2014 Pilot Discussion

[EastCheats]

Airbus fleet or Boeing fleet?

Adjective

 

[Phoenix]

 

[Phoenix]

 

[Claxon]

Adjective

Elusive response.

 

[end_of_alpa]

 
 
What is wrong with the union is that we are a bunch of spoiled selfish, individual brats all trying to get their own way, exploiting each other's fears and selfish motives, and then attacking the BPR and the BOD during negotiations.   You know who I am talking about.  Unelected manipulators that couldn't sit still and let the BPR do their work and fight it out in closed session, but chose instead to fan the flames of fear and uncertainty and cause mutiny to overthrow the work of the BPR.  They bragged about it publicly.    

It isn't a problem that we are all selfish, individual brats... that is why we have a BPR, BOD, and negotiating committee.  We are supposed to set aside our individual selfishness long enough to allow the BPR, BOD, negotiating committee to do their job and negotiate our collective best interests.  It is easier for the company to divide and conquer 15,000 individual brats than it is to divide and conquer a small board of representatives that have a higher calling than just their own selfish interests (even as imperfect as they may be).  That is why the company always negotiates directly with the pilot group in crew news, town halls, and the media, attempting to neuter the BOD and cause mutiny in the membership for a direct vote.
 
Pilots don't like uncertainty. They don't want to feel they are out of control.  They want to fix things.  Too many of them are shitty managers and succumb to the temptation to micromanage everything the BPR and negotiating committee do.
 
I am afraid pilots will never perfect letting the BOD do their job unmolested.  Its not in the pilots DNA to let go of their own selfishness during the sausage making process.      

1. I can speak for me only that I don't trust them.
2. It is why I absolutely DEPLORE closed meetings to pilots.  It should be outlawed.
3. I understand the NEED for closed meetings because there are some pilots that will take that information and use it against us.
4. Go back to number one.
 
Free speech has always been a hallmark of America.  The problem is using free speech with FALSE FACTS and lies.  
 
Ferguson,MO is one of many.  So is the West lies and false belief in "seniority" and entitlement.  Of course that "seniority" works in reverse for pilots that have had everything for so long on the backs of the majority of workers who can do the same job.  Unions and unity are on their way out.  Deal with it.  
 
The APA is unprepared for the stress fractures East and West bring with it and when the West doesn't get their way you will see such a ruckus it will make any prior job actions pale in comparison.
 
I personally look forward to the a$$ kicking AAL will be giving to the other big three with four more years of lower labor costs to competitively make them drive their employees salaries DOWN as a result. I think Delta pilots should make $1,000,000 per year just to make the point how well the pilots and their management get along.  It will just hasten the competitive demise of the pricks who needed US Airways to go away just so ALPA could offer (some of) us jobs.
 
As far as the "unelected" manipulators, of which I am GLADLY one of them I simply point out reality in "Realville".  You will NEVER get the West to march in lockstep.  NEVER.  They are unified in their righteous cause as you well know.  Three losses in federal court, no seat at the SLI table (as of now), millions of dollars in lawyers fees and they think even the APA supports their cause.
 
Jihad is coming from them and none of us will like it.  It could very well strike at the very heart of the RLA and unionism.  That is the reason MB came about and that is where this battle will ultimately finish...in Congress.
 
BTW, you can spare me the "smarter than you" and "higher calling" of the APA BOD who tried to STAB USAPA in the back (and still is with seniority arbitration, you thought they would have learned with the TWA pilots) and the MOU II which we are locked into until at least 2019 and beyond.
 
I'm now calling it LOA93.1

 

[Metroyet]

1. I can speak for me only that I don't trust them.
2. It is why I absolutely DEPLORE closed meetings to pilots.  It should be outlawed.
3. I understand the NEED for closed meetings because there are some pilots that will take that information and use it against us.
4. Go back to number one.
 
Free speech has always been a hallmark of America.  The problem is using free speech with FALSE FACTS and lies.  
 
Ferguson,MO is one of many.  So is the West lies and false belief in "seniority" and entitlement.  Of course that "seniority" works in reverse for pilots that have had everything for so long on the backs of the majority of workers who can do the same job.  Unions and unity are on their way out.  Deal with it.  
 
The APA is unprepared for the stress fractures East and West bring with it and when the West doesn't get their way you will see such a ruckus it will make any prior job actions pale in comparison.
 
I personally look forward to the a$$ kicking AAL will be giving to the other big three with four more years of lower labor costs to competitively make them drive their employees salaries DOWN as a result. I think Delta pilots should make $1,000,000 per year just to make the point how well the pilots and their management get along.  It will just hasten the competitive demise of the pricks who needed US Airways to go away just so ALPA could offer (some of) us jobs.
 
As far as the "unelected" manipulators, of which I am GLADLY one of them I simply point out reality in "Realville".  You will NEVER get the West to march in lockstep.  NEVER.  They are unified in their righteous cause as you well know.  Three losses in federal court, no seat at the SLI table (as of now), millions of dollars in lawyers fees and they think even the APA supports their cause.
 
