IAM Fleet Service topic

[necigrad]

Henderfuzz, the problem is we DON'T believe Canale. We KNOW he's lying. So we CAN'T assume he's telling the truth. That throws your entire scenario out the window.

 

[giantfan]

Fromm CNN.com this morning...

ATLANTA (AP) -- Delta Air Lines Inc., the nation's third-largest carrier, said Wednesday its loss widened in the first quarter to a whopping $6.39 billion because of soaring fuel prices and the steep decline in the company's market value.

For those of you that don't believe oil is going to affect this T/A negotiation and that they will come back to the table if we vote no, please read the above article and get your heads out of the sand.

fyi -that's a "b" as in billion.....

And for my friend Tim.....instead of trying hard to figure out where I am....do me a favor and answer this question...

We vote no, Hemenway says ok...but sorry guys they aren't coming back we start reneg at the end of 2009....then what? Stuck with these wages for another 3 years minimum....

Here's another scenario....albeit unlikely....

We note no, they come back again with something better and guess what our friend says.... NO again and pumps up the followers again and we ended up with the some crap for even longer.

Nothing will please some of you. We will NOT get everything we want.....NOT in these economic conditions not EVER!!!!!!!!!

Wake up and read a newspaper, please!!!

 

[WTF_CLT]

The Big Gamble.
For those of you still think a no vote is the only way to go I want to point out what you will be giving up.
Lets assume that Canale is not lieing when he says this is the final agreement.
We now will have to wait 2 maybe 3 years for a new deal and even longer if there is a merger.
So can you live with giving up a 2 percent raise over the next 4 years, never seeing doubltime for 3 to 4 more years, only 5 holidays , and most important the 60 day rule hanging over us as more layoffs come, which I beleive they will as long as we continue to see fuel prices rise.
Now of course we all know that only affects the east.
I dont think anyone here has a crystal ball than can predict what the IAM or company will do if this is voted down. I know many here think they will be back. I agree they will be back in 2 years.
So that means we all will get by on what we make now, and hope that the layoffs dont come to our station.
I think it was 700 who said that if a merger happens USAirways could be the buyer and some here said that would never happen. Well Im not sure I would gamble on that either becasue if the reason for the company comming back was to remove the COC than I beleive that is exactly how a deal will be made, if this vote is a no. Which of course means the COC has no effect.
So once again we find ourselves in a new merger with no agreement just waiting to come to some agreement, years down the road.
I for one do not beleive from all I can find out that the IAM will just fold the west into the east contract, I do plan on asking the IAM rep when he comes to my station about that.
However if this deal is voted down the west will most likley suffer the most in any layoffs becasue of just how the industry is going.
I know and understand there are many issues that need to be resolved, and that this agreement is not great, I however dont see how at this time, with gas continuing to rise as well as many other things that you can feel good about leaving it all on the table.
We all know no matter how we vote they have a plan to merge, our yes vote would prob make it eaiser, bit we have seen how they can overcome any obstical that is thrown at them.
They will find a way and there prob will be layoffs, if and when it comes.
So remember there is much at stake here either way we vote, Its an Big gamble.

How is making a stand for decent pay and benefits a gamble? Was corporate gambling when they submitted their recent compensation guidelines?
The way I see it; Parker and his IAM cronies are exactly right in their perception of fleet service. Tell fleet that they aren't worth anything, then add a healthy dose of fear and scare tactics, offer up a ridiculously substandard proposal, then sit back and laugh while the rank and file fall all over themselves to vote it in. The biggest belly laugh will come when the IAM announces a 100% increase in dues. (our top notch representation doesn't come cheap you know!!).

Then again maybe you're right. The only people to see decent treatment should be the corporate officers ( both IAM & LCC) because they truly know what's best and have the best interest of all of us at heart. Contracts tied directly to the economic performance of the company would be an unreasonable expectation as would aggressive representation from the organization WE ARE PAYING........
I'd take a third part time job before I'll vote this abortion in.
If you stand for nothing you'll fall for anything.

