AMFA Organizing Drive to Replace Association

[1AA]

This is a question for the folks in the Know please back up answer with facts..

If the card drive is successful and we have a vote;
Please explain how the voting goes?
ex: is it possible to loose union representation ?
ex: what does 51 % of the voting mean?
ex: if the vote is split say 30 % IAM 30 % TWU and 40% Amfa.
Does this mean no representation..
The organizers need to have this answered.
Over herd the twu lackies spewing the no-representation scenario.

Answers are here. Please don't ask to be spoon fed the answers. I'm not attacking you just making sure we don't start getting posters who can't search for themselves without giving an effort. Any additional links welcomed.

https://nmb.gov/NMB_Application/index.php/overview-faq/

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

The other Association Member (Garcia) screwing the AMT’s to protect his Fleet Service Clerk dues payers.

What do you expect? A UNION by it's very nature is a socialist/leftist entity. If you don't like idea of socialist distribution of wealth then a UNION is probably not the best fit for you (where your pay is contractually mandated by seniority instead of work ethic, skill level, and efficiency). You really think AMFA will be any different? Perhaps it will for a time but the endgame is always the same.

While LAA AMT’s are losing over $2500 per month, and shafted on Holidays and Vacation.

If the contract is being followed you are not being shafted and you are not losing money. You can't lose what is not contractually yours despite how entitled you feel to receive it.

American Airlines management should see the benefit of their Mechanic and Related employees separating from the Fleet Service Clerks.

There is NO benefit to American Airlines. NONE.

American Airlines is the last of all Carriers with unskilled workers dominating the future of AMT’s. To have a level playing field in the industry, AA Mechanics must correct this by signing cards and voting to leave the Industrial Unions.

Who cares if it is the last carrier? It is also one of the last carriers to maintain such a large maintenance presence in the United States. Should they follow the other airlines regarding maintenance? Obviously most members are not upset enough to demand a change in representation.

AMT’s should see the benefit of not being at the negotiating table with Fleet Service and realize the profound loss of Dignity and Respect by being called “ground workers”. The AMT profession has been damaged and demeaned by Industrial Unions for years!

Your elitism is showing. Can you explain to be why you are not ground crew? You are certainly not air crew.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groundcrew

Airline ground crew members include: airframe and powerplant, technicians, avionics technicians, ramp agents, customer service agents, and flight dispatchers. Ground crew members are responsible for clearing the runway and gate area of any debris or garbage, in order to prevent foreign object damage by an object being sucked into an engine. The crew visually inspects the tarmac and removes any items found; this is typically called a "FOD walk" and is done prior to an aircraft's arrival and departure.

Look you have your agenda/goals whatever you want to call it and that's great. I say good look to you. However when you start making posts that it insults and demeans you to be associated with "ground workers" frankly I find that conceited. I find it about as palatable as you would find a flight attendant dismissing you as a "dirty grease monkey" and projecting an attitude that you defile the air with your mere presence.

 

[ATD]

I do not need spoon feeding.
just letting the folks going around getting cards sign to be ready and able to answer questions..
There is an opportunity and we do not need to let it get out off control.
The TWU and IAM will be running a "fake news" disinformation..
just watch....

 

[eolesen]

I thought the airport was responsible for maintaining the jetbridge. Is that incorrect?

Depends on the airport, but at the hubs, pretty certain they're maintained by FM (Title II). GSE would be fairly easy to outsource. FM, not so much.

 

[1AA]

I do not need spoon feeding.
just letting the folks going around getting cards sign to be ready and able to answer questions..
There is an opportunity and we do not need to let it get out off control.
The TWU and IAM will be running a "fake news" disinformation..
just watch....

Again I was not attacking you personally. I just want to express the point to everyone that information is out there and easily obtained.
Thanks.

 

[eolesen]

ex: if the vote is split say 30 % IAM 30 % TWU and 40% Amfa.
Does this mean no representation..

