AMR Files 1133 motion

[eolesen]

Stretching that timeframe prolongs the agony for a few, but may wind up hurt everyone more in the long run.

Assuming the rulings are made in early June, there's no hope of seeing meaningful changes to the schedule while traffic is up. There's a slightly higher chance you'd see portions of the winter schedule taking advantage of the scope clause changes.

It's not the greatest news for management, in that they'll have less and less time to prove that their plan is working. While some of you will probably cackle with glee that management will be getting theirs, the fact is that every day lost now is also one less day to prove that AMR can indeed survive as a standalone entity.

 

[BigMac]

What' the worst that can happen? I file my own BK, Like the 4000 guys in tulsa and afw are going to be doing

With the cost of living in Tulsa and unlimited OT.. I don't see filing bk in the future. Settle for unemployment and use the OT that is saved up and Tulsans should be good for @ least two years without a job XD

 

[TWU informer]

Stretching that timeframe prolongs the agony for a few, but may wind up hurt everyone more in the long run.

Assuming the rulings are made in early June, there's no hope of seeing meaningful changes to the schedule while traffic is up. There's a slightly higher chance you'd see portions of the winter schedule taking advantage of the scope clause changes.

It's not the greatest news for management, in that they'll have less and less time to prove that their plan is working. While some of you will probably cackle with glee that management will be getting theirs, the fact is that every day lost now is also one less day to prove that AMR can indeed survive as a standalone entity.

If I didn't know you so well, I would think you just slammed management for even screwing up the BK filing.

Are you really so in love with management that you cannot see that they are not capable of running a standalone entity?
I actually believe it would not matter if we worked for $5 per hour, they still could not survive given their current ignorance.

They are just looking for a scapegoat for that fact, just as they have looked for one for all other revelations of incompetence. How much do you stand to lose if this fails?

 

[CactUS4Ever]

If I didn't know you so well, I would think you just slammed management for even screwing up the BK filing.

Are you really so in love with management that you cannot see that they are not capable of running a standalone entity?
I actually believe it would not matter if we worked for $5 per hour, they still could not survive given their current ignorance.

They are just looking for a scapegoat for that fact, just as they have looked for one for all other revelations of incompetence. How much do you stand to lose if this fails?

Your only one of a few people TWU informer that sees the writing on the wall. These other people that are so in love with management they don't see the big picture. AA is playing chess and are 3steps ahead. I guess people are in denial. AA will survive will it be standalone or a merger. Yes AA planes will be flying but at the expense of all it's employees. Not many employees will stay with the new rate of pay and minimum benefits and a good percentage wil be furloughed. So I don't get all the AA fans on this board. AA bankruptcy is for management not its employees.

 

[eolesen]

If I didn't know you so well, I would think you just slammed management for even screwing up the BK filing.

No, your first assumption was correct. I don't think they're managing the bankruptcy filing as aggressively as they should have. But I'm not a lawyer.

You know my opinions haven't changed materially from when I was in management, aside from perhaps being a lot freer to call things out without serious repercussions from HR, Employee Relations, or CorpComm when I say something one of those groups don't want said.


What do I stand to lose professionally & financially if AA doesn't emerge as a standalone? Nothing.

It's no secret my employer does business with AA, and would like to sell you guys stuff that vendors like Sabre & HP currently provide. Truth is, though, we'd probably retain the same amount of existing business if AA were standalone, parted out, or merged into another carrier.

What do I stand to lose personally? Again, not a lot. WN already has about half my domestic flying. I'll have to switch over my international flying to Star Alliance if AA winds up with either DL or US, because I choose not to fly on either of the latter two carriers unless there's no other choice available.


Yes, I know it might come as a total surprise to you that someone could have strong opinions that aren't tied to financial or personal gain, but hey, it does happen from time to time.

 

[TWU informer]

TWU lets EXECS off the hook on the depositions.
This means a deal is already done!

