2014 Pilot Discussion

[Phoenix]

More like in the top 275, he was one of the first I bet to sign LOA93 without looking at the details, especially the part about the snap back at the end of 5 years, wording and language by Mowery cost us that one. Our lawyers won't be here when this is over but we will have to live with the results.
We screw these agreements every time and have not learned, I just don't want any mistakes this time.
This protocol language leaves way to many loopholes for me.

I don't like how the merger committee is always being a cheerleader for their "own work"---and especially in the face of a ballot. I don't doubt that the merger committee is doing good work, but they seem to confuse ballots on company proposals with ballots on their self esteem.

 

[Piedmont1984]

I don't like how the merger committee is always being a cheerleader for their "own work"---and especially in the face of a ballot. I don't doubt that the merger committee is doing good work, but they seem to confuse ballots on company proposals with ballots on their self esteem.

Hey now.

"So what? What does pointing fingers at each other get us? What does it get us to have both sides saying, "You guys are weak." "No! You guys are the cowards." "No! You guys are ..."

I listened to their presentation. They were not cheerleading.

 

[snapthis]

September 4, 2014

West Pilots Class Rep Update

As we are certain you know, mediated negotiations called for by the NMB to achieve a SLI Process Agreement have been ongoing between APA, New American, and USAPA in Washington, D.C. since August 5. Noticeably absent in the process has been any representative advocating for the unique interests of the West pilots.

Today, the USAPA BPR, over the objections of the Phoenix Reps, ratified the tentative agreement resulting from those mediated negotiations, subject to reaching modification of the Agreement with APA and the Company on one matter not related to our principal issue: the status of a Committee representing West pilots. We assume that the parties will resolve that issue, one way or another, in relatively short order. If so, more details about the Agreement will surely appear in the days ahead.

By the terms of the Agreement it is plainly evident that USAPA has once again demonstrated that they only intend to represent East US Airways pilot seniority interests. One only has to read the inaccurate and inflammatory September 3, 2014 USAPA Merger Committee update , and compare that with the actual language of the Protocol Agreement to understand the depth USAPA will go to deny West representation in the coming SLI. The West pilots must be afforded the same status, rights, and privileges as the other two pilot groups specified in the MOU. This was one of the key factors leading to our support of the MOU and merger with American Airlines in the first place.

APA has made it clear through its public statements that they believe that a West Merger Committee must be appointed. We trust that APA, unlike USAPA, recognizes that no seniority integration process that excludes the West pilots and puts our fate in USAPA's hands exclusively will ever be considered a fair process by us, given USAPA's historic and proven animus to our interests. We assume that APA will support the appointment of a West Committee in the Preliminary Arbitration called for by the Agreement and hope the Company will as well. Nevertheless, we must stand vigilant and ready to represent ourselves, with legal counsel of our own choosing, in the upcoming seniority proceedings. To that end your Certified West Pilot Class Representatives are reaffirming our support of the "West Merger Committee" augmented by the legal team of Jeff Freund and Marty Harper. When USAPA is finally decertified, it will no longer have any representational status under the RLA. At that point in time, USAPA becomes just a private, unincorporated association bound by the laws of the State of North Carolina. Period. We look forward to working constructively with APA once it becomes the certified bargaining agent and takes on the responsibility of insuring a fair seniority integration process for all of its members: old American, East and West pilots. We will continue to prepare for that day as it rapidly approaches.

The unexpected delays at the NMB, USAPA's DC lawsuit along with the MOU requirement to present a final list to the company no later than December 9th, 2015 have compressed our time line. Having been cut out of the process, should a West Committee gain standing to participate (as we expect), this Committee will be required to make up for lost time. We will be forced to accomplish in a matter of weeks what the other committees have had many months to prepare. The need for manpower to assist became evident, and after careful consideration, we have added Jeff O'Connell, Mitch Vasin, Jim Van Sickle and West Class Representatives Mark Burman and Roger Velez to the merger team. We strongly believe this newly expanded team will be representative of every pilot in our West group and can effectively meet the challenges that lie ahead.

