AA and Labor Negotiations-2020

[CremaDiLimone]

The AA'er's, as you call yourselves, would have sold the entire place for a few holidays and double time. You so called AA'er's, would have sold out your fellow union brothers and sisters for a few pieces of silver. You AA'er's would have stolen our seniority.

- how could the twu have stolen your seniority? this was a merger, not an acquisition. no one from non-union passenger service laa lost their 'seniority' when they voted in the lus passenger service union. how do you steal seniority?

the time to make things right was 2014 - for all. you guys got a stand-alone contract. in retrospect, the twu and iam should have bitched and moaned to get all on the same deal at the same time.

why would i sell you out for double-time and holidays? in early 2003, i was earning $24+/hr, had 12 paid sick days a year and had 10 paid (work it or not) holidays at double time and a half for laa.

like no one from laa has ever tasted honey before? in early 2003, lus had just finished their 2nd BK in 3 years??

looks like this merger has given you some courage.

the company (laa and laa-lus merged) has been giggling all the way to the bank for nearly 10 years because the majority of it's assoc. employees are still working under a 2011 bk contract.

 

[B777master]

Negotiations will be held next week.

Have you been invited to join them on the 29 thru the close of business day on the 31?
So after all those dates will be needed with the NMB?? Did AMERICAN has not picked up the phone to make that call?? Do you get tired off all the bull? Or you are to remain quiet or else the big boys will have a house painter go visit you, or roadside mechanic give your car a tune up? How can you
Mr. Prez remain so oblivious with all the bull that your higher-ups at the international are pulling?

 

[swamt]

"The TWU-IAM Association today announced that top level TWU/IAM Association leadership will be joining ongoing joint contract negotiations with American Airlines to expedite outstanding economic issues." -January 13, 2017

They're almost done, it's been expedited.

Redundant as Traymark has already answered the question but deserves to be repeated.
Yes this was 2 years ago, and now cleared up, a year AFTER the Exec. Nego's Cmte stole the show from the Pres. and original nego cmte. in order to "speed up nego's to get er done." Yea right. More like to stall out so the IAM members can still enjoy the medical, pension, and other "more" perks than the TWU currently has.

2 years ago if this doesn’t tell you how dysfunctional these guys are nothing does

And this is after the E.N.C. has forced their way in.

Correction- that was Three(3) years ago when the “Executive Level Negotiators” took over.
I’ve never seen such negotiating prowess in my life, we sure are lucky we have the Ass.

Thanks for that Traymark, I was going to ask when the exec cmte was put in place, or, rather, force into place and removing the Pres. I really thought it might have been even longer than 3 years, anyone have that date of announcement handy???

 

[V.O. Reason]

The problem with the fact nothing got done last week again makes you wonder what or who is holding this up.
Remember the words in the update, they hoped those dates would not be needed.
To me since they are needed it means the Ass is holding out for something the company is not willing to change so to me these meetings will be completely fruitless and again I believe we are not talking about a huge monetary difference.
This crap needs a conclusion this week or we are totally screwed ,and yes I’m tired of saying this since in reality we have already been screwed

 

[pjirish317]

- how could the twu have stolen your seniority? this was a merger, not an acquisition. no one from non-union passenger service laa lost their 'seniority' when they voted in the lus passenger service union. how do you steal seniority?
You yourself were on here saying that the LUS folks hit the lottery with regards to seniority and this merger. If I remember correctly it was the #5 carrier (LUS) at the time that facilitated the "merger" with AA. So to use your own words, it looks like you hit the lottery with this merger.
the time to make things right was 2014 - for all. you guys got a stand-alone contract. in retrospect, the twu and iam should have bitched and moaned to get all on the same deal at the same time.
Actually the TWU should have advocated for it's members to get the "same" deal. Didn't the TWU just finish the BK negotiations and ratification process?
why would i sell you out for double-time and holidays? in early 2003, i was earning $24+/hr, had 12 paid sick days a year and had 10 paid (work it or not) holidays at double time and a half for laa.
And where did that go? What happened after early 2003?
like no one from laa has ever tasted honey before? in early 2003, lus had just finished their 2nd BK in 3 years??
And you have been in a BK agreement since this merger. What is the difference?
looks like this merger has given you some courage.
And your point here is what?
the company (laa and laa-lus merged) has been giggling all the way to the bank for nearly 10 years because the majority of it's assoc. employees are still working under a 2011 bk contract.

