Feb / Mar 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Pi brat]

You can't get over the damages thing can you?

The answer to your question is the damages hammer has worked very well.

The company is not going to risk it, and the "it" is extremely large.

So, collude with uscaba and pay "it", or end up with the Nic that everybody agreed to and "it" goes away.

Not a tough decision at all for the company.


Oh, I forgot, you think the only reason the company filed the DJ was to keep the pilot payroll down.

Just keeping you honest. Will there be damages and how much? Haven't you proclaimed them enough to give me an answer?

 

[nic4us]

Just keeping you honest. Will there be damages and how much? Haven't you proclaimed them enough to give me an answer?

Okay, if the merger does not happen, and if the company colludes with usapa and we end up with a DOH list then I would estimate the damages to be on average between 35-50 thousand per West pilot per year beginning in Aug 2008 and ending at the conclusion of trial in 2018 and paid after the company posts it's bond with the court while seeking appeal and chapter 11 bankruptcy and the court will pay out the 10% bond to the plaintiffs upon the chapter 7 liquidation.

How is that for a prediction?

 

[MyJ4JjobSucks]

The company is not going to risk it, and the "it" is extremely large.

So, collude with uscaba and pay "it", or end up with the Nic that everybody agreed to and "it" goes away.

Not a tough decision at all for the company.

How exactly is the Company colluding with USAPA. The MOU was put together and approved by the Comapany (US Airways), APA, UCC, and USAPA (which consists of East and West BPR members).

AOL's attorney acknowledges that the MOU did not contain any provisions to include the Nicolau list.

As explained in my letter of February 18, 2013, we also contend that USAPA has already violated that duty by entering into the MOU without a provision that requires the implementation of the Nicolau list.

The entire BPR, East and West, recommended a yes vote on the MOU, and the West pilots voted by greater than 90% to approve the MOU.

Who is colluding with who???

 

[dca319]

Did you mean isn't?

I did.

 

[dca319]

How exactly is the Company colluding with USAPA. The MOU was put together and approved by the Comapany (US Airways), APA, UCC, and USAPA (which consists of East and West BPR members).

AOL's attorney acknowledges that the MOU did not contain any provisions to include the Nicolau list.

The entire BPR, East and West, recommended a yes vote on the MOU, and the West pilots voted by greater than 90% to approve the MOU.

Who is colluding with who???

It's whom. And collusion is assumed to occur when USAPA doesn't submit the Nicolau and the company accepts a different list.

 

[dca319]

I thought this part or Marty's letter to the APA was interesting. Weren't the West USAPA BPR members involved in the MOU process, and did they not recommend passage of the MOU, fully knowing there was no provision that required the implementation of the Nicolau list? And did the west pilots not vote overwhelmingly to pass the MOU, even though it contained no such provision?

A lack of a provision wouldn't negate the Nicolau. Why do you think USAPA never went that route.

 

[MyJ4JjobSucks]

It's whom. And collusion is assumed to occur when USAPA doesn't submit the Nicolau and the company accepts a different list.

Thank you for the grammer lesson, with as many brewski's as I've had tonight it's a miracle I can type, yet alone use proper english. "Collusion is assumed to occur" Wow, that sure sounds like a rock solid case.

A lack of a provision wouldn't negate the Nicolau. Why do you think USAPA never went that route.

Okay, your lack of a question mark seems a bit ironic after giving me a schooling in grammer.

Then why did Marty bring up the "lack of a provision" in his letter to the APA?

 

[Zone5]

I must have missed the part in the mou where the arbitrated list was replaced with your doh fantasy. Boy did you guys outsmart me. Oh well.
Bean

No, the part you seemed to have missed in the MOU, is where it refers to the TWO LISTS (both DOH, I might add) that make up the seniority snapshot at LCC today. Did I miss the ratified JCBA between East and West that WAS (note the past tense) required to have ever IMPLEMENTED (note the past tense) the NIC?