Please, Please, PLEASE, use your spell check from now on.

 

[giantfan]

From WTF CLT....

Contracts tied directly to the economic performance of the company would be an unreasonable expectation

Fuzz, freedom, wiser bud.....and this is the mindset we are up against....

 

[JoeDirt]

GF
I'm sure Tim is flattered that you think he has that much control and influence but we are not mindless automatons. We are perfectly capable of taking all the information available to us and making an informed decision. Granted there are a very select few who will not vote for anything unless we get everything back. Those people piss me off because at some point you have to be a realist. I haven't seen any of those people on this site. The only place I encounter them is at work. Everyone here has a certain point that they would consider acceptable.

 

[WTF_CLT]

From WTF CLT....




Fuzz, freedom, wiser bud.....and this is the mindset we are up against....

Your point being?.......

 

[cltrat]

and still no why are they talking to us in the first place I guess they must just like us

 

[JoeDirt]

Rat
That is the question no one seems to want to address.

Why were the talks initiated in the first place?

 

[WTF_CLT]

Fromm CNN.com this morning...



For those of you that don't believe oil is going to affect this T/A negotiation and that they will come back to the table if we vote no, please read the above article and get your heads out of the sand.

fyi -that's a "b" as in billion.....

And for my friend Tim.....instead of trying hard to figure out where I am....do me a favor and answer this question...

We vote no, Hemenway says ok...but sorry guys they aren't coming back we start reneg at the end of 2009....then what? Stuck with these wages for another 3 years minimum....

Here's another scenario....albeit unlikely....

We note no, they come back again with something better and guess what our friend says.... NO again and pumps up the followers again and we ended up with the some crap for even longer.

Nothing will please some of you. We will NOT get everything we want.....NOT in these economic conditions not EVER!!!!!!!!!

Wake up and read a newspaper, please!!!

Who in life really gets everything they want? Your post really seems to reinforce my stance. How much in total dollars would a DECENT increase in compensation cost the company. What percentage of LCC annual liabilities would this represent? If a company stands to lose a billion plus this year with larger future losses looming then you need to get your protections in place NOW before the merger/layoff/displacement juggernaut heads your(and my) way. Believe me your little yes vote on this proposal amounts to no more than plugging your ears with your fingers while walking through a minefield.

 

[robbedagain]

Joe, the talks were initiate in the first place because this arline want to get in on a merger that to me is no doubt. Tell me GF why cant US Fleet have COC when the other union airlines have that? Just because oil is hoovering around 120 a barrel doesnt mean we have to be the only labor group with out that COC. And with oil hoovering around 120 a barrel then if fleet is going to have a sh!tty contract then mmt and the ia goons need to drop down to what fleet is makin and see how they can survive

 

[giantfan]

Believe me your little yes vote on this proposal amounts to no more than plugging your ears with your fingers while walking through a minefield.

.....and believe me your little no vote leaves me with bakruptcy wages, no doubletime, 2 less holidays and unpaid sicktime.....

 

[Harry Callahan]

.....and believe me your little no vote leaves me with bakruptcy wages, no doubletime, 2 less holidays and unpaid sicktime.....

You keep harping on this double time. With all due respect do you live(or desire) at work?

 

[giantfan]

Coach--

I sure as he** am "harping" on this doubletime. Haven't seen it in a while and would love to see it come back sooner than later. So would a lot of ppl I know.

 

[JoeDirt]

GF
When do you think you will receive this double time pay. Do you plan on working over 16 hours a day or both of your days off.

 

[giantfan]

Joe,

Sometimes life hits you with certain little "bumps in the road" and when that is the case, yes I have been known to work both of my days off and over 16 hours in a day. Do I do it weekly, no I don't, but when I need a little extra, it's there......and double time is certainly better than time and a half.


You should be thankful that you never need to work that much.