Here's the official language:

When a union is already in place, a competing union may file an election petition if the labor contract has expired or is about to expire, and it can show interest by at least 30% of the employees. This would normally result in a three-way election, with the choices being the incumbent labor union, the challenging one, and "none." If none of the three receives a majority vote, a runoff will be conducted between the top two vote-getters.

The only way you risk becoming unrepresented is if a majority (50%+1) of represented employees 1) don't cast a ballot or 2) cast a ballot that says "no union whatsoever".

There's always a chance of having less than 50% turnout, but I can't think of a representation vote in the airlines that didn't see at least 60% participation...

 

[swamt]

Yes free postage. It's coming out of your union dues. Ha, ha.

Hey Man, that's one thing I got no problem with. I am more than willing to supply some support for my fellow mechs at AA to get on board with AMFA.

 

[swamt]

It’s a stalemate alright!
One Association Member (SITO) saving the IAM pension that is high risk and I doubt many IAM members prefer over higher match on 401k.
The other Association Member (Garcia) screwing the AMT’s to protect his Fleet Service Clerk dues payers. Dual Unions fighting over dues money and power at the expense of every Skilled Technician on AA property.

While LAA AMT’s are losing over $2500 per month, and shafted on Holidays and Vacation. And American Airlines struggles to attract new AMT’s. The losses are staggering.

The two jack asses have excluded our local elected representatives from negotiations and demand the AA Management to keep secret the TRUTH of what’s happening.

American Airlines management should see the benefit of their Mechanic and Related employees separating from the Fleet Service Clerks. American Airlines is the last of all Carriers with unskilled workers dominating the future of AMT’s. To have a level playing field in the industry, AA Mechanics must correct this by signing cards and voting to leave the Industrial Unions.

AMT’s should see the benefit of not being at the negotiating table with Fleet Service and realize the profound loss of Dignity and Respect by being called “ground workers”. The AMT profession has been damaged and demeaned by Industrial Unions for years!

I honestly can’t see why we don’t have AMT Leaders of Locals resigning and leading this card drive. Not a damn one of them would sign their name to a statement today claiming these Industrial Unions are in the AMT memberships best interest.

Sign the cards guys!!
Years and Years of negative outcomes is enough!!

Happy Thanksgiving
And Let’s get a Mechanics Union for Christmas

I will say once we went AMFA, we told AMFA that the cleaners (and related) would half to be out of our contract and on their very own contract as well as any other "and related" group. It has worked very well and much, much better that way for the mechanics. I would suggest you guys do the same.

 

[1AA]

Here's the official language:



The only way you risk becoming unrepresented is if a majority (50%+1) of represented employees 1) don't cast a ballot or 2) cast a ballot that says "no union whatsoever".

There's always a chance of having less than 50% turnout, but I can't think of a representation vote in the airlines that didn't see at least 60% participation...

Funny how the language says contract about to expire or expired.
Too bad they never expire they become amenable until a new agreement is in place. A contract theoretically that is a three year agreement can last indefinitely until a new one is drawn up and voted on.

 

[Vortilon]

Here's the official language:



The only way you risk becoming unrepresented is if a majority (50%+1) of represented employees 1) don't cast a ballot or 2) cast a ballot that says "no union whatsoever".

There's always a chance of having less than 50% turnout, but I can't think of a representation vote in the airlines that didn't see at least 60% participation...

Actually, you have to read a little more, you are posting the 30% figure which is the requirement for NLRB covered unions. We are covered under the Railway Labor Act which is enforced by the NMB. The requirement for us under the RLA, is 50% of the membership signing an authorization card.

 

[Vortilon]

What do you expect? A UNION by it's very nature is a socialist/leftist entity. If you don't like idea of socialist distribution of wealth then a UNION is probably not the best fit for you (where your pay is contractually mandated by seniority instead of work ethic, skill level, and efficiency). You really think AMFA will be any different? Perhaps it will for a time but the endgame is always the same.