From Aviation Blog:

Someone who knows advises me that there'll be no pre-trial depositions of American Airlines officials before the airline goes to bankruptcy court April 23 to present its case.

American is seeking to reject its labor contracts, and last Friday, the Transport Workers Union filed notice that it intended to depose 10 American Airlines executives and managers and four consultants/advisors.

All of them had made declarations in American's lengthy filing seeking to reject the contracts under Section 1113(c) of the federal bankruptcy code.

However, all parties agreed to stipulations Monday that limited pre-trial discovery to the four consultants: Daniel M. Kasper, Jerrold A. Glass, Alexander Dichter and David L. Resnick.

 

[eolesen]

No, it means that the lawyers figured out that having a deposition would be a waste of billable hours wasn't likely to result in anything new being revealed that wasn't already contained in the declarations.

This may actually wind up being a smart move -- gives the union's lawyers the ability to question execs openly during the hearing, with less ability to dodge the issue or circle the wagons...

 

[WorldTraveler]

Actually, Eric, you have a lot of pride at stake in AA's outcome and that has a much higher price than what you spend on airfares, even if you don't want to admit it.
.
No one wants to spend years of their lives investing in a company that goes down the tubes... we all get that.
.
And AA's finances do affect you - you yourself asked about how AA's BK might effect your ability to draw your pension. That is an understandable question and everyone expects you to do what you can to protect your own interests.
.
But let's not pretend that there is no personal skin in the game for anyone conversing here.... everyone has some interest or they wouldn't be participating in the conversation.
AA is in BK precisely because it cannot meet all of its commitments to every entity - and it must use the law and the courts to prioritize what must give.
.
No one is surprised that many AA people will not support your views - and the reality is that the employees have a far bigger stake in determining whether AA successfully restructures - and more importantly succeeds long term.
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Thus we will all read your posts and theirs within the context of knowing that everyone has something at stake here.

 

[mike33]

" However, all parties agreed to stipulations Monday that limited pre-trial discovery to the four consultants: Daniel M. Kasper, Jerrold A. Glass, Alexander Dichter and David L. Resnick. "


In addition to recently serving as US Airways’ executive vice president and chief human resources officer, Glass has served as chief negotiator for corporations in the airline, railroad and other transportation related industries. He has successfully concluded nearly 70 separate labor agreements without any disruptions to service or job actions. He has advised clients on negotiation strategies and contract proposals, with comparative studies of industry labor agreements, including pay, practices and procedures and benefit plans. In addition, Glass has provided labor analysis on contract negotiations and settlements for investment banks, financial services institutions and other non-airline companies.

Glass’ experience and leadership will be of particular value to companies in industries facing similar restructuring issues (i.e. labor costs, pension restructuring, healthcare management, retiree issues, etc.) to those that were addressed at US Airways.

Yeah Great!..PBGC is what they got! Grab ur Socks!!!

 

[eolesen]

Actually, Eric, you have a lot of pride at stake in AA's outcome and that has a much higher price than what you spend on airfares, even if you don't want to admit it.

Save the sanctimonious crap for your fan club... Only a fool would take pride in the opinions they post on the internet about a company they don't work for.

I take pride in what was accomplished while I was at AA. But in the six years since then? Not mine to take credit for, be it positive or negative, much less take any pride in.

 

[WorldTraveler]