The West Merger Committee will consist of the following nine west pilots:

Russ Payne
Eric Ferguson
Johan de Vicq
David Braid
Jeff O'Connell
Mitch Vasin
Jim Van Sickle
Mark Burman
Roger Velez

This has been the virtuous cause backed by West unity, which has so far stopped USAPA's unjust plan to substitute its own self-serving seniority list in place of the Nicolau Award. Had West pilots not stood our ground, USAPA's injustice would have prevailed long ago and there would be no ongoing dispute regarding West participation between the parties today. Your career would be facing a high likelihood of suffering a compounding injury in this new merger. Instead we are poised to finally enforce the prior arbitration in the context of this new merger and prevent additional losses beyond what we have endured at the hands of USAPA. We will continue our vigilance against those who would silence West representation. Every legal option will be exercised to protect West Pilot seniority.

It is our realistic expectation, given our unprecedented solidarity that has been demonstrated over many years of hardship, that all West pilots will support their West Class Representatives and remain unified behind the West Merger Committee.

Sincerely,

Your West Class Representatives, USAPA Phoenix BPR Representatives, West Merger Committee, LLC Managers and Members:

Don Addington
John Bostic
Mark Burman
Steve Wargocki
AC Iranpour
Rod Brackin
Michael Soha
George Maliga
Roger Velez

 

[flyer63]

Keep spitting in the wind snap

 

[end_of_alpa]

An amendment was approved. Para 16 deleted. So now the APA and company must sign off on the amended PA.

what paragraph 16 and why?

 

[end_of_alpa]

September 4, 2014
West Pilots Class Rep Update
As we are certain you know, mediated negotiations called for by the NMB to achieve a SLI Process Agreement have been ongoing between APA, New American, and USAPA in Washington, D.C. since August 5. Noticeably absent in the process has been any representative advocating for the unique interests of the West pilots.
Today, the USAPA BPR, over the objections of the Phoenix Reps, ratified the tentative agreement resulting from those mediated negotiations, subject to reaching modification of the Agreement with APA and the Company on one matter not related to our principal issue: the status of a Committee representing West pilots. We assume that the parties will resolve that issue, one way or another, in relatively short order. If so, more details about the Agreement will surely appear in the days ahead.
By the terms of the Agreement it is plainly evident that USAPA has once again demonstrated that they only intend to represent East US Airways pilot seniority interests. One only has to read the inaccurate and inflammatory September 3, 2014 USAPA Merger Committee update , and compare that with the actual language of the Protocol Agreement to understand the depth USAPA will go to deny West representation in the coming SLI. The West pilots must be afforded the same status, rights, and privileges as the other two pilot groups specified in the MOU. This was one of the key factors leading to our support of the MOU and merger with American Airlines in the first place.
APA has made it clear through its public statements that they believe that a West Merger Committee must be appointed. We trust that APA, unlike USAPA, recognizes that no seniority integration process that excludes the West pilots and puts our fate in USAPA's hands exclusively will ever be considered a fair process by us, given USAPA's historic and proven animus to our interests. We assume that APA will support the appointment of a West Committee in the Preliminary Arbitration called for by the Agreement and hope the Company will as well. Nevertheless, we must stand vigilant and ready to represent ourselves, with legal counsel of our own choosing, in the upcoming seniority proceedings. To that end your Certified West Pilot Class Representatives are reaffirming our support of the "West Merger Committee" augmented by the legal team of Jeff Freund and Marty Harper. When USAPA is finally decertified, it will no longer have any representational status under the RLA. At that point in time, USAPA becomes just a private, unincorporated association bound by the laws of the State of North Carolina. Period. We look forward to working constructively with APA once it becomes the certified bargaining agent and takes on the responsibility of insuring a fair seniority integration process for all of its members: old American, East and West pilots. We will continue to prepare for that day as it rapidly approaches.
The unexpected delays at the NMB, USAPA's DC lawsuit along with the MOU requirement to present a final list to the company no later than December 9th, 2015 have compressed our time line. Having been cut out of the process, should a West Committee gain standing to participate (as we expect), this Committee will be required to make up for lost time. We will be forced to accomplish in a matter of weeks what the other committees have had many months to prepare. The need for manpower to assist became evident, and after careful consideration, we have added Jeff O'Connell, Mitch Vasin, Jim Van Sickle and West Class Representatives Mark Burman and Roger Velez to the merger team. We strongly believe this newly expanded team will be representative of every pilot in our West group and can effectively meet the challenges that lie ahead.
The West Merger Committee will consist of the following nine west pilots:
Russ Payne
Eric Ferguson
Johan de Vicq
David Braid
Jeff O'Connell
Mitch Vasin
Jim Van Sickle
Mark Burman
Roger Velez
This has been the virtuous cause backed by West unity, which has so far stopped USAPA's unjust plan to substitute its own self-serving seniority list in place of the Nicolau Award. Had West pilots not stood our ground, USAPA's injustice would have prevailed long ago and there would be no ongoing dispute regarding West participation between the parties today. Your career would be facing a high likelihood of suffering a compounding injury in this new merger. Instead we are poised to finally enforce the prior arbitration in the context of this new merger and prevent additional losses beyond what we have endured at the hands of USAPA. We will continue our vigilance against those who would silence West representation. Every legal option will be exercised to protect West Pilot seniority.
It is our realistic expectation, given our unprecedented solidarity that has been demonstrated over many years of hardship, that all West pilots will support their West Class Representatives and remain unified behind the West Merger Committee.
Sincerely,
Your West Class Representatives, USAPA Phoenix BPR Representatives, West Merger Committee, LLC Managers and Members:
Don Addington
John Bostic
Mark Burman
Steve Wargocki
AC Iranpour
Rod Brackin
Michael Soha
George Maliga
Roger Velez