Jihad is coming from them and none of us will like it.  It could very well strike at the very heart of the RLA and unionism.  That is the reason MB came about and that is where this battle will ultimately finish...in Congress.
 
BTW, you can spare me the "smarter than you" and "higher calling" of the APA BOD who tried to STAB USAPA in the back (and still is with seniority arbitration, you thought they would have learned with the TWA pilots) and the MOU II which we are locked into until at least 2019 and beyond.
 
I'm now calling it LOA93.1

And yet another daily dose of hypocrisy from the resident King Hypocrit. JJ you have done more to destroy unionism than nearly any other unionized employee than I can think of. You helped formed a fake Union to deny its own members fair representation and fair process. It's all there outlined in the pre-arb briefs. You think the West is going to melt down? Hasn't happened yet despite all effort from your side. I'd be very worried about SLI if I were you.

THAT will be a melt down. Luckily the ball has been stripped from the lunatics and handed over to the adults. The USAPA hens are coming home to roost. Look at the bright side...you're not one of the "national officers" of your fake Union. Those poor SOB's will be fighting lawsuits until they're either personally bankrupt or dead. Count on it. AOL will never let them be. Ever.

 

[nevergiveup]

And yet another daily dose of hypocrisy from the resident King Hypocrit. JJ you have done more to destroy unionism than nearly any other unionized employee than I can think of. You helped formed a fake Union to deny its own members fair representation and fair process. It's all there outlined in the pre-arb briefs. You think the West is going to melt down? Hasn't happened yet despite all effort from your side. I'd be very worried about SLI if I were you.

THAT will be a melt down. Luckily the ball has been stripped from the lunatics and handed over to the adults. The USAPA hens are coming home to roost. Look at the bright side...you're not one of the "national officers" of your fake Union. Those poor SOB's will be fighting lawsuits until they're either personally bankrupt or dead. Count on it. AOL will never let them be. Ever.

Can one sue a fake union? 

 

[luvthe9]

I'd be very worried about SLI if I were you.

Those poor SOB's will be fighting lawsuits until they're either personally bankrupt or dead. Count on it. AOL will never let them be. Ever.

No one worried at all about the SLI, stop being so dramatic it's over for you, but feel free to keep buying ties if it makes you feel better. You kids owe Marty an awful lot of money for all those victories. Remember be a "good union pilot".

Funny how you use to throw LOA93 in our face all the time, seems the tides have turned.


Don't worry your "fake" union will do its best to represent you in the upcoming SLI.

 

[EastCheats]

And yet another daily dose of hypocrisy from the resident King Hypocrit. JJ you have done more to destroy unionism than nearly any other unionized employee than I can think of. You helped formed a fake Union to deny its own members fair representation and fair process. It's all there outlined in the pre-arb briefs. You think the West is going to melt down? Hasn't happened yet despite all effort from your side. I'd be very worried about SLI if I were you.
THAT will be a melt down. Luckily the ball has been stripped from the lunatics and handed over to the adults. The USAPA hens are coming home to roost. Look at the bright side...you're not one of the "national officers" of your fake Union. Those poor SOB's will be fighting lawsuits until they're either personally bankrupt or dead. Count on it. AOL will never let them be. Ever.

Did you listen in on the joint telephonic town hall meeting with the St Louis domicile? Professional and no mention of the Usapian created drama. Just contract related issues and negotiations with the company. It looks like we have an actual bargaining agent sgain. Let people like EOA sit over in the corner and sulk because I'm don't really care.

 

[Phoenix]

1. I can speak for me only that I don't trust them.
2. It is why I absolutely DEPLORE closed meetings to pilots.  It should be outlawed.
3. I understand the NEED for closed meetings because there are some pilots that will take that information and use it against us.
4. Go back to number one.
 
Free speech has always been a hallmark of America.  The problem is using free speech with FALSE FACTS and lies.  
 
Ferguson,MO is one of many.  So is the West lies and false belief in "seniority" and entitlement.  Of course that "seniority" works in reverse for pilots that have had everything for so long on the backs of the majority of workers who can do the same job.  Unions and unity are on their way out.  Deal with it.  
 
The APA is unprepared for the stress fractures East and West bring with it and when the West doesn't get their way you will see such a ruckus it will make any prior job actions pale in comparison.
 
I personally look forward to the a$$ kicking AAL will be giving to the other big three with four more years of lower labor costs to competitively make them drive their employees salaries DOWN as a result. I think Delta pilots should make $1,000,000 per year just to make the point how well the pilots and their management get along.  It will just hasten the competitive demise of the pricks who needed US Airways to go away just so ALPA could offer (some of) us jobs.
 
As far as the "unelected" manipulators, of which I am GLADLY one of them I simply point out reality in "Realville".  You will NEVER get the West to march in lockstep.  NEVER.  They are unified in their righteous cause as you well know.  Three losses in federal court, no seat at the SLI table (as of now), millions of dollars in lawyers fees and they think even the APA supports their cause.
 
Jihad is coming from them and none of us will like it.  It could very well strike at the very heart of the RLA and unionism.  That is the reason MB came about and that is where this battle will ultimately finish...in Congress.
 