Just because AOL is throwing a "Hail Marty" doesn't mean squat. Outside of the pure desperation it represents! Just keep writing those checks boys and girls, everything is going to be just fine, for Marty..


seajay

 

[nycbusdriver]

Either a binding commitment to use the Nic will be established in the SLI protocols or the suit will be filed prior to August.

And whatever judge sees the suit will also see what the Ninth said. It will be immediately dismissed over ripeness. It will keep Marty "in the chips" though.

 

[nevergiveup]

No, the part you seemed to have missed in the MOU, is where it refers to the TWO LISTS (both DOH, I might add) that make up the seniority snapshot at LCC today. Did I miss the ratified JCBA between East and West that WAS (note the past tense) required to have ever IMPLEMENTED (note the past tense) the NIC?

Just because AOL is throwing a "Hail Marty" doesn't mean squat. Outside of the pure desperation it represents! Just keep writing those checks boys and girls, everything is going to be just fine, for Marty..


seajay

Marty messed up and is trying to save himself.

 

[traderjake]

TWO LISTS (both DOH, I might add) that make up the seniority snapshot at LCC today.

The East list is not a DOH list, ask the Shuttle and Empire guys.

The West never merged with anyone before, everyone agrees that when you get hired at a company you go to the bottom of that list.

 

[Zone5]

Marty messed up and is trying to save himself.

Actually, Marty is just doing what Marty does (and all the rest of the lawyers in the world), it's called keeping the meter running. Anybody who has EVER been the defendant in a law suit understands how the system works. The plaintiffs attorney, after telling him that he has a really good case (matters not if you actually do), collects his first retainer (plenty more to follow) and files a "complaint", it matters not whether it has ANY basis in fact, alleging the most outrageous accusations and demands. This of course has the effect of both making the lawyers client think that he is really "off to the races" (all on his dime of course) and making the defendant (and your lawyers) scoff at the preposterous nature of the whole matter. In the end the plaintiffs lawyer "convinces" his client that he should "settle" out of court for $XXX (which the lawyer gets a big chunk of) and the defendants lawyer "convinces" you that it would be better (and cheaper) to "settle" the matter and be done with it (admitting no wrongdoing).

Now that everyone understands how this system works, where do you suppose we all are is this "unholy" process? Outside of both sides continuing to write big checks to these "scumbag" lawyers and yes I realize that I am being redundant in my characterization of lawyers.


seajay

 

[Zone5]

The East list is not a DOH list, ask the Shuttle and Empire guys.

The West never merged with anyone before, everyone agrees that when you get hired at a company you go to the bottom of that list.

True enough, to ALPA's shame I might add, which is the big reason they are "history". Be that as it may, I would (and did) advocate making that right with both Eastern Shuttle and Empire pilots. In any case, our "better half" out West is pure DOH and one would think that they would understand the principal well, they damn sure will when the first post-MOU bid comes out in PHX and the scramble for "higher paying" 75 jobs kicks in high gear.

Regardless, there are clearly TWO LISTS at LCC contemplated in the SLI process going forward, which will be combined with the APA list, in some manner, through either negotiation or arbitration. There is NO NIC in any of this, no matter how many letters are written by any "scumbag" lawyer on either side, we ALL voted for the MOU and will be required to live by it. Thank GOD!


seajay

 

[end_of_alpa]

Speaking of dumbazzzes...you do realize 3 out of the 5 federal judge who have looked at this think your scab union is a joke, and the othe 2 agree but have to let you be a joke just because you are a union.

Also, there are only 10 judges in the AZ District court, so it is a 1 in 5 chance if we file, it will be either Wake or Silver........

Things that make you go...hhmmmmm!!!

I simply am going to refuse to debate this issue because you do not understand the legal process. Harper does, he's collecting the money, that's all. Leonidas is the joke and Harper is laughing his a$$ off all the way o the BANK!

 

[traderjake]

In any case, our "better half" out West is pure DOH and one would think that they would understand the principal well....

The West never merged with anyone before so of course their list is DOH.

I would think you would understand that "principle".