You have to first argue and prove that you are entitled to merger rep status and secondly, if you get there, you have argue and PROVE that you are entitled to the positions you want on the SLI. Good luck.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

END OF ALPA, We have a winner! Totally agree and what happens when other "special interest groups file their lawsuits, what is the MOU drop dead date?

 

[Phoenix]

Hey now.
"So what? What does pointing fingers at each other get us? What does it get us to have both sides saying, "You guys are weak." "No! You guys are the cowards." "No! You guys are ..."
I listened to their presentation. They were not cheerleading.

You are right... They gave the proposal to the membership and asked us to be their cheerleaders to the BPR.

 

[luvthe9]

APA merger committee to AWA merger committee..... At the time of the merge what were your career expectations and how many wide bodies are you bringing to this merge, good luck with that!

 

[Freighterguynow]

mediated negotiations called for by the NMB


No point in reading any further.

 

[traderjake]

what paragraph 16 and why?

 
16. The integrated seniority list resulting from the process established by the MOU and this Protocol Agreement shall be implemented under the Joint Collective Bargaining Agreement as soon as operationally feasible following the Protocol Agreement, Tentative Agreement date the final award is issued or the date the FAA issues a single operating certificate covering the carriers, whichever is later. Upon receipt of the final award, the Company will promptly meet with the APA and the Merger Committees to discuss the process and timing for implementation of the final award. After these discussions occur, if a dispute arises regarding whether the Company’s implementation of the final award meets the “as soon as operationally feasible” standard set forth herein, such dispute may be submitted to the Board of Arbitration for resolution.

 

[EastUS1]

September 4, 2014

West Pilots Class Rep Update

.....Noticeably absent in the process has been any representative advocating for the unique interests of the West pilots.

.... We assume that the parties will...
 
.....We assume that APA will support.....
 
.....This has been the virtuous cause...................We will continue our vigilance against those who would silence.......

.....It is our realistic expectation, .....

 
Whew! Well, at least there's still no shortage of "virtuous" assumptions, "vigilance" (and of course "expectation") to be seen out west. I'm a bit surprised that "righteous cause" and "integrity matters" have apparently run their course, even within your own cult, and can only wonder when the first "Virtuous" Vestal Virgins T-shirts will be seen proudly strutted down some fashion show runway? I must "assume" that you do have plans for properly clothing your intended committee members, after all.