Eric, you should be proud of what you accomplished while you were at AA and the company that AA was when you were there....
problem is that it isn't the same company and hasn't been for years... others have been far more aggressive at going after the success that came to AA for years.
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Let's just not pretend that any of us are disconnected parties from any of this - and in your case you did indeed note that you have a financial consideration in AA's BK process. I don't expect you to be disinterested in what happens w/ the retirement you accumulated.
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Just recognize that AA's future rests in the hands of other people and they are acting on what is in their best interest - and the majority of them are not terribly interested in continuing in the legacy of the AA you knew if it comes at the cost of their own futures.
And given that you just said within the past hours that your opinions haven't changed since the days when you were in management, you shouldn't be surprised that a forum that is largely populated by labor is hostile to management.
I certainly have no expectations of finding a fan club in the positive news I post about DL, esp. given that the majority of the regular participants on that forum are members of labor.
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I obviously have my reasons for seeing AA succeed - and I have long respected AA far more than some of its other competitors; I have also made it clear that what AA is passing through is no different from what other airlines have faced and AA deserves the same right to work through its reorg process.
.
But every one of those cases faced unique challenges - and AA's will to... not the least of which is that many of AA's people are far less motivated to keep putting forth what they did in the past.... that is not unexpected and was a risk that AA considered in the filing process...and Arpey to his credit tried very hard to avoid.
.

 

[Buck]

AMR will need money coming out of bankruptcy

http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2012/04/rothschild-amr-will-need-a-lot.html

 

[JFK Fleet Service]

I was shocked they opted for the freeze instead of outright termination.I still think they will ultimately terminate all of the DB plans,especially if Wall Street continues to be unimpressed with the "Restructuring" as it is currently constituted.

 

[WorldTraveler]

here is the document referenced... it is always worth reading for yourself what the company is giving to the judge to read.
http://www.amrcaseinfo.com/pdflib/2211_15463.pdf

Here are several key sections of the document.

III. THE AMR BUSINESS PLAN PROJECTS THAT THE COMPANY WILL
EMERGE WITH SUBSTANTIAL AND INCREASING AMOUNTS OF SECURED
DEBT AND ANNUAL AIRCRAFT RENT EXPENSE

IV. AMR REQUIRES CAPITAL INVESTMENTS TO SUPPORT THE
RESTRUCTURING STRATEGY AND BUSINESS PLAN

V. AMR’S DECISION TO FREEZE, RATHER THAN TERMINATE, ITS DEFINED
BENEFIT PENSION PLANS WILL REQUIRE SIGNIFICANT ANNUAL CASH
PENSION CONTRIBUTIONS AND SUBSTANTIALLY INCREASE ITS LONGTERM
OBLIGATIONS POST EMERGENCE

VI. THE AIRLINE INDUSTRY IS AFFECTED BY ECONOMIC DOWNTURNS,
EXOGENOUS SHOCKS AND VOLATILE FUEL PRICES THAT NECESSITATE
AIRLINES TO MAINTAIN AN ADEQUATE LIQUIDITY BUFFER

VII. THE RELIEF REQUESTED IN THE § 1113 MOTION IS NEEDED FOR A
SUCCESSFUL REORGANIZATION AND IS ESSENTIAL TO AMR’S ABILITY
TO ATTRACT NEEDED CAPITAL, REDUCE LEVERAGE, AND OBTAIN
CREDIT RATINGS COMPARABLE TO OTHER CARRIERS

along with a key sentence in the discussion about credit ratings.

"Because a far larger portion of AMR debt is secured
relative to other large network carriers, AMR will have a greater burden of debt and leverage
upon emergence than most of its peers. In addition, Delta and United are generating more cash
relative to AMR, partly attributable to the operating leverage of their larger scale, which should
allow them to continue to de-lever relative to AMR. If AMR is unable to obtain its proposed
labor cost reductions, the Company’s financial projections and credit profile will be further
exacerbated compared to other large network US carriers. As illustrated in the table below, even
if AMR were to achieve the full labor cost reductions, its financial performance and credit profile
is not as strong as most competitors."

 

[robbedagain]

it sounds a lotlike they may not be able to emerge as a stand a lone from they way the link above was describing. Im not saying a merger or anything like that, but AMR should have known that emerging from CH11 and having the debvt most likely due to its orders of Airbus andBoeing aircraft would not disappear but then again keep onoperating the MD-80 gas guzzzlers compared to Boeing andAirbus fuel efficient planes has to be taking a toll on them. The mgmt always says labor labor labor well what about mgmt taking their flippin pay down to $1.00 a day instead of labor labor labor