2014 Pilot Discussion

[Phoenix]

 
What do Jerry Glass, Stephen Wolf, Rakesh Gangwal and Keith Wilson all have in common?   They have moved past their purple phase.. (If they ever had one, it was before the invention of the smart phone camera).  
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVgjcyH4Ghk

 

[EastUS1]

 
 
What do Jerry Glass, Stephen Wolf, Rakesh Gangwal and Keith Wilson all have in common?   They have moved past their purple phase.. (If they ever had one, it was before the invention of the smart phone camera).  
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVgjcyH4Ghk
 

 
...And apparently this proudly and publicly, for all the world to see, represents the mature character of those at the helm of the world's (for the moment anyway) largest airline?...Sometimes, words just fail me.
 
For those among us aged folk, one must cynically imagine the appropriate jingle as background music: "We're American Airlines...doing what we do best."

 

[A320 Driver]

I'm not cynical regarding the APA. I believe their response has been correct and their counter offer appropriate. Lets see what the company's next move is.
 
The measure of a successful corporation is more than how much profit it makes.

 

[Claxon]

What do Jerry Glass, Stephen Wolf, Rakesh Gangwal and Keith Wilson all have in common?   They have moved past their purple phase.. (If they ever had one, it was before the invention of the smart phone camera).  
 

They try to mimic Herb Kelleher and Southwest. Sans pay, benefits, and true respect for their employees.

 

[Claxon]

The company will take the JCBA to arbitration, which will delay the contract until at least spring of next year.  The flight attendants voting out their contract sealed their decision.  
 
Patience.  Expect the company to lay blame on others but themselves for not being able to attain a JCBA within the agreed upon time frame.   They had a plan, have a plan and will pursue their plan. 
 
The Honeymoon phase of any relationship is historically inevitable and predictable.

 

[nycbusdriver]

They try to mimic Herb Kelleher and Southwest. Sans pay, benefits, and true respect for their employees.

 
They do talk pretty.  I think the LAA employees have finally seen the light, but maybe too late.  The Delta CEO was right...AA will never catch Delta because Parker will not invest in his employees, as he and Kelleher at SWA have.  The presence of Jerry Glass in the pilot negotiations is proof of that.  Without the unionized workforce rowing the the direction of making AA the premier airline, it will instead be behind UAL inside 18 months.
 

The company will take the JCBA to arbitration, which will delay the contract until at least spring of next year.  The flight attendants voting out their contract sealed their decision.  
 
Patience.  Expect the company to lay blame on others but themselves for not being able to attain a JCBA within the agreed upon time frame.   They had a plan, have a plan and will pursue their plan. 
 
The Honeymoon phase of any relationship is historically inevitable and predictable.

 
I think the APA will end up in JCBA arbitration, too.  However, management will certainly lose a lot of INVESTOR confidence once that happens.  Here you have the Parker Brain Trust, unable to complete a merger between US and AW after 9 years of trying, now trying to merge the "unmerged" US and AA and doing such a crappy job of it that the New AA will not see labor peace for a decade, or more.

 

[A320 Driver]

They do talk pretty.  I think the LAA employees have finally seen the light, but maybe too late.  The Delta CEO was right...AA will never catch Delta because Parker will not invest in his employees, as he and Kelleher at SWA have.  The presence of Jerry Glass in the pilot negotiations is proof of that.  Without the unionized workforce rowing the the direction of making AA the premier airline, it will instead be behind UAL inside 18 months.
 

 
I think the APA will end up in JCBA arbitration, too.  However, management will certainly lose a lot of INVESTOR confidence once that happens.  Here you have the Parker Brain Trust, unable to complete a merger between US and AW after 9 years of trying, now trying to merge the "unmerged" US and AA and doing such a crappy job of it that the New AA will not see labor peace for a decade, or more.

The down side being that we lose in the process.

