Feb / Mar 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[cynic]

What's the good reason for not having pilots on the F/A jumpseat (assuming no F/A wants it)?

power trip

 

[700UW]

Its contractual, not a power trip.

 

[cleardirect]

Its contractual, not a power trip.

The east had it in their contract. The west did not.

That was one of the line in the sand for the east.

So yes power trip. But they lost co-pairing.

 

[Phoenix]

Keep leaning on ripeness. You can only hide behind it for so long. You do know that no matter what you say or do it will become ripe (now).

The company wants the case ruled on the merits. The west wants the case decided. The ninth did not touch the merits.

This case will eventually be decided by a court. Do you think that the facts or what usapa did are going to change? The only thing ripeness does is delay. But every day that rubber band gets tighter. Eventually it is going to snap back.

The Nicolau is going to be used and those stolen years are going to be repaid. If you just scammed your way into the left seat enjoy reserve and working weekends. If you are still in the right seat get used to it. There are 800 west F/O's that are going to upgrade and take those WB seats.

Not ripe only lasts so long. Eventually the bill comes due and you east pilots owe a lot.

Eventually the contingencies will all sort themselves out and circumstances will be such that they meet the requirements to be ripe.... and then you can spend as much money as you want to sue... now something you have to understand is that you will not have the lawsuit you had five years ago but rather you will have a lawsuit based on the facts as they developed up to the point that all the contingencies have evolved, at such future point. Speculating about how such a lawsuit will or will not pan out is just that.. speculation. Personally I have no problem allowing the reps to do the work we voted for them to do. Patience and faith... its a wonderful thing. It all works out in the end.

 

[Claxon]

As with all your posts, wrong again.

Another sophomoric post from the biggest misfit on these boards.

Check the color of your eyes the next time you look in the mirror. Jaundiced to be sure....

Please state specifically what is wrong with the post. You mention a sophomore with jaundiced eyes.

You are a coward that always provides a post to favor the west, to ensure your ride to an East base. Intestinal fortitude check is required by you.

 

[Claxon]

Please feel free to contact your union. They have a pro stands committee.

BTW there is an east pilot that thinks he needs to protect the poor little flight attendants Thought you might be him.

But taking away something the west had for 25 years you might get some push back. It was the east flight attendants that took the jump seat not the west.

The west pilots could not ride on their own jumpseat, if the weight and balance did not it allow for 25 years. You rode the coat tails of the East pilots to get real jumpseat privileges.

Speaking of 25 years, click on the link below. The west pay scale is the joke of the pilot profession. Do the math.

http://web.mit.edu/a...T PERSONNEL.htm

 

[Claxon]

They hear less than 1% of all petitions. Their silence on the matter means little to nothing to any other circuits where another prayer for relief may have been filed. The fact that the Company was compelled to file a Declaratory Judgment case supports Bybee's opinion that all parties would have benefited from judicial relief being granted on the merits of the West Pilot claims.

http://www.supremecourt.gov/faq.aspx

How many cases are appealed to the Court each year and how many cases does the Court hear?
The Court receives approximately 10,000 petitions for a writ of certiorari each year. The Court grants and hears oral argument in about 75-80 cases.

Bybee? Judge Bybee had a dissenting opinion in the 9th Circuit Court ruling that guillotined the head off aol's early 2000 west pilot hired fools.

You lost the declaratory judgement.

Sir, you will always be a former west pilot, remember your not very flattering history. Your frustration in the pecking order of those pilots that deserve respect, is causing you frustration that is evident in your posts.

 

[N924PS]

Please state specifically what is wrong with the post. You mention a sophomore with jaundiced eyes.

You are a coward that always provides a post to favor the west, to ensure your ride to an East base. Intestinal fortitude check is required by you.

Specifically, your post is pure BS.

There may be a handful of West and East Pilots that have or may deny the jumpseat privilege, but certainly not as you described.

Still waiting for you to disclose the reasons for you disdain for all things West. Especially since you deny being an East pilot.

Did HP terminate you from employment at some point? A relative or close friend perhaps?

What IS your story Clax, we would all love to know. It would help give your posts some grounding. Or not...

 

[EastUS1]

But taking away something the west had for 25 years you might get some push back. It was the east flight attendants that took the jump seat not the west.