 

[Pi brat]

USAPA Update - Protocol Agreement Completed
 
All parties have agreed to a Protocol Agreement to govern the Seniority List Integration process with the APA. 
Today during the Special BPR Meeting, the Board decided to remove paragraph 16, from the version of the Protocol Agreement you received yesterday in the Merger Committee Update.  The following Protocol Agreement Resolution, was approved 2361.3 - 1869.7 in a Division of the House vote (Yes - PHL Music Taylor, DCA, CLT Borman Nelson; No - PHX, CLT Frear).
WHEREAS The USAPA Merger Committee and the Merger Counsel have engaged in negotiations with the APA and the Company since early in 2014 pertaining to attaining a Protocol Agreement to protect and serve the pilots of USAPA with the seniority list integration with the pilots of the APA,
THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED that the BPR approves the Protocol Agreement with the deletion of paragraph 16.
The Protocol Agreement (without paragraph 16) was then transmitted to the APA and the Company, and the parties have subsequently agreed.  More detailed information will be available in the Special Meeting Recap which will be sent to you tomorrow. Click here to view the final version.
Note - Division of the house shall be permitted only for votes taken to approve or reject any tentative agreements affecting income, work rule change(s), and/or benefit(s); setting parameters for collective bargaining; agreements on affiliation or merger with another labor organization; agreements arising from a merger of, or successor transactions involving the employer, or its parent (including seniority integration agreements); and amendments to the Constitution and Bylaws. On a Division of the house vote, each member of the Board shall be entitled to vote equal percentages of the active members in good standing at his domicile provided that: 
1. For domiciles having one-hundred (100) or less members, the representative shall be entitled to one (1) vote for each active member in good standing at his domicile, and
2. For domiciles having one-hundred one (101) or more members, each representative shall be entitled to vote equal percentages of active members in good standing at the domicile.
3. Fractional votes will be counted in pro-rata “Division of the House” voting (above.)
4. All other issues will be determined by a senatorial (each person allowed one) vote of the BPR. The result of such vote shall determine the final disposition of the matter.
USAPA Communications

 

[crazystnic]

How did D'Orio vote?

 

[Phoenix]

...
The need for manpower to assist became evident, and after careful consideration, we have added Jeff O'Connell, Mitch Vasin, Jim Van Sickle and West Class Representatives Mark Burman and Roger Velez to the merger team. We strongly believe this newly expanded team will be representative of every pilot in our West group and can effectively meet the challenges that lie ahead.
The West Merger Committee will consist of the following nine west pilots:
Russ Payne
Eric Ferguson
Johan de Vicq
David Braid
Jeff O'Connell
Mitch Vasin
Jim Van Sickle
Mark Burman
Roger Velez
This has been the virtuous cause backed by West unity, which has so far stopped USAPA's unjust plan to substitute its own self-serving seniority list in place of the Nicolau Award. Had West pilots not stood our ground, USAPA's injustice would have prevailed long ago and there would be no ongoing dispute regarding West participation between the parties today. Your career would be facing a high likelihood of suffering a compounding injury in this new merger. Instead we are poised to finally enforce the prior arbitration in the context of this new merger and prevent additional losses beyond what we have endured at the hands of USAPA. We will continue our vigilance against those who would silence West representation. Every legal option will be exercised to protect West Pilot seniority.
It is our realistic expectation, given our unprecedented solidarity that has been demonstrated over many years of hardship, that all West pilots will support their West Class Representatives and remain unified behind the West Merger Committee.
Sincerely,
Your West Class Representatives, USAPA Phoenix BPR Representatives, West Merger Committee, LLC Managers and Members:
Don Addington
John Bostic
Mark Burman
Steve Wargocki
AC Iranpour
Rod Brackin
Michael Soha
George Maliga
Roger Velez

So when it says "we"... Who is "we"?

Did the Liberty Tie Gullibles get to vote on who represents them, or do they just buy ties?

When the ALPA punks gave away our pension without the membership ratification we demanded.. Even so they were our elected punks. The self appointed "we" won't even have that much going for them.