 

[Claxon]

 
APA PHX Domicile Update: Nov. 15, 2014
 
Dear PHX Pilots,
 
 
As you are keenly aware, AAG management sent its “comprehensive economic proposal” to the APA on Tuesday of this week. This, after the APA granted American a thirty-day extension (at American's request) to the time-line found under the paragraph 27 of the MOU which called for cost-neutral arbitration to be offered if a Joint Collective Bargaining Agreement (JCBA) could not be negotiated within 30 days of APA being certified as the union for all pilots of the combined airline. Paragraph 27 of the MOU is shown here:

 
If and when the NMB makes a single-carrier finding, the organization certified to represent the pilots of the single carrier, the single carrier acknowledged by the NMB and the certified organization shall promptly engage or re-engage in negotiations to achieve a JCBA to be applicable to the carrier that will be the product of the Merger. In the event that such negotiations are not completed within 30 days of the NMB's certification, New American Airlines will offer final and binding interest arbitration under Section 7 of the RLA, and the organization will accept such proffer, to resolve once and for all the terms of the JCBA. The arbitration decision shall be issued no later than 60 days after the close of the 30-day negotiation period. A panel of three arbitrators led by Richard Bloch shall serve as the arbitrators for this process. If Arbitrator Bloch declines to serve in this capacity or is unable to resolve the parties’ dispute, the parties shall select another arbitrator. The arbitrator’s jurisdiction and award will be limited to fashioning provisions which are consistent with the terms of the MTA, including provisions which implement the terms of the MTA or facilitate the integration of pilots under the terms of the MTA. The arbitrator’s award specifically shall adhere to the economic terms of the MTA and shall not change the MTA’s Scope terms (Paragraph 25 of this Memorandum) or the modifications generated through the process set forth in Paragraph 24 of this Memorandum.

 
The extension was granted after the APA Board of Directors heard directly from Doug Parker in a meeting wherein he loosely outlined what we should expect the company to offer, but only after the conclusion of the flight attendant JCBA ratification vote on November 9. What was heard by the BOD was sufficient to grant the extension and high expectations were set for what would be received from the company when the time came. That time finally came on Tuesday and we believe the entire BOD, as well as every last AA pilot, was both disappointed and dismayed. This, especially in light of the letter preceding the release of the company's offer authored by Scott Kirby in which he outlined his plan to “establish trust with our employees” by dropping his request for SCOPE relief by way of increasing the maximum allowable capacity of jets flown by AA's regional affiliates from 76 to 81 seats. What happened next did anything but “establish trust” when the company's actual proposal objectively degraded our SCOPE clause far more (potentially costing far more jobs) than the offer we were led to expect.

 
There is a clear disconnect between Parker, Kirby, and the pilots of American Airlines. We believe management expected our pilots to be elated with their offer which included higher wages than those provided by the current agreement. Management values its offer well above the economics of the MTA, but overlooks the fact that the offer comes with a few seemingly inconsequential concessions. Those concessions are not at all inconsequential because it could well lead to fewer jobs and a degradation to the industry standard SCOPE, not only for AA pilots, but also for all major airlines. SCOPE is the foundation upon which the entirety of our contract is built. Rates of pay are irrelevant when your job has been outsourced to a regional airline competitor due to lack of SCOPE.

 
The pilots of Phoenix have reason to be especially indignant. We have watched Parker and Kirby go from leading America West, to attempting a merger with American Trans Air, to merging with US Airways (which was never fully completed after eight years), to an attempt to merge with Delta, followed by two attempts to merge with United, to finally being able to close a deal with American in 2013. Financially, the AA deal may have closed in short order but operational integration remains some time off into the future and past performance indicates there is more than a small chance that Parker and his team may never get there. It is vital to remember that Parker and Kirby would not be at the helm of the world's largest airline without the patient support of the AWA/US Airways pilots and most recently, the pilots of American Airlines. It is also critical to remember how close Parker and his team came to losing the deal when the former AA CEO presented his “stand alone” plan which began to gather steam, especially when it was supported by Bob Crandall. But for the robust support of APA and our former bargaining agent, the deal would likely have been lost. It appears that Parker and his team have already forgotten where they would be today without us.