Were there no west FAs involved in negotiating their new agreement? As for "taking away something the west had for 25 years you might get some push back"...? The FAs work together with all presumably "professional pilots". Two words = Grow Up!

 

[EastUS1]

There may be a handful of West and East Pilots that have or may deny the jumpseat privilege, but certainly not as you described.

Agreed. I've no idea of what the "handful" percentages are though. Even with our years of mutual mudslinging, insults and nyaah-nyaahs; nic4us for example, has never done other than agree that the jumpseat shouldn't be a political instrument or punitive device to play with as if a toy. I very much doubt either of us would encounter any problems hitching a ride with the other. Not all in any group of people are ever complete and universal jerks.

Having said that: The one time in the post nic announced era that I tried jumpseating on west metal...I was denied without so much as a shred of conversation. The obvious observation that not all of any group can be complete jerks hardly precludes some from being class A models of such.

No one should be abusing FAs of either "side" due to contractual changes....Period!

 

[nycbusdriver]

Agreed. I've no idea of what the "handful" percentages are though. Even with our years of mutual mudslinging, insults and nyaah-nyaahs; nic4us for example, has never done other than agree that the jumpseat shouldn't be a political instrument or punitive device to play with as if a toy. I very much doubt either of us would encounter any problems hitching a ride with the other. Not all in any group of people are ever complete and universal jerks.

Having said that: The one time in the post nic announced era that I tried jumpseating on west metal...I was denied without so much as a shred of conversation. The obvious observation that not all of any group can be complete jerks hardly precludes some from being class A models of such.

No one should be abusing FAs of either "side" due to contractual changes....Period!

The objective of denying the flight attendant jumpseat is strictly a power trip for the flight attendants. It would have been a no-cost item in their new contract, but they declined to provide it. There is no rationale beside spite over the fact that they cannot ride in the cockpit jumpseat per FAR and TSA rules. If letting them ride in the cockpit were up to the captain, most would allow it without hesitation. They have so little power, they needed to assert the little bit they had, and in the process cause a greater divide in our already fractured labor structure.

On so many occasions I have offered to take the cockpit jumpseat to give a more junior flight attendant my cabin seat. I will likely continue doing that, but not without a bit of hesitation over how they have treated pilots on this f/a jumpseat priviliege (which would have cost NOTHING to continue system wide.)

What's the rule at AA? That's what will prevail anyway.

 

[Claxon]

As with all your posts, wrong again.

Another sophomoric post from the biggest misfit on these boards.

Check the color of your eyes the next time you look in the mirror. Jaundiced to be sure....

Even you were denied by them. Funny. You back them at all costs for a shorter commute. Absolutely pathetic.

 

[end_of_alpa]

Specifically, your post is pure BS.

There may be a handful of West and East Pilots that have or may deny the jumpseat privilege, but certainly not as you described.

Still waiting for you to disclose the reasons for you disdain for all things West. Especially since you deny being an East pilot.

Did HP terminate you from employment at some point? A relative or close friend perhaps?

What IS your story Clax, we would all love to know. It would help give your posts some grounding. Or not...

I had a very pleasant experience last month jump seating from LAX on the red eye. It was a West crew and we all talked like we were old friends. One center seat left in the rear so went back and slept all the way to CLT. Nice crew. It isn't the web board, that's for sure.

 

[snapthis]

I had a very pleasant experience last month jump seating from LAX on the red eye. It was a West crew and we all talked like we were old friends. One center seat left in the rear so went back and slept all the way to CLT. Nice crew. It isn't the web board, that's for sure.

I have yet to have a bad experience myself with East Crew, agents, etc. I hope ops remain in Pitt, schedulers top-notch with the exception of a Phoenix transfer who has a Flyby Attitude Disorder..We all have a few bad apples who could do all of us a favor and take an early retirement.

 

[nycbusdriver]

I have yet to have a bad experience myself with East Crew, agents, etc. I hope ops remain in Pitt, schedulers top-notch with the exception of a Phoenix transfer who has a Flyby Attitude Disorder..We all have a few bad apples who could do all of us a favor and take an early retirement.

My bet: Ops won't remain in PIT, but the employees will be offered a transfer to DFW. Almost all of them will jump at the chance to get out of snow country.