2015 Fleet Service thread

[Worldport]

Seem like every one enjoys sword fighting just to prove he's more right than the other one!

No I sense an actual dislike for one another

 

[WeAAsles]

He doesn't need my help. How 'bout we all get back to discussing the issues facing us?

Tim is an issue because he attempts to influence things facing my class and craft. He even makes videos in his attempts to steer directions so I feel it's completely fine to challenge his credibility as we are both AA Fleet Service Clerks.

And I asked you a question a few hours ago that again you didn't answer Kev?

Do you support Tim in his obvious endeavor to stop an organizing drive in our industry for other airlines?

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim is an issue because he attempts to influence things facing my class and craft. He even makes videos in his attempts to steer directions so I feel it's completely fine to challenge his credibility as we are both AA Fleet Service Clerks.

And I asked you a question a few hours ago that again you didn't answer Kev?

Do you support Tim in his obvious endeavor to stop an organizing drive in our industry for other airlines?

 
Let me define my point which you quote mine.
 
Leave JetBlue because it will be a loser due to the big elephant in the room.  Redirect the monies to Delta ramp since that campaign would have the greatest potential for success.  Don't ever fall in love with the % of current cards signed as that is NO INDICATOR of success.  The IAM hasn't learned that again.
 
I know JetBlue is the organizing creation of Tommy Reagon but Tommy is better served sticking with negotiations. He was a complete hatchet job at Delta and JetBlue and I suspect that Hannah will also stumble.  I had to get Klinakas completely out of the situation at AirTran, he was killing us. And I had to make sure that few AGC's got involved in organizing.  AGC's killed the Delta campaign for 143.  You can't have paid staffers who are just putting in 9-5 and filling out reports.  The INTL seems to reverted to its old organizing campaign strategies with paid staffers. These guys don't speak the ramp language and their communications are always outdated, as a result. No relationships. No nothing.
 
Weasle, you think it is cool to blow money on JetBlue, fine, but there is NOTHING to support an exit strategy over there.  OTOH, there are comparables and an exit strategy at Delta which shows a return on investment as well.
 
regards,
 

 

[700UW]

I've also heard Tim has ambitions to restart the ILGWU? He just loves them dames.
He's heading to Houston now with that credit card of his.

Don't forget the gift cards too

 

[Worldport]

 
Let me define my point which you quote mine.
 
Leave JetBlue because it will be a loser due to the big elephant in the room.  Redirect the monies to Delta ramp since that campaign would have the greatest potential for success.  Don't ever fall in love with the % of current cards signed as that is NO INDICATOR of success.  The IAM hasn't learned that again.
 
I know JetBlue is the organizing creation of Tommy Reagon but Tommy is better served sticking with negotiations. He was a complete hatchet job at Delta and JetBlue and I suspect that Hannah will also stumble.  I had to get Klinakas completely out of the situation at AirTran, he was killing us. And I had to make sure that few AGC's got involved in organizing.  AGC's killed the Delta campaign for 143.  You can't have paid staffers who are just putting in 9-5 and filling out reports.  The INTL seems to reverted to its old organizing campaign strategies with paid staffers. These guys don't speak the ramp language and their communications are always outdated, as a result. No relationships. No nothing.
 
Weasle, you think it is cool to blow money on JetBlue, fine, but there is NOTHING to support an exit strategy over there.  OTOH, there are comparables and an exit strategy at Delta which shows a return on investment as well.
 
regards,
 

This is between you two . But since it is MY dues money used for organizing. Tim does DL's employees  history of not wanting a union play any part in deciding whether to try and organize?I work in the same building and I'm on the same bus and I would say 95% are a happy bunch. Who do you think needs a union more DL orJetblue?I say Jetblue

 

[WeAAsles]

Let me define my point which you quote mine.
 
Leave JetBlue because it will be a loser due to the big elephant in the room.  Redirect the monies to Delta ramp since that campaign would have the greatest potential for success.  Don't ever fall in love with the % of current cards signed as that is NO INDICATOR of success.  The IAM hasn't learned that again.
 