 
So why is this apparently massive increase in the value of our contract insufficient at this time? Because that figure still falls well short of the value of Parker's and Kirby's stated goal of “beating Delta” in every metric (including employee compensation) and the many clear promises made that they would do so at the earliest opportunity. The unprecedented financial results of the airline prove that opportunity is upon us now, and it was those promises which led to the robust support from the pilot groups which ultimately led to these men taking control of the world's largest airline. There is no legitimate reason to delay making good on those promises today without requiring our pilots to pay for it by way of any concessions. The pay increase offered represents only a fraction of our pilots' investment in these men over the years, and not the other way around.

 
Given the offer as presented to the association and the alternative of cost-neutral arbitration, we were initially inclined to send the JCBA to arbitration, knowing that our SCOPE will not be degraded and that rates of pay will be increased in accordance with the “mid-contract adjustment” beginning January 1, 2016. If either Delta or United receive an increase before then, that increase could place the 2016 rates (and beyond) at or above those now being offered. When considering total compensation (pay, profit sharing, work rules and benefits), the company's current offer only closes the gap somewhat, but at a very high price. Notwithstanding the aforementioned, we do believe the company's offer was made in good faith and we can understand why it might be puzzled by the negative reaction. While Parker and Kirby have long been very highly compensated, they appear to have forgotten how long the pilots of Phoenix and US Airways have lagged the industry and may not realize just how far behind the legacy AA pilots have also become. It's not a matter of receiving a sizable raise one year ahead of schedule, but of receiving no raises whatsoever in the decade prior to this merger. The time is now and we should not be asked to give any more to get what we have patiently earned (and tried to negotiate) over many years.
 
 
After debating the company's offer and agreeing to a counterproposal, the APA BOD sent the Negotiating Committee to AA headquarters Friday morning to deliver it. In response, the company asked to meet again early next week to discuss APA's counteroffer and we are encouraged by this fact. A deal is not dead and it's not too late to strike a mutually beneficial deal as negotiations remain ongoing. The APA BOD will reconvene next week to see what develops and whether or not an acceptable contract can be reached rather than punting the JCBA to arbitration due to broken promises. We believe a negotiated settlement is still possible and is preferable to all parties. It would also allow the new American Airlines to show the world that it was truly serious about a positive cultural change and competent to make that happen. The window of opportunity for Parker and Kirby to close this deal and cement their legacy is small and closing. We hope that legacy will be one which will hold them in the highest regard of our membership.
 

[SIZE=medium]Fraternally,[/SIZE]
 
 
John and Eric
 
 
John Scherff
[SIZE=medium]PHX Chairman[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]PHX-Chair@alliedpilots.orgmailto:PHX-Chair@alliedpilots.org[/SIZE]
256-457-0801
 
Eric Ferguson
PHX Vice Chairm

john and eric, phx reps for APA.  RICO dependents, ID thieves.  Standing up in PHX pilot meetings alleging East pilots running engines and APU's.  Standing up in PHX meetings with Parker and Kirby alleging East pilots not asking for direct and burning more fuel. 
Unleashing marty and andy on the unsuspecting East pilots.  (intended sarcasm)
 
It is impossible for "the hatchet to be buried" from the west by the East. 
It is the responsibility of the East pilots to be the messengers and the historians of the west's actions.
 
APA, get ready for the west law suits and Parkers strategy, you were forewarned by the East. 

 

[traderjake]

john and eric, phx reps for APA.  RICO dependents, ID thieves. 

 
Mike C, sues USAPA LLC for a cut of the money they stole from LUS pilots.  

 

[EastUS1]

"The time is now and we should not be asked to give any more to get what we have patiently earned (and tried to negotiate) over many years."
 

john and eric, phx reps for APA.  RICO dependents, ID thieves.  Standing up in PHX pilot meetings alleging East pilots running engines and APU's.  Standing up in PHX meetings with Parker and Kirby alleging East pilots not asking for direct and burning more fuel. 

