US Pilots Labor Discussion 2/10- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[Flippin43]

If you say so. My "situational ethics" regarding that mess were the following: I'm ex EAL myself, exiting EAL years prior to Lorenzo's greed-soaked madness destroying the once great airline. Although I'd resigned from EAL and had no notions that my EAL DOH should be in play for myself; I personally had zero problems with the idea of allowing the shuttle guys their EAL DOH. I figured they pretty much had continuous service, despite the changeover in paint schemes and paychecks. This view was not shared by all by any means. The truly "horrible deal" they did end up with was much the same as my own in any case = "You resigned from EAL and started eleswhere..." With the "merger"-from-hell we're dealing with here....umm..I can't recall anyone resigning from US or AWA as part of that process. I certainly believe that al AWA people should have their entire time in service respected, despite the fact that AWA no longer exists, the paint schemes/etc have changed....Umm...So what am I missing here within my "situational ethics" distresses?

East,

The part you missed was that until AAA saw what they were really going to give to the Shuttle guys with with DOH in Nic 1 it was fine. Then the lights went on and they saw that they weren't gonna get to screw them properly thats why they switched to a W-2 based method. No Gold Standard allowed here. But with us DOH gets you to giving us a gooood screwin and so presto chango DOH is now the Gold Standard no matter what. errrrrrr unless your an empire or shuttle guy.

The main thing you have evidently missed is that you are no longer working for AAA anymore. LCC is a new Company and not your old one. So basically AAA longer exist either.

Of course the Old guard at AAA might have woke up one day and decided to say "Cactus 701" on the radio just because its Cool.


Flip

 

[CallawayGolf]

Listen up Caddyshack,



Any outcome is better than being tied to the west. It won't be parceled because of labor strife...it will be that as a whole, it