Freedom, you ARE a hypocrite. You say UA should vote the TA down because of the potential outsourcing list. Fine, I'm cool with that. However, when it was the US contract and you got a raise it was OK. Is that not hypocritical? If you don't like beign called "hypocrite", fine. Try FLAMING IDIOT!!! It's not a new trick; YOU ALREADY VOTED FOR IT HERE! In fact, you PROVED that the trick works! You're so ignorant that you don't even see that you fell for it yourself!
Feb / Mar 2013 IAM Fleet Service Discussions
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Freedom, you ARE a hypocrite. You say UA should vote the TA down because of the potential outsourcing list. Fine, I'm cool with that. However, when it was the US contract and you got a raise it was OK. Is that not hypocritical? If you don't like beign called "hypocrite", fine. Try FLAMING IDIOT!!! It's not a new trick; YOU ALREADY VOTED FOR IT HERE! In fact, you PROVED that the trick works! You're so ignorant that you don't even see that you fell for it yourself!
freedom
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i'm sorry , was their a viable alternative to keeping me in poverty that I somehow missed last time we voted ? Was that not our SECOND contract to vote on .... did you expect me to vote myself poverty wages by saying no ? of COURSE I voted for it .... do you have any idea what I was making an hour ? It was not a living wage ....
I and my brothers and sisters here in PHX are now making something CLOSE to a living wage , which means that I am not forced by desperation to accept a contract that outsources stations .......
freedom
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I don't need to justify my former position on that contract which had it's own unique set of circumstances ....
needless to say in any future contract , my position is AGAINST outsourcing any further stations ... if you guys can't cope with that , it's your problem not mine .
28L_or_10R?
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That was the payscale brought to you by Pat Rezler, Linda Malone and the other TWU negotiators that got us a contract in 2000. You want this union back? No overtime equalization - OT based solely on seniority. The company only paid to move 500 pounds if you had to transfer due to a RIF? Top at around $15 after 15 years. What was starting pay? $7-something? Horse trading between the TWU and management. You want those people back? You want the TWU back.
You know, Freedom, unlike others on this board I have worked with you. I thought you were a good guy but wearing rose-tinted glasses. Kind of naive and innocent. Not knowing the difference between sh*t and Shinola. But reading your drivel on this forum I just see you as a spineless, cross-eyed worm. You just go back and forth with the direction of the wind. You say one thing in one post and contradict yourself in another. You have no shame.
ograc
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With the UA TA it is apparent what the IAM District 141's position is on future outsourcing. They're quite comfortable with agreeing to it. So then .... why should anyone expect a different position from the District when negotiating with US? They've shown their colors on the issue in my book. US has gotta be loving it. Wrap up job loss in a different package and they bite hook, line and sinker. In the end... the company accomplishes their projected "synergies" with a merger and countless careers and jobs are flushed. If you're in a smaller station it's hard to distinguish which party is worse. What is apparent is niether is looking out for you. I thought we were going in a "New Direction" and all of this was going to change.
freedom
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and you forget that those people your knocking with the TWU contract are the ones who brought IN a union to America West Airline .... I am well aware of what the pay was like at AWA before there was a union , and if your gonna knock that lousy contract you should at least compare it to what existed before ... I have to Respect Pat because as I have heard , it was he who pushed hard to bring in the union ...
I also think your being a little harsh on the former union ...I mean AWA was just some backwater regional carrier , did you think they were going to have AA wages back in the day ?
As for me not having shame ... what do I have to be ashamed of ? I did what I felt was necessary at the time ....and now times have changed , and I am taking that course of action that I now think is the best course of action to take ...
Different situations require different responses .
freedom
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well for being a right to work state , with a lot of apathetic workers , I think they did OK with that contract .
mike33
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Cargo......Listen to you?....where you not running for office a while back ? and if so would you not have been part of bringing that TA to the membership at UA under false pretenses? From what im hearing from you you would be telling them that its not a good agreement even though your bosses say it is god enough to bring to a vote?.....you see where im going here!
I work in a station where some nominees were not elected in the end and are bad mouthing this TA. Im wondering what they would say if we could rewind and " They " were in charge of the Presentation...
Our situation at USAIR is much different and you know it...2 sacrifices and now profits off the sweat of our Labors to be " Used" as a pawn to cast our negotiations into another BK contract....We are not in BK and that is THE REALITY. We are being played and its about time we said " We Want "
mike33
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Again ill ask you freedom...will you ask and approve for self-help if needed.......very simple question because i would GLADLY!!! under these unique set of circumstances !!!! as you say.
ograc
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You're losing me here Freedom. You speak of a right to work state within an airline industry under the Railway Labor Act. State Right to Work statutes are superseded by Federal Legislation, such as the RLA, that governs the airline industry. I don't understand what your reasoning or point is.
If it was so terrible you should have just gotten another job with a livable wage. I survived on the $6.95/hour.
Yeah, you're right. The apathetic workers in PHX brought us those wages that weren't enough, so why are you throwing the jobs of people not in AZ under the bus to fix the PHX workers mistakes?
EDIT: Sorry, let off unexpectedly there. I'm not bashing the guys at PHX there. I'm bashing Freedom for his blame game of avoiding his own personal responsibility and ignorance.
ograc
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Mike 33,
It is true I ran for office awhile back. Had I been elected and appointed to the NC I would have resisted any outsourcing language being part of a TA. Primarily because I have seen first hand the devestating impact it has on our members. Additionally, because I work in an outline station. Most important of all though; I believe it goes against the grain and the very nature of organized labor of protecting all memers' jobs in the long run... especially those who will be directly affected. I do not fault our NC at US or UA; for I know how the politics of "selling" a TA, agreed to by the District Leadership, works. I just don't agree with conceding members' jobs. What I find disturbing, looking back, is this is a leadership team who criticized these same concessions and promised a "New Direction". I knew at the time this was a campaign promise that could not be fullfilled and so did they. In the meantime... more members jobs, careers and livelihoods will be lost. Nothing has changed.
28L_or_10R?
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The people who brought TWU to AWA constructed a contract that only benefited people with over 15 years. When I first started, there were few people with that much seniority. It was a small circle of hangers-on. At that time, if a person had two years, they were the senior people on the ramp. The overtime was awarded on seniority. That meant that the only ones making a somewhat "living wage" were the only ones being awarded overtime. You didn't see this much at PHX because they always had OT because all the low-pay agents were quitting en masse. At smaller stations, you would have a few senior people who took all the OT. What about the disparity in the pay scale?
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