 

[swamt]

Buck, Having any mechanic forced into the IAMPF just shows us that the TWU has rolled over again. That information should spread like wild fire in Tulsa.
Using the new hires to bolster the IAMPF is just WRONG. The TWU sold the new hires down the river with the $9.13 wage increase we got in 2018. Forcing them to spend almost a decade to reach top of the pay scale. I hope that they sign AMFA cards and tell the mechanics both title 1 & 2 how the Association is punking the membership AGAIN..

So maybe this is one of the reasons behind the 400 or so new hires in Tulsa? The pension, the medical and of course we all know they want yes votes on the first offer out of the gates, right?? I too hope the new hires are smart enough to ask and investigate what the history is at AA since the forced merger, no representational vote, and soon other items forced upon them by this asso. Wake up new hires and ask questions. Just because you are new hires should not stop you from looking out for your futures.

How exactly did the IAM steal the AA'er's right to vote? The IAM looked out it's members and the TWU did not. It is as simple as that. Hate the IAM all you want, but they did their job as a union and protected it's members. You wanna talk respect? The AA'er's, as you call yourselves, would have sold the entire place for a few holidays and double time. You so called AA'er's, would have sold out your fellow union brothers and sisters for a few pieces of silver. You AA'er's would have stolen our seniority. Entitled much? Get over yourself. Tell me, what's the move with AMFA regarding seniority? Are the former TWU people going to try and screw over the former IAM people with a new union? Is that the goal? Please enlighten us as to how you will let the IAM drown? And to all the former AA'er's that do not feel the same as lax here, my sincerest apologies if I offended. We are all in this together, regardless of where we started. Can we for once show this company how strong we can actually be?

No offence but remember when the TWU'ers were calling on you IAM'ers for support and unity for some info picketing and other forms of support? I am in no way for any kind of division, but think about this. And YES, this asso caused all the division within the ranks NOT the members themselves. To ask for support now and how strong you could look is a bit hypocritical now don't ya think?
What should have happened from the very get go is, a vote between the TWU and IAM-period. Now although too late for that, these two unions should have gotten together and brought in the best of eaches contracts and settled for nothing less. As far as the cat seniority, fences to protect the current then go with one of the two's way of doing that. The combination of these two unions was the absolute dumbest idea ever. Too many differences. Too much infighting (still going on) and to switch who is in control every 2-3 years is just ridiculous.
Again, not at all for division, but unfortunately, this asso caused it all, and with the IAM being the biggest controller I do blame them, but not the members themselves. Matter fact I don't blame the members for wanting to keep the better of the two, that is only natural. This freakin pathetic asso. should have NEVER came to fruition, period...

 

[Talos]

The problem with the fact nothing got done last week again makes you wonder what or who is holding this up.
Remember the words in the update, they hoped those dates would not be needed.
To me since they are needed it means the Ass is holding out for something the company is not willing to change so to me these meetings will be completely fruitless and again I believe we are not talking about a huge monetary difference.
This crap needs a conclusion this week or we are totally screwed ,and yes I’m tired of saying this since in reality we have already been screwed

Who knows what the holdup is? Could be the IAM holding out for a reason, and who could blame them if it benefits them. Could be the unimpressive mgmt who treats employees as adversaries. One thing for sure the TWU will not man up and communicate the truth to their members. Their silence speaks volumes. It's an embarrassment to be associated with them as an international rep and Samuelson and Garcia are an embarrassment. It's like our own union has sold us down the river. Bad thing is, as time goes on the more disgusted you get.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

you're exactly right, i did say you won the lottery - and you act like it....lus was today's delta in the 80s-90s-00s?? sure it was.