BTW, you can spare me the "smarter than you" and "higher calling" of the APA BOD who tried to STAB USAPA in the back (and still is with seniority arbitration, you thought they would have learned with the TWA pilots) and the MOU II which we are locked into until at least 2019 and beyond.
 
I'm now calling it LOA93.1

 
You sound like a spoiled individualistic brat that has no intention of ever supporting the electoral process and the constitution of the union that exists.   You did a lot of good to support the notions of unionism but it is too bad that you get pissy that you aren't in control.   It isn't about having control its about supporting unionism, which ALPA categorically abandoned by outsourcing and abdicating any responsibility at all for seniority among its paying members.  As to the factions that do their part to subvert the BPR/BOD and even get ballot certification committee members to resign in the middle of an election of a new president that can't even hold a 1st class medical.. they are what they are and I will never have any respect for them... they are as bad as ALPA dreamed of being.. but those holes are not an exudes to attack the BOD in the midst of negotiations.  When the BOD brings the best deal they can negotiate, then I will vote to tell the company to shove it.  
 
Did you ever join the APA?

 

[EastCheats]

You sound like a spoiled individualistic brat that has no intention of ever supporting the electoral process and the constitution of the union that exists.   You did a lot of good to support the notions of unionism but it is too bad that you get pissy that you aren't in control.   It isn't about having control its about supporting unionism, which ALPA categorically abandoned by outsourcing and abdicating any responsibility at all for seniority among its paying members.  As to the factions that do their part to subvert the BPR/BOD and even get ballot certification committee members to resign in the middle of an election of a new president that can't even hold a 1st class medical.. they are what they are and I will never have any respect for them... they are as bad as ALPA dreamed of being.. but those holes are not an exudes to attack the BOD in the midst of negotiations.  When the BOD brings the best deal they can negotiate, then I will vote to tell the company to shove it.  
 
Did you ever join the APA?

I think there is a better chance he'd join the AARP first, if they would take him.

 

[luvthe9]

Did you listen in on the joint telephonic town hall meeting with the St Louis domicile? Professional and no mention of the Usapian created drama. Just contract related issues and negotiations with the company. It looks like we have an actual bargaining agent sgain. Let people like EOA sit over in the corner and sulk because I'm don't really care.

Yes, was real good, no mention of the NIC at all, that was nice no more drama, just two airline unions going through the merger process. Marty wants his money for Christmas you owe him, or just a tie would be nice.

 

[end_of_alpa]

 
You sound like a spoiled individualistic brat that has no intention of ever supporting the electoral process and the constitution of the union that exists.   You did a lot of good to support the notions of unionism but it is too bad that you get pissy that you aren't in control.   It isn't about having control its about supporting unionism, which ALPA categorically abandoned by outsourcing and abdicating any responsibility at all for seniority among its paying members.  As to the factions that do their part to subvert the BPR/BOD and even get ballot certification committee members to resign in the middle of an election of a new president that can't even hold a 1st class medical.. they are what they are and I will never have any respect for them... they are as bad as ALPA dreamed of being.. but those holes are not an exudes to attack the BOD in the midst of negotiations.  When the BOD brings the best deal they can negotiate, then I will vote to tell the company to shove it.  
 
Did you ever join the APA?

Did almost 500 AWA pilots ever join USAPA?
 
Did several hundred TWA pilots ever join APA?
 
You said "ALPA It isn't about having control its about supporting unionism, which ALPA categorically abandoned by outsourcing and abdicating any responsibility at all for seniority among its paying members."  Not that I DON'T agree but we HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM NOW.
 
BTW I didn't support Hummel but the Rank and File did.
 
You said:  "they are what they are and I will never have any respect for them... they are as bad as ALPA dreamed of being.. but those holes are not an exudes to attack the BOD in the midst of negotiations."
 
You mean the same "holes" that are APA/USAPA/ALPA members?  You know, the ones who "theoretically" support "unionism"?
 
Who needs enemies with fellow union members like that?
 
Did I join the APA?  Does it really matter in the grand scheme of things the way things are NOW under LOA 93.1?  REALLY?

 

[Claxon]

Did you listen in on the joint telephonic town hall meeting with the St Louis domicile? Professional and no mention of the Usapian created drama. Just contract related issues and negotiations with the company. It looks like we have an actual bargaining agent sgain. Let people like EOA sit over in the corner and sulk because I'm don't really care.

phx and St. Louis bases have a lot in common because both will be closing in the near future.

 

[end_of_alpa]

No one worried at all about the SLI, stop being so dramatic it's over for you, but feel free to keep buying ties if it makes you feel better. You kids owe Marty an awful lot of money for all those victories. Remember be a "good union pilot".

Funny how you use to throw LOA93 in our face all the time, seems the tides have turned.


Don't worry your "fake" union will do its best to represent you in the upcoming SLI.

According to the BOD and the other guys on here I guess LOA93.1 is now the New American.  With the upcoming LOSS in the PAB the West are coming unglued.
 
We'll be following the meetings next week and I'm sure well get good intel then.
 
Welcome aboard!