Feb / Mar 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[traderjake]

Perhaps a semantic issue or my lousy informed memory......but not quite how I remember it going down.

The Shuttle arbitration was closer to relative position.

 

[cactusboy53]

That quote doesn't prove your point. There's risk in ANY position that USAPA takes. She didn't say you would win anything. She did say (read your quote) "It is free to do so" when talking about abandoning the Nic.

You lose with your own quote. If that's the best you have, better give it up now.

Still Cherry Picking the part that comports with your DOH land grab. Color me surprised.

 

[AAviator]

Nicolau slotted by equipment and status, it was not relative position on the overall seniority list.

That in my opinion is the most fair.

So you think a similar way would be carving out all the current and future 777/787 jobs for the AA pilots would be fair? (disbelief)
And since no E190's exist at AA that those spots should be on the bottom?

 

[Beancounter]

So you think a similar way would be carving out all the current and future 777/787 jobs for the AA pilots would be fair? (disbelief)
And since no E190's exist at AA that those spots should be on the bottom?

Would you prefer us to say, "All your widebodies are ours." It's what we bring to the table isn't it? I don't think locking us off those forever is fair, but the guys currently on those aircraft or expected to switch because of aircraft replacement should have the seniority to remain there. From previous mergers I'd be shocked if an arbitrator didn't give credit for those aircraft.

Bean

 

[traderjake]

So you think a similar way would be carving out all the current and future 777/787 jobs for the AA pilots would be fair? (disbelief)
And since no E190's exist at AA that those spots should be on the bottom?

The pilots with the seniority to hold 777/787 jobs should be at the top of the list and the E190's should be at the bottom, with the furloughed pilots below them.

I don't think we should be fenced off the 777/787 forever, a reasonable number of years would be fair, but I can live with never flying them.

Everything changes with a merger and I think the fewer fences the better.

 

[end_of_alpa]

Cherry Picker;
First of all there is a combined list that met all the conditions set forth by the new US Airways. It was delivered and accepted by Doug Parker. Second, Mr. Parker sent out a letter stating that he has the list in his possession, and that it conformed with his conditions. I have a copy if you want to read it again.

Here is the "end-run" below. Could you please cherry pick exactly what your are speaking about? Please show your work....

4. It is the intent of the Parties that, as of the Effective Date, the terms and conditions of employment for pilots employed by New American Airlines and US Airways will be set by the MTA (as defined in Paragraph 1(a)) and in accordance with the process specified herein. The Parties further understand, however, that it will take some period of time for those terms to be implemented. Accordingly, except for those terms specifically identified in Paragraph 3, the Parties agree that each term of the MTA shall be applicable to all US Airways pilots at the earliest practicable time for each such term, and such terms, when applicable, shall govern and displace any conflicting or wholly or partially inconsistent provision of the former US Airways pilot agreements or the status quo arising there under. Once the MTA has been fully implemented, it shall fully displace and render a nullity any prior collective bargaining agreements applicable to US Airways pilots and any status quo arising there under.

Again, Dave, for your lack of legal comprehension of the MOU REREAD the LAST COUPLE OF SENTANCES:
"...when applicable, shall govern and displace any conflicting or wholly or partially inconsistent provision of the former US Airways pilot agreements or the status quo arising there under. Once the MTA has been fully implemented, it shall fully displace and render a nullity any prior collective bargaining agreements applicable to US Airways pilots and any status quo arising there under."

No more East, West,T/A contracts. ALL GONE.

ED = MTA (they should be working on it right now and given the time frame from now until the third quarter this part should be ready by then, short of arbitration)

MTA = JCBA

JCBA = SLI

(Dates omitted).

I keep showing you THEIR work. You keep looking the other way.

Your logic doesn't fit the fact pattern.

 

[end_of_alpa]

Oh brother, where do I start?

Bean

Don't bother. There is no case law that supports your contentions.

 

[end_of_alpa]

Looks like Doug's old friend is back.

http://business-news.thestreet.com/dallas-morning-news/story/airline-dealmaker-frank-lorenzo-says-doug-parker-got-it-right/11840494

 

[fatherabraham]

Jake,

Your belief that Mr Nicalau got it even remotely right with awa/AAA merge is why I obviously asked. I think the APa boys would lol in your face at the mere mention of a Nic similar award handed to USAPA.
Please elaborate why you believe me wrong.

FA

 

[fatherabraham]

Ted Reed quote:
How dare he?

" Similarly, in 2001, Doug Parker took over as CEO of America West, a small, insignificant, cash-squeezed western airline. "

FA

 

[700UW]

Ted Reed, the fired Charlotte Observer reporter and fired US Airways Employee is really reaching with using Lorenzo the most hated man and the only man to be banned from the airline industry as a source is pathetic. Surprised Chip Munn wasnt quoted too!

 

[traderjake]

Your belief that Mr Nicalau got it even remotely right with awa/AAA merge is why I obviously asked. I think the APa boys would lol in your face at the mere mention of a Nic similar award handed to USAPA.
Please elaborate why you believe me wrong.

Instead of pretending to know what the APA boys think why don't you read what APA has written ( i.e. Delta Nortwest is an example of a successful seniority arbirtation) or ask them (see post #58)?

 

[Hate2fly]

APA and USAPA all got played by both Parker and Horton. Largest airline in the world with the lowest labor cost of the big boys. Horton commented with a smile about negotiating contracts with employees before the transaction even took place. Parker and Horton have low paid pilots possibly for 6 years. 12-31-2018. Nice!

Hate

 

[traderjake]

Bf 109 pilot Franz Stigler and B-17 pilot Charlie Brown's first meeting

 

[traderjake]

APA and USAPA all got played by both Parker and Horton. Largest airline in the world with the lowest labor cost of the big boys.

American is bankrupt, Delta made $1 billion last year.

Can a bankrupt company afford the same costs as a company that made a billion?