2014 Pilot Discussion

[luvthe9]

I get the sarcasm.  Are you totally oblivious (or something else) to the fact that: THIS IS NOT SECTION 6 NEGOTIATIONS?  Parker can say "Take it or leave it" with impunity because he knows either way, he wins.
 
Our only options here is to whether he wins big, or simply wins.

No kidding. He won before this even started.

 

[A320 Driver]

You can always return the money if it is that difficult for you... Where are your principals man???

 

[luvthe9]

You can always return the money if it is that difficult for you... Where are your principals man???

I already have returned them enough money.

 

[nycbusdriver]

What ever the company chooses to give us is the best we can do, no one here has the will to fight for a Delta contract, the money is great and everybody only thinks of themselves so this will have no problem passing.

 
Yes.  I will have sleepless nights knowing I have left my A330 F/O's with $30/hour more than I made through the USAPA years as a A330 captain.
 
We really need to fight management on this with every tool at our disposal, i.e. NONE, and force them to give us less.  We will show them them, won't we!  Just like the flight attendant NO voters.

 

[Schultz]

4.) Short Call Report Time – The Company proposes changing the “reasonably available” language to the “available promptly” which is the same language as in the Delta contract


Does anyone know what "available promptly" means?

 

[luvthe9]

Yes.  I will have sleepless nights knowing I have left my A330 F/O's with $30/hour more than I made through the USAPA years as a A330 captain.
 
We really need to fight management on this with every tool at our disposal, i.e. NONE, and force them to give us less.  We will show them them, won't we!  Just like the flight attendant NO voters.

You worry to much, this deal was settled already we are going to get a nice raise, be patient, no more fighting, "A mans got to know his limitations" Harry Callahan.

 

[end_of_alpa]

4.) Short Call Report Time – The Company proposes changing the “reasonably available” language to the “available promptly” which is the same language as in the Delta contract


Does anyone know what "available promptly" means?

It means "promptly available".  

 

[luvthe9]

4.) Short Call Report Time – The Company proposes changing the “reasonably available” language to the “available promptly” which is the same language as in the Delta contractDoes anyone know what "available promptly" means?

Don't worry about that, they will explain that to you after this is voted in.

 

[nycbusdriver]

4.) Short Call Report Time – The Company proposes changing the “reasonably available” language to the “available promptly” which is the same language as in the Delta contract


Does anyone know what "available promptly" means?

 
The idea is that it is not a "report time." as the company previously proposed.
 


prompt
 


[prompt] Spell Syllables

• Synonyms
• Examples
• Word Origin

adjective, prompter, promptest.1.
done, performed, delivered, etc., at once or without delay:
a prompt reply.


2.
ready in action; quick to act as occasion demands.

3.
quick or alert:
prompt to take offense.


4.
punctual.

 

[EastUS1]

Don't worry about that, they will explain that to you after this is voted in.

 
Indeed, and if you don't like management's "interpretation"? = No problem. Just file yet another of the literally hundreds of grievances that already sound out as loudly trumpeted testimony to their "good faith" and "trustworthiness"....
 
Concise language, absolute specifics, even at all reasonably unquestionable and even remotely comprehensible and specific contract language?....Nonsense!...Who ever needs such "trivial" details to be pre-determined anyway? Cue Nancy Pelosi: "We have to pass it to find out what's in it." Just trust them and all will no doubt be well....after all; hasn't that always proved to be the case?
 
"The Company proposes changing the “reasonably available” language to the “available promptly” which is the same language as in the Delta contract."...? This is NOT Delta's management we're dealing with, and not by even the longest of shots. When's the last time anyone saw Delta's president "proudly" presenting himself to the whole world in a purple wig and a tutu? If these "fine people" even approached Delta's management...well, we wouldn't even be having this conversation, nor any need for it, now would we?
 
The likes of this is the "character"-driven and highly "trustworthy"...umm..."management" you're dealing with people. Would any of you even honestly want to see your children/grandchildren left unsupervised and alone in room with them? Get a clue:
 
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVgjcyH4Ghk
 
Sigh!....Good luck to all those with many years yet to go. If it comes to a vote; all must properly do as they see best.

 

[EastUS1]

 
Indeed, and if you don't like management's "interpretation"? = No problem. Just file yet another of the literally hundreds of grievances that already sound out as loudly trumpeted testimony to their "good faith" and "trustworthiness"....
 
Concise language, absolute specifics, even at all reasonably unquestionable and even remotely comprehensible and specific contract language?....Nonsense!...Who ever needs such "trivial" details to be pre-determined anyway? Cue Nancy Pelosi: "We have to pass it to find out what's in it." Just trust them and all will no doubt be well....after all; hasn't that always proved to be the case?
 
"The Company proposes changing the “reasonably available” language to the “available promptly” which is the same language as in the Delta contract."...? This is NOT Delta's management we're dealing with, and not by even the longest of shots. When's the last time anyone saw Delta's president "proudly" presenting himself to the whole world in a purple wig and a tutu? If these "fine people" even approached Delta's management...well, we wouldn't even be having this conversation, nor any need for it, now would we?
 