If the contract is being followed you are not being shafted and you are not losing money. You can't lose what is not contractually yours despite how entitled you feel to receive it.

There is NO benefit to American Airlines. NONE.

Who cares if it is the last carrier? It is also one of the last carriers to maintain such a large maintenance presence in the United States. Should they follow the other airlines regarding maintenance? Obviously most members are not upset enough to demand a change in representation.

Your elitism is showing. Can you explain to be why you are not ground crew? You are certainly not air crew.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groundcrew

Airline ground crew members include: airframe and powerplant, technicians, avionics technicians, ramp agents, customer service agents, and flight dispatchers. Ground crew members are responsible for clearing the runway and gate area of any debris or garbage, in order to prevent foreign object damage by an object being sucked into an engine. The crew visually inspects the tarmac and removes any items found; this is typically called a "FOD walk" and is done prior to an aircraft's arrival and departure.

Look you have your agenda/goals whatever you want to call it and that's great. I say good look to you. However when you start making posts that it insults and demeans you to be associated with "ground workers" frankly I find that conceited. I find it about as palatable as you would find a flight attendant dismissing you as a "dirty grease monkey" and projecting an attitude that you defile the air with your mere presence.

Not sure why you're on an AMFA thread in the first place. AMTs wanting to be in a union that is primarily made up of AMTs or other types of mechanical related positions isn't elitist. It doesn't benefit AMTs in the least, to be tossed in a one size fits all type group like we are now. In fact, the Fleet Service Clerks probably would have a contract now if they were not in the same union as AMTs. Having the Association attempt to reconcile 10 different title groups using two different unions who don't share the same philosophies is proving to be futile.

Losing money? Hell, we have lost money, and a lot of it. What the Association is holding out for - isn't going to happen, we all know it. Been there, done that. You see, retro pay has not even been brought up during negotiations. We haven't had a raise in over three years. You can take your "contractually" assertion, and file that under hypocrisy. Even a passive observer to this process can see the lack of fairness - since the merger being directed towards not just LAA AMTs, but all TWU represented when compared to our LUS counterparts - not their fault. A lot of that - is on Doug Parker lying to everyone. The bulk - can be on the Association reaching too far at our expense. The future Title II headcount fight will be unsuccessful, as will the fight to retain the IAM healthcare. Therefore, it's not a reach to make that assertion about losing money. The membership has not been able to vote on anything since this abomination known as the association was formed.

 

[TWU informer]

La Li Lu Le Lo
I understand your fear and concern!

I honestly don’t have the time to debate or argue with Fleet Service or Association sympathizers or those on Union payroll.

Because this card drive has so much enthusiasm that all of my efforts are going towards getting a NMB ballot to finally have a vote regarding my Union Representation.

After 36 years of paying dues, finally having a vote what those dues buy me matters.

I realize you and others like you are fine with dictatorship leaders and never having a voice. I prefer the Democratic way of doing things.

TWU, IAM, Association are all valid forms of Unionism.

I prefer Democratic Craft Unionism over the “loaf of bread cost the same for everyone, brother” distribution of the available economic pie.

Let’s get the cards and an election, then debates will be happening

 

[title 2]

I will say once we went AMFA, we told AMFA that the cleaners (and related) would half to be out of our contract and on their very own contract as well as any other "and related" group. It has worked very well and much, much better that way for the mechanics. I would suggest you guys do the same.

typical person don't play by the rules change them

 

[TWU informer]

I will say once we went AMFA, we told AMFA that the cleaners (and related) would half to be out of our contract and on their very own contract as well as any other "and related" group. It has worked very well and much, much better that way for the mechanics. I would suggest you guys do the same.

And this post helps us get cards signed how?

We can do without the help of some

 

[title 2]

And this post helps us get cards signed how?

We can do without the help of some

And you wonder why most of title 2 will not sign a card. I have signed a card on every other AMFA drive in the last 30 yrs but I do not know if I should with this attitude from several of the people on this board.