I know JetBlue is the organizing creation of Tommy Reagon but Tommy is better served sticking with negotiations. He was a complete hatchet job at Delta and JetBlue and I suspect that Hannah will also stumble.  I had to get Klinakas completely out of the situation at AirTran, he was killing us. And I had to make sure that few AGC's got involved in organizing.  AGC's killed the Delta campaign for 143.  You can't have paid staffers who are just putting in 9-5 and filling out reports.  The INTL seems to reverted to its old organizing campaign strategies with paid staffers. These guys don't speak the ramp language and their communications are always outdated, as a result. No relationships. No nothing.
 
Weasle, you think it is cool to blow money on JetBlue, fine, but there is NOTHING to support an exit strategy over there.  OTOH, there are comparables and an exit strategy at Delta which shows a return on investment as well.
 
regards,

Don't try to change what you said now to curry favor with your obvious supporter Kev. You didn't specify any move towards the ramp and you went on that NO WAY page for the Delta FA's and stated you would do anything to help them keep the IAM out.

Again although Kev doesn't seem to answer questions these days anymore, I'd like to know what his opinions are about what you have been doing?

Kev will you be courteous enough to provide a response?

 

[Tim Nelson]

Don't try to change what you said now to curry favor with your obvious supporter Kev. You didn't specify any move towards the ramp and you went on that NO WAY page for the Delta FA's and stated you would do anything to help them keep the IAM out.

Again although Kev doesn't seem to answer questions these days anymore, I'd like to know what his opinions are about what you have been doing?

Kev will you be courteous enough to provide a response?

 
I don't think the stews are in danger of being contracted out.  Apples and oranges.
 
The Delta ramp is going to get eaten alive after we sign our contract.  I disagree with your position that we should continue pissing money away at JetBlue.  And I would go further and say that I wouldn't want to personally be responsible for JetBlue management contracting out the entire JetBlue ramp because it wouldn't want to deal with a union.  Messing with people's lives, career and families is not a tasty thing.
 
regards,
 

 

[WeAAsles]

I don't think the stews are in danger of being contracted out.  Apples and oranges.
 
The Delta ramp is going to get eaten alive after we sign our contract.  I disagree with your position that we should continue pissing money away at JetBlue.  And I would go further and say that I wouldn't want to personally be responsible for JetBlue management contracting out the entire JetBlue ramp because it wouldn't want to deal with a union.  Messing with people's lives, career and families is not a tasty thing.
 
regards,

I'm sorry Sir but I was not looking to address you or do I have any interests in your opinions. Unless you have reading comprehension issues I think I've been pretty clear on what I think of you and what you do.

But I have directed a particular question at Kev that I'm hoping will eventually be answered?

 

[Tim Nelson]

This is between you two . But since it is MY dues money used for organizing. Tim does DL's employees  history of not wanting a union play any part in deciding weather to try and organize?I work in the same building and I'm on the same bus and I would say 95% are a happy bunch. Who do you think needs a union more DL orJetblue?I say Jetblue

 
In organizing, it is never a question of who needs a union more today.  Organizing plans inherently deal with the future, so the question becomes who will need one more, JetBlue or Delta?  And what future events provide risk that can +/- a campaign?
 
In assessing JetBlue, I'd say that the risk of them being outsourced, after a presumed organizing victory, is substantial enough to create a negative outcome that does more harm than good.  This is what the TWU failed to consider at Frontier. And the IAM failed to consider at Spirit.  So, imo, the chance of JetBlue being organized is slim, since I, nor any of you could refute the elephant in the room, i.e., why wont management just contract them all out after a successful organizing drive?  The comparables can not be discounted.
 
OTOH,  Although I may agree that Delta may be fat and happy today, I think when we measure an event horizon, we can't help but conclude that Delta management will most likely start contracting out DL rampers after the signing of the American Airline contract.  I think it is reasonable to conclude that Delta's profit sharing move was precipitated on Parker's guarantee of Delta +7%.    It was a wise move by management at Delta to whack half of the profit sharing and instead load it up in Delta wages, knowing that United and American would match.  But, unlike American and United,  Delta can pull the rug out from underneath its non contract employees without notice. The future event I see regarding Delta ramp is great pain in most stations but the wipeout won't come until after American locks in their rampers at $30 buck an hour.   Am I right?  Who knows, but you have to consider character traits and I seriously doubt Kev will still be working in a small station, soon after American signs their ramp contract.  So, the fish will go from "Fat and Happy"  to "Fish on".   Gotta be out in the boat and move with the fish, never know when they will bite, but you certainly can make reasonable predictions.  Being on shore when the bite would be happening is not a good option.
 
regards,
 

 

[Tim Nelson]

I'm sorry Sir but I was not looking to address you or do I have any interests in your opinions. Unless you have reading comprehension issues I think I've been pretty clear on what I think of you and what you do.

But I have directed a particular question at Kev that I'm hoping will eventually be answered?

 
The problem is that when you ask questions, you often speak for others that you quote mine. I have learned that you mostly speak out of.....
 
So, I'll check you whenever I please.
 
Now, carry on
 
regards,
 

 

[WeAAsles]

The problem is that when you ask questions, you often speak for others that you quote mine. I have learned that you mostly speak out of.....
 
So, I'll check you whenever I please.
 
Now, carry on
 
regards,

And hence the beauty of this open forum. I can check you as well and not have to worry about you booting me from a social media page under your control, which you do have a penchant for when your particular narrative is not supported.

Now, you carry on.

 

[Worldport]

 
In organizing, it is never a question of who needs a union more today.  Organizing plans inherently deal with the future, so the question becomes who will need one more, JetBlue or Delta?  And what future events provide risk that can +/- a campaign?
 
In assessing JetBlue, I'd say that the risk of them being outsourced, after a presumed organizing victory, is substantial enough to create a negative outcome that does more harm than good.  This is what the TWU failed to consider at Frontier. And the IAM failed to consider at Spirit.  So, imo, the chance of JetBlue being organized is slim, since I, nor any of you could refute the elephant in the room, i.e., why wont management just contract them all out after a successful organizing drive?  The comparables can not be discounted.
 
OTOH,  Although I may agree that Delta may be fat and happy today, I think when we measure an event horizon, we can't help but conclude that Delta management will most likely start contracting out DL rampers after the signing of the American Airline contract.  I think it is reasonable to conclude that Delta's profit sharing move was precipitated on Parker's guarantee of Delta +7%.    It was a wise move by management at Delta to whack half of the profit sharing and instead load it up in Delta wages, knowing that United and American would match.  But, unlike American and United,  Delta can pull the rug out from underneath its non contract employees without notice. The future event I see regarding Delta ramp is great pain in most stations but the wipeout won't come until after American locks in their rampers at $30 buck an hour.   Am I right?  Who knows, but you have to consider character traits and I seriously doubt Kev will still be working in a small station, soon after American signs their ramp contract.  So, the fish will go from "Fat and Happy"  to "Fish on".   Gotta be out in the boat and move with the fish, never know when they will bite, but you certainly can make reasonable predictions.  Being on shore when the bite would be happening is not a good option.
 
regards,
 

Hate to say it Tim but all the years out there I didn't think you had a conscience  that's why I'm a little skeptical of you actually caring for the jetblue employees. I really think you are taking the DL contracting out of left field You are entitled to your opinion but I don't see it

 

[WeAAsles]

Hate to say it Tim but all the years out there I didn't think you had a conscience  that's why I'm a little skeptical of you actually caring for the jetblue employees. I really think you are taking the DL contracting out of left field You are entitled to your opinion but I don't see it

Neither do I. But propagating fear for some people is how they get their particular kicks.

 

[700UW]

What be doesn't get is DL Rampers are NOTsjgning cards, where as JetBlue Rampers are signing cards.

 

[JFK Fleet Service]

Agreed and LUS has enclosed buckets LAA does not

At LGA thats true.Over here we have a dozen or so Elephants,plus the open buckets.