 
Don't forget them helping "earn" advances by their "leadership" directly asking the CEO if they "should turn in" east pilots...Honestly, these people couldn't be written into kids' comic books as believable characters.
"we should not be asked to give any more to get what we have patiently earned.....over many years." Seriously? Ya' just gotta' be kiddin' me! I almost fell outta' my chair laughing, given their determined efforts to place west new hires ahead of east pilots that had already logged 16+ years of continued service. Hypocrites much?
 
"But for the robust support of APA and our former bargaining agent, the deal would likely have been lost." Huh? I'd thought "our former bargaining agent" was purely an instrument of satan himself, and now it seems their efforts should be valued and rewarded? Wow!
 
"to get what we have patiently earned (and tried to negotiate) over many years." "(and tried to negotiate)"...? Whew! That's funny, since the only thing that was evidenced over the years was west posters promising that they'd scab any USAPA picket line, if not handed absurdly inflated "seniority" over the larger east contingent. What did I miss there? In all fairness;  I must give credit for their sense of humor though. "patiently earned" is among the all-time best knee-slappers from the west ever seen here.
 
"It's not a matter of receiving a sizable raise one year ahead of schedule, but of receiving no raises whatsoever in the decade prior to this merger."...? Words just fail me there. Whatever happened to "You can live on LOA93 forever!"...? Management fully knows, from years of experience, that what they have out in PHX is nothing more threatening than a tool box full of easily manipulated "useful idiots"...period.  These people have unquestioningly sucked up to management for years, going so far as to actively undermine their "fellow pilots" at every opportunity. Who do fergie and his pathetic little "army" think they're at all fooling here? Oh well. All I can say is thanks for the Joke of the Day and the usual good laughs one can always count on coming from "sparta".
 

 

[nycbusdriver]

 
 

 
You can't blame them, really.  After showing the entire universe, for almost ten years, that they're a bunch of spoiled brats acting like three-year-olds in a tantrum, they want to act the grownup part in front of the APA.
 
Thankfully, most of their nonsense played out on the internet, which has a permanent memory and can be replayed at will.

 

[EastUS1]

 
You can't blame them, really.  After showing the entire universe, for almost ten years, that they're a bunch of spoiled brats acting like three-year-olds in a tantrum, they want to act the grownup part in front of the APA.
 
Thankfully, most of their nonsense played out on the internet, which has a permanent memory and can be replayed at will.

 
Indeed, but should any require a brief refresher course, the following are offered. Personally-signed-by-management knee pads that were undoubtedly worn by the participants were apparently edited out:
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpSFvQ-0p2I&list=PL21C1C7D32B996827
 
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIfKKw-kvPo&list=PL21C1C7D32B996827&index=29

 

[bunt3dunk]

Plain and simple , bring back the profit sharing , for all employee groups , we have to look out for each other.

 

[cltrat]

Plain and simple , bring back the profit sharing , for all employee groups , we have to look out for each other.

this is something I think we can all agree on

 

[EastUS1]

bunt3dunk, on 18 Nov 2014 - 08:38 AM, said: Plain and simple , bring back the profit sharing , for all employee groups , we have to look out for each other.

this is something I think we can all agree on

 
Well, IF one actually had a management that even at ALL honestly wanted to establish "trust", that would sure be a good first step, but who are we kidding here, what with this AWA/low cost carrier mentality at the top? I mean really; what better way to establish "trust" and a good working relationship with one's employees than to note record level profits from their efforts, but not in ANY way reward the very people who's working lives make those profits even possible? How better to motivate people than to make sure they see no/zip/zero proportional gains from their work, no matter what efforts they put into it? Failing to provide even a semblance of motivation via such as profit sharing loudly shouts that these people expect and wish only the levels of performance needed to "get by" through means of the coercion and bludgeoning of their workforce, which, if at ALL assuming one wanted to offer a superior product through an enthusiastic and dedicated work force that'll make it happen, well...truer motivational "genius" in/from "leadership" is hard to even imagine than to post record profits and make sure none of "the peasants" get so much as a single crumb from them.
 
What do you expect? Consider just the strangely twisted narcissism demonstrated in this instance alone:
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVgjcyH4Ghk