AMFA Drive started in Tulsa ?

[Anomaly]

ROFLMAO

The Anti-AMFA material produced by the TWU throughout 2003 never mentions a "TWU gamble"
In fact, these documents bash AMFA for Maintenance Base closures, job losses, and outsourced work.
My how the TWU rhetoric changes to match the current situation. And you guys claim AMFA makes excuses for failure.

We took 17.5% pay cut
Lost Holidays
Lost Vacation Days
Lost Sick Days and Paid Sick Time
Lost Work Rules

Now we have lost our defined pension, our retirement medical, looking at massive outsourcing, and headcount decimation,
and on track to be last in the industry in pay for 6 more years.

I just paid over $200,000.00 in concessions over the last 8 years and lost everything I was suppose to be paying for?

and now you admit that the TWU was "gambling" with our livelyhood?
Really? So being represented by the TWU is equal to going to the casino every two weeks and losing your ass?

Was the SRP program of 1995 a "gamble" too? What was that worth in pay increase, something like 6.5% over 6 years?

TWU Informer

Despite all the banter you and I have posted on this forum, I have nothing but sympathy for what you are all going through. Our differences aside, if only for a moment, it should be criminal for any corporation to take as much as they have from you, and from us here at UAL.

I sincerely wish the best for you and your fellow mechanics going forward. What ever that road is.

 

[TWU informer]

TWU Informer

Despite all the banter you and I have posted on this forum, I have nothing but sympathy for what you are all going through. Our differences aside, if only for a moment, it should be criminal for any corporation to take as much as they have from you, and from us here at UAL.

I sincerely wish the best for you and your fellow mechanics going forward. What ever that road is.

At AA in 2003 this was a Union decision, not the corporations.

The Union was allowed to decide between headcount cuts or pay/bebefit cuts. TWU claimed to save jobs and maintenance with those pay/benefit cuts.

There was a dollar figure of cuts placed on the table and the TWU decided how to obtain that value.

Then there wer issues with the PIN Numbers for voting because a one time exception to the President Council Bylaws was approved to use telephone balloting, and then the SERP hidden management fund was exposed in an SEC ruling. James C Little claimed the only way to have legitimate agreement was to have a complete re-vote using mailed secret balloting. He then met with some Politiicans (Frost/Hutchinson I think) in Texas, and in exhange for 150 shares of crap stock and an early opener provision that was never used, Little signed off on the agreement "WITHOUT FURTHER RATIFICATION"

Don't blame the Corporation when we all lived the TWU shafting us.

 

[Buster CRC]

And if that's not enough the lastest quote from our local 514 Chairman of maintenance:

"TWU has always pointed out that bankruptcy is not a friendly process for the employees," said John Hewitt, chairman of maintenance for the union. "It's geared toward making hte company come out viable and a lot of times, that's at the sacrifice of the employees."

John your white flag is about worn out.

 

[Realityck]

It took me 9 1/2 years to top out. You are a common liar to say otherwise.


What was your hire-in date and when did you top out. I'll check my old contracts if I can find them and get back to you. I never knew anyone who spent 9 1/2 to top out.

 

[TWU informer]

It took me 9 1/2 years to top out. You are a common liar to say otherwise.


What was your hire-in date and when did you top out. I'll check my old contracts if I can find them and get back to you. I never knew anyone who spent 9 1/2 to top out.

DOH is 1983 and did not top out until contract extension of 1992.

 

[Realityck]

DOH is 1983 and did not top out until contract extension of 1992.

I remember there were pay step jumps in 1985 and 1989, I'm not sure about 1991. It may take me awhile to find my old contract books but I'll get back to you either way.

 

[TWU informer]

DOH is 1983 and did not top out until contract extension of 1992.

I remember there were pay step jumps in 1985 and 1989, I'm not sure about 1991. It may take me awhile to find my old contract books but I'll get back to you either way.

There were indeed pay jumps and bumps, but we are discussing length of time to top out.

Even with the jumps I was not toppped out prior to the 1992 extension.
The jumps were not worth that much because the final step had all the money on it.

9 1/2 years for a 1983 B-Scaler....period

 

[AA89]

As one who has so much seniority, then you mist have voted to approve the multi-pay scales that have dumb down pay in airline maintenance?

Which Licenses do you hold? A&P or A&E?


I voted for the 1983 contract that extended the AMT pay schedule as did 76% of the other voting members. BTW, No AMT spent more than 7.5 years before topping out because they jumped pay steps in subsequent contracts. Also, I have an A&P License.

A question: Were you working here at the time or still in school?

I will absolutely agree with you that management philosophy dictates the fortunes of AMT'S. But as long as AA AMT's are members of the TWU and linked to the other workgroups then we are just a piece of the pie to the TWU


Unless I missed something, the AMT's in the Mechanic & Related Group can have separate Locals if they choose, and we can negotiate separately as we're doing now. We also have our own negotiating committee and can accept or reject our own contract with no interference from other work groups.

I hold an A & P license (1982) and as my screen name alludes to I hired on in 1989. I was not around to approve the B-scale contract and I voted against the OSM program in 1995. That passed due to the promise of job security for the lower seniority guys. I still have that ballot with its urging of a yes vote and the projection that the industry was in a downturn. We know that was BS.

When I hired on it was a 12 year topout I believe (or 10) but as Informer says that was shortened to 5 with the 1992 extension. I topped out in 5 years.
We are one group of many in the twu. I feel we would be better served by a union focused on a skill and not a service job.

 

[Realityck]

There were indeed pay jumps and bumps, but we are discussing length of time to top out.

Even with the jumps I was not toppped out prior to the 1992 extension.
The jumps were not worth that much because the final step had all the money on it.

9 1/2 years for a 1983 B-Scaler....period



OK Period: I found my 1985 contract and there were 4 pay step jumps from 1985 thru 1988. That was in addition to the regular pay step increases.

(- 2 step increase in Sept 7, 1985 - 1 step increase in Sept 1986 - 2 step increase in Sept 1987, and 1 step increase in Sept 1988 ) for a total of a 9 year scale at the max without the pay adjustments of reducing the overall pay scale, from 12 years down to 5. I couldn't find my 1989 contract book but I'll keep looking. However, as I said before, I don't remember any AMT spending more than 7 1/2 years before they topped out, and I know a lot of AMTs. I'm not saying you're misrepresenting the facts as you remember them, but it must be one of those mysteries of aviation I've heard of occasionally.

 

[DNTULSA]

There were indeed pay jumps and bumps, but we are discussing length of time to top out.

Even with the jumps I was not toppped out prior to the 1992 extension.
The jumps were not worth that much because the final step had all the money on it.

9 1/2 years for a 1983 B-Scaler....period



OK Period: I found my 1985 contract and there were 4 pay step jumps from 1985 thru 1988. That was in addition to the regular pay step increases.

(- 2 step increase in Sept 7, 1985 - 1 step increase in Sept 1986 - 2 step increase in Sept 1987, and 1 step increase in Sept 1988 ) for a total of a 9 year scale at the max without the pay adjustments of reducing the overall pay scale, from 12 years down to 5. I couldn't find my 1989 contract book but I'll keep looking. However, as I said before, I don't remember any AMT spending more than 7 1/2 years before they topped out, and I know a lot of AMTs. I'm not saying you're misrepresenting the facts as you remember them, but it must be one of those mysteries of aviation I've heard of occasionally.

Whoever has hired you to post on this board is wasting their money.

It took me 9 1/2 years to top out also.

Just because you can't find it in your contract books, doesn't mean that it isn't true.

 

[Buck]

9.5

 

[TWU informer]

There were indeed pay jumps and bumps, but we are discussing length of time to top out.

Even with the jumps I was not toppped out prior to the 1992 extension.
The jumps were not worth that much because the final step had all the money on it.

9 1/2 years for a 1983 B-Scaler....period



OK Period: I found my 1985 contract and there were 4 pay step jumps from 1985 thru 1988. That was in addition to the regular pay step increases.

(- 2 step increase in Sept 7, 1985 - 1 step increase in Sept 1986 - 2 step increase in Sept 1987, and 1 step increase in Sept 1988 ) for a total of a 9 year scale at the max without the pay adjustments of reducing the overall pay scale, from 12 years down to 5. I couldn't find my 1989 contract book but I'll keep looking. However, as I said before, I don't remember any AMT spending more than 7 1/2 years before they topped out, and I know a lot of AMTs. I'm not saying you're misrepresenting the facts as you remember them, but it must be one of those mysteries of aviation I've heard of occasionally.

You dont remember it being 9 1/2 years because you had your's brother.

It took me 9 1/2 years to top out and I know this because I lived it.

You have actually just proved this because the reduction for 12 1/2 to 5 years is when I toppped out.
Now all that is left is to find your contract extension data from 1992 and then you can add it up for yourself.

Just use your current data, admit the extension of 1992 is what reduced the 12 years to 5 years and then start calculating my pay starting in 1983. The truth is already in what you have posted.

There is no mystery. It is called failed memory or ignorance...your choice.

You show a 9 year max but forget the first six months. That orignal B-scale was 12 1/2 years not 12 because step one was a 6 months employment.

 

[Realityck]

You show a 9 year max but forget the first six months. That orignal B-scale was 12 1/2 years not 12 because step one was a 6 months employment.


The 83 schedule was 24 steps & the "thereafter" rate was the top rate. So even if the scale remained the same length (and it certainly didn't) you would have hit the top rate at 12 years and one day, not 12 and a half years. I will continue to look for my 89 contract book and it may prove you're right, or not. In either case I'll let you know what I find out.

 

[TWU informer]

You show a 9 year max but forget the first six months. That orignal B-scale was 12 1/2 years not 12 because step one was a 6 months employment.


The 83 schedule was 24 steps & the "thereafter" rate was the top rate. So even if the scale remained the same length (and it certainly didn't) you would have hit the top rate at 12 years and one day, not 12 and a half years. I will continue to look for my 89 contract book and it may prove you're right, or not. In either case I'll let you know what I find out.

24 steps at 6 month intervals and first didn't happen until 6 months.
Add it up again.

 

[Frank Szabo]

You show a 9 year max but forget the first six months. That orignal B-scale was 12 1/2 years not 12 because step one was a 6 months employment.


The 83 schedule was 24 steps & the "thereafter" rate was the top rate. So even if the scale remained the same length (and it certainly didn't) you would have hit the top rate at 12 years and one day, not 12 and a half years. I will continue to look for my 89 contract book and it may prove you're right, or not. In either case I'll let you know what I find out.

24 steps at 6 month intervals and first didn't happen until 6 months.
Add it up again.

Much larger fish to fry - we're all topped out now.