraveler]

I would like to see the overall labor cost by percentage in size relation to UAL and the combined AA including if the IAM TA were to ratify their agreements? That's how I would know if those people are truly well compensated or not?


I think it would be very easy to surmise by total value that the non union employees of DAL fall short of their peers.

that data is available here.

http://www.airlinefinancials.com/uploads/2013_Network_Annual_Summary2.pdf

in fact, DL spends a higher percentage of revenue on salaries and benefits than AA or US for 2013, the most recent data available.

note that DL has the highest average wage/salary per employee as well as the highest benefit cost per employee.

As a percent of revenue, UA spends more than DL because UA doesn't deliver the kind of revenue that DL generates.

but note also that DL generates more revenue per employee and more ASMs per employee than any of the other network carriers.

DL also has the lowest percentage of fuel cost AS WELL AS debt service compared to revenue

The simple reality is that DL does not scrimp on salaries but in fact pays its employees well and cuts costs elsewhere in order to keep its employees well paid.

IN turn, DL employees deliver above average revenue generation and above average productivity.

DL emploeyes are well compensated relative to their peers but they use their advantage to help the company succeed at its goals.

It is not a strategy that is much different from what WN does.

yet so many people here think it is a good strategy for WN to use because they are unionized but it isn't good because DL is largely non-union.


 

Massive overage? There you go again, lying. US has offered a no layoff clause for Fleet and Maintenance so please explain how they are over staffed if they just agreed to no layoffs? US is hiring FAS and Pilots, AA is hiring FAs. So please explain how they are over staffed! And don't let the facts get in your way!

new AA has 15,000 more employees (almost 25%) more than DL and UA for an airline that is about 5% larger.

AA is overstaffed relative to revenues and ASMs produced and will have to deal with that overage.

IN the meantime, AA is trying to find every possible way to keep those people busy generating revenue. AA's motivation to add routes and flights is driven by its #3 out of 3 position in the int'l industry and because AA has so many employees available and not necessarily because their chances of succeeding are necessarily great.

 

[700UW]

Once again you avoided the questions poised to you, typical.

 

[WorldTraveler]

you better believe I am ignoring your diversionary tactics because I am focusing on the data which matters.

you want to create all kinds of diversions to avoid facing the reality that the IAM's claims are not real and DL employees do as good or better than their network airline peers which means the chances that a union can really improve the lot of DL employees is somewhere between slim and none.