you were the one trying to hide the fact that lus in the non-hubs were at $20/hr? there were lus in my station that told us all that.

the point is, laa feels that lus has benefited more from this merger. i remember the weez telling me we all benefited - i didn't get angry at him, i knew people he felt important told him to stop that divisive talk. as it turns out, the divisiveness is twu vs. twu, as the AMTs are pushing to break away.

i believe that your positions of the twu stealing your seniority or twu members will sell out the iam for holidays and 2 1/2 pay are ridiculous.

i did agree with you on your seniority beef..PT at lus only counted for 1/2 time for awhile. the iam has done an excellent job, if they would have worked that for you, they would have done a phenomenal job.

i don't know what to expect from the twu??? the iam has come here and spoke directly to you; they are looking out for you.

 

[dfw gen]

Who knows what the holdup is? Could be the IAM holding out for a reason, and who could blame them if it benefits them. Could be the unimpressive mgmt who treats employees as adversaries. One thing for sure the TWU will not man up and communicate the truth to their members. Their silence speaks volumes. It's an embarrassment to be associated with them as an international rep and Samuelson and Garcia are an embarrassment. It's like our own union has sold us down the river. Bad thing is, as time goes on the more disgusted you get.

That is why i have dedicated my efforts to dump the association. Other card drives i signed a card and sat down. This time i have been instrumental in getting two class two stations signed at 98%. Its clear the association is divided the twu amd the iam dont like each other. Its a marriage of tolerance. Time for change the dont listen to the membership, they really dont care what our opinions are and what we want. I have pleaded for information to be put out to the membership, the membership has begged for information and still they refuse.
Its to the point the twu has screwed their membership and taken us for granted for so long i dont think it matters what they say we just dont beleive them.
No the association has had their chance to prove their value to the membership. They have failed to do that and they continue to insist on failing the membership. Time for change way past time.

NO VOTE NO PEACE.

 

[V.O. Reason]

Well I’ve been with IAM over these past many years and into this merger and the only benefits I’ve seen was the lower cost of my insurance.
Other than that I’m still in the looser IMPF, with a 401K match on the table, missing holidays, pay raises.
All of this because I do believe the IAM is calling the shots and holding back this agreement.
So don’t tell me their working for me or helping at all

 

[ALUS78]

+1

And let’s call it like it is: anyone advocating for the IAMNPF is stealing your future(s).

Stop do you really think they are going to force current TWU members into the IAMPF ?I thought we already crossed that bridge with a not happening

 

[dfw gen]

If a few more stepped up where and when needed this would be done by june

 

[ALUS78]

Many share your opinion about the IAM holding things up. The IAM guy came on here and basically said they are watching out for their members. Meanwhile, the TWU guys are sitting around playing with their members. You can take that pun anyway you want. Not a peep out of the TWU top guys since Samuelson melted down. What sorry asses to betray the membership and sit around and do nothing on our dime.

You really think the IAM is holding things up? Its very possible you could be wrong and lets say they are, shouldnt the TWU do the same if the shoe were on the other foot.I would think its a unions job to do the best for their members. I get mad when the union gets a deservingly fired dirt bag their job back.But thats what unions do

 

[ALUS78]

I would agree. Tim looks like a fool now by criticizing Billy. Tim was 0-2 this past week. Obviously there are some open items as Billy had mentioned.

I thought he looked like a fool before but...go ahead

 

[ALUS78]

I have spoken to a few new hire mechanics at Tulsa and they are learning about the IAMNPF.
Not only are they against the union lying to them concerning the pension, but being forced into that fund will have its consequences.

Are you willing to vote no on any contract no matter how lucrative for you to keep new hires out of the pension plan??