The likes of this is the "character"-driven and highly "trustworthy"...umm..."management" you're dealing with people. Would any of you even honestly want to see your children/grandchildren left unsupervised and alone in room with them? Get a clue:
 
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVgjcyH4Ghk
 
Sigh!....Good luck to all those with many years yet to go. If it comes to a vote; all must properly do as they see best.

 
 
I see that already garnered a "minus vote". Might someone, especially the "voter," kindly explain to us all why? I don't personally have any grand stake in whatever happens with this. I've little time left in the industry, and a few nickels is just a few nickels to me, one way or the other, but I'm all ears to hear why mindless support and "trust" of this particular management seems at all appropriate for anyone concerned?...?
 
If it comes to a vote; I'd suggest that all do their best homework and subsequent thinking on what the actual and specific contractual details are, and only then decide. That's all.
 
If there's even the slightest "crack" in the verbiage...expect serpents to immediately slither through it at full speed....Just sayin'....

 

[Phoenix]

 
Parker owes us NOTHING except the cost neutral arbitration we all signed on to. 
 
Bottom line: The company proposal on the table is substantially better than a cost neutral arbitration.  Are we going to walk away from that in a stupid attempt to "show Parker" how tough we are?  Like the flight attendants?  Great idea.

 
 
Parker needs 7 items he can't get in arbitration.  He must buy them from us.  They are all industry standard concessions, and he can afford to pay at least Min Calendar Day (just one of our requests for all seven of his).  
 
P.S. The FAs went to arbitration and Parker has given them TWO PAYRAISES since then!  Maybe we need to go to arbitration so we can hurry up our next two pay raises.

 

[Phoenix]

No kidding. He won before this even started.

 
 
How many captain positions go away with HBT and INT/DOM?  How many wide body pilots go away?  How much of a pay cut is that to guys junior to those positions?  We don't know, but we do know the company does.. and they want us to do public math but with their variables that only they control.  Have to pass it to see whats in it!!
 
They want industry standard concessions that they must buy... Why should we sell out for less than at least a few industry standard items in return?  What are we gonna trade next time?  Scope will be all that is left, and they have said they are interested... Lets get a bigger pay raise now.  Put scope back on the table!!!!!
 
What is the time value of concessions?

 

[Phoenix]

 
Indeed, and if you don't like management's "interpretation"? = No problem. Just file yet another of the literally hundreds of grievances that already sound out as loudly trumpeted testimony to their "good faith" and "trustworthiness"....
 
Concise language, absolute specifics, even at all reasonably unquestionable and even remotely comprehensible and specific contract language?....Nonsense!...Who ever needs such "trivial" details to be pre-determined anyway? Cue Nancy Pelosi: "We have to pass it to find out what's in it." Just trust them and all will no doubt be well....after all; hasn't that always proved to be the case?
 
"The Company proposes changing the “reasonably available” language to the “available promptly” which is the same language as in the Delta contract."...? This is NOT Delta's management we're dealing with, and not by even the longest of shots. When's the last time anyone saw Delta's president "proudly" presenting himself to the whole world in a purple wig and a tutu? If these "fine people" even approached Delta's management...well, we wouldn't even be having this conversation, nor any need for it, now would we?
 
The likes of this is the "character"-driven and highly "trustworthy"...umm..."management" you're dealing with people. Would any of you even honestly want to see your children/grandchildren left unsupervised and alone in room with them? Get a clue:
 
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVgjcyH4Ghk
 
Sigh!....Good luck to all those with many years yet to go. If it comes to a vote; all must properly do as they see best.

 
How come pilots read a letter written by someone dressed in purple tutu .  ... and get all queasy in the knees...   Seriously, why are negotiations difficult?  They must buy what they want, and we must set a price for it.   Seven Industry standard concessions for just one or two industry standard contract improvements (or simple contract preservation if we are talking calendar day and the West).  
 
You guys gonna sell cheap to a purple tutu?  :LOL:

 

[EastUS1]

 
How come pilots read a letter written by someone dressed in purple tutu .  ... and get all queasy in the knees... 

 
 
Especially considering the purple tutu in question was/forever is a failed "washout" from USAF Pilot Training, and really; what better "credentials" could ever be established by anyone for later becoming president of the world's largest airline?...Well, disregard that. I'd overlooked the amazing ability to proudly and smartly sport a purple wig and "shake your booty". My bad. Where's my "sensitivity" to "artistic expression"?
 
I now feel the need to take a reflective "Gangnam Style" moment to properly meditate on my misguided misgivings and renew my heartfelt "respect" and "trust" for such fine "leaders" and people. I mean really: Who wouldn't follow such as these into "battle" anywhere, anytime?
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Wp-xumQCew
 
 
 
Anyone who actually trusts such people need their heads examined yesterday....Period.