Feb / Mar 2013 IAM Fleet Service Discussions

[ograc]

I don't think most folks will vote against or for a contract based on a promise or a prayer. That said, the UA TA is perhaps the worst TA that I have ever seen and that is saying a lot. As crazy as this sounds, the US and the AMR contracts have more stations that are protected and more work. And as far as the wage, getting 11.5% (sCO and customer service and res will get a lot less than 11.5%) from 2010-2017, which includes only a 2 percenter after the initial immediate raise, leaves quite a lot to be desired and no doubt it won't keep up with even non union Delta wage rates. As far as the work rules, again very sad. They abolish the part time cap and do a Rick Flair reversal but putting a bar on the current full time headcount. Disturbing indeed. regards,

This is the end result of the "New Direction" negotiations campaign promise. The end result and TA the DL 141 Leadership Team is congatulating themselves on achieving. IMO... disappointing, disturbing but not suprising. In defense of the current leadership team; past leadership teams did the same thing regarding the outsourcing issue. Job protection that lasts for 3 years for many while 10% are left with none from day one. The members in the stations listed with job protection through 2016 are toast after that. The 10% left with no protection won't last that long. Is this the best representation we can hope for?

 

[ograc]

I will not argue with a fair answer. I think you understand what I'm saying....even in negotiations not all agree and not all things lost are "Won Back" so easily. I certainly agree with you about outsourcing but what i dont agree with is the bashing of not getting it all back at once. Im not to familiar with UA's contract VS Continentals outsourcing language. Maybe what is in the TA is somewhere in the middle at least idk. I think using the "New Direction " slogan as a " not getting it done, you promised us more" thing is unfair.
You know as well as i that when you give up....it takes 2-3 times longer to get back, if you do at all....

im done
Peace Cargo!

Fair enough Mike 33. I have certainly been around the block long enough to know not all will be "Won Back" at once in negotiations. We have lost too much in the past. What is evident to me though, based on the UA TA, is outsourcing is not a priority "win back" issue with IAM DL 141. IMO... preserving dues paying members' jobs should be paramount to a labor union. I find their lack of urgency regarding this issue disturbing and disappointing. I find no "somewhere in the middle" regarding this issue. The District has again, under Section 6 negotiations, given the company the ability to eliminate countless union members' jobs and subsequently concedes leverage at future contract negotiations. It is what it is Mike 33.
I'm done
Peace Mike!

 

[JFK Fleet Service]

Nobody is drooling over the new IAM TA at UA. At least not here in ORD. The contract is a compensation negative pact and another job losing pact, and in a lot of ways worse than yours at bankrupt American. In fact, it is so awful that they compare it to American then they claim it is industry leading and stick the gold star on it. regards,

Actually I didn't say anyone at United was raving about it there sport.I've seen people here on this board and the AA board saying it was great and "We should get the same"

 

[700UW]

well for being a right to work state , with a lot of apathetic workers , I think they did OK with that contract .

Right to work (for less) has no bearing on airline workers who are unionized under the Railway labor Act, once again you dont know what you speak of, and make yourself look like a fool!

 

[Tim Nelson]

Actually I didn't say anyone at United was raving about it there sport.I've seen people here on this board and the AA board saying it was great and "We should get the same"

I hear ya. Well, just remind those folks at AMR that if they feel they should get the same then only 7 stations instead of 17 should be protected. Of course, the IAM didn't even fight for cargo so cargo was eliminated a few months ago everywhere. JFK has protections under AMR but has the "Witches Hourglass" at United. Same with AUS and some other stations. Only having 7 stations with protections past 36 months is nuts. Especially, since the IAM negotiated this with the world's largest and most profitable airline over the past 3 years making Billions. Your situation was a dire bankruptcy. At any rate, if the IAM gets enough cards, I think some key people from both AMR and US AIRWAYS will get the Teamsters in, even without getting any cards. regards,

 

[T5towbar]

I don't think most folks will vote against or for a contract based on a promise or a prayer. That said, the UA TA is perhaps the worst TA that I have ever seen and that is saying a lot. As crazy as this sounds, the US and the AMR contracts have more stations that are protected and more work. And as far as the wage, getting 11.5% (sCO and customer service and res will get a lot less than 11.5%) from 2010-2017, which includes only a 2 percenter after the initial immediate raise, leaves quite a lot to be desired and no doubt it won't keep up with even non union Delta wage rates. As far as the work rules, again very sad. They abolish the part time cap and do a Rick Flair reversal but putting a bar on the current full time headcount. Disturbing indeed. regards,

That's true. This TA makes no sense, and it is a pay cut for a lot of people. And no protections as well. I will be voting NO.
Why should a union be subsidizing any loss of jobs, especially if they aren't going to get any pay increases or any other benefits? This is madness! Even Delta is getting a pay raise this year....... The IAM has become pathetic, while management smiles and Jeff gets a triple pay raise.

Go back to the table and get it done correctly.

BTW: How's the IAM going to distribute that 130,000,000?

 

[T5towbar]

Actually I didn't say anyone at United was raving about it there sport.I've seen people here on this board and the AA board saying it was great and "We should get the same"

Whoever says that is: a. Ready to retire and that 75,000 out looks good (even though it is based on participation and 1000) This
can be pulled back and not guaranteed. So don't count on it with this management.
b. NUTS!

 

[ograc]

Whoever says that is: a. Ready to retire and that 75,000 out looks good (even though it is based on participation and 1000) This
can be pulled back and not guaranteed. So don't count on it with this management.
b. NUTS!

An irrational, short-sighted and self-centered thought process has guided voting on TAs at US in the past. I hope it's not contagious as the merged group at UA considers their TA. Do not assume co workers will view this TA as you do. If you see obvious flaws and short-comings in this TA make sure to discuss it with them. Communication within the group is critical at this time.

 

[T5towbar]

An irrational, short-sighted and self-centered thought process has guided voting on TAs at US in the past. I hope it's not contagious as the merged group at UA considers their TA. Do not assume co workers will view this TA as you do. If you see obvious flaws and short-comings in this TA make sure to discuss it with them. Communication within the group is critical at this time.

That's true. Communication is the key and from what I hear and know, this TA won't pass, especially on the sCO side. The "ten percenters" will vote NO. IAH and EWR will vote NO. CLE and most of the major "Market Rate" line cites who are on the clock will vote NO. Res will vote NO. Who is going to vote for it on the sUA side? They may get some retro, but the District is doling out the money. We on the sCO side will not be getting jack. This TA should go down in flames. But strange things can happen. Lets see what Delaney and Wall come up to save and polish this turd.

 

[ograc]

That's true. Communication is the key and from what I hear and know, this TA won't pass, especially on the sCO side. The "ten percenters" will vote NO. IAH and EWR will vote NO. CLE and most of the major "Market Rate" line cites who are on the clock will vote NO. Res will vote NO. Who is going to vote for it on the sUA side? They may get some retro, but the District is doling out the money. We on the sCO side will not be getting jack. This TA should go down in flames. But strange things can happen. Lets see what Delaney and Wall come up to save and polish this turd.

Watch out for the persuasive appeal of a retro check and a pay raise to an employee in a hub city who doesn't need to worry about job protection. We've had subcontracting language voted in for a pay raise and no retro in the past. Communication and discussion is critical. Good Luck.

 

[wings396]

Very true, and I don't believe that we have ever seen any Retro pay either nor do I think that we ever will. I'm sure that you recall that we did have Retro paycuts a few years ago.

 

[ograc]

Very true, and I don't believe that we have ever seen any Retro pay either nor do I think that we ever will. I'm sure that you recall that we did have Retro paycuts a few years ago.

Retro paycuts seem to be the only thing in US's dictionary under Retro.

 

[ograc]

Question to all US Fleet Service: If a representation election for the Fleet Service is warranted, as a result of the merger, what are the chances US will negotiate a TA with the IAM prior to an election taking place?

 

[john john]

Delaney thinks it’s "the greatest thing since sliced bread"

 

[wings396]

Question to all US Fleet Service: If a representation election for the Fleet Service is warranted, as a result of the merger, what are the chances US will negotiate a TA with the IAM prior to an election taking place?

I'm going to put the odds at 50/50 on that one. They have made peace with the pilots and F/A's, so one would think that they would try to schmooze us a little bit in order to keep fleet quiet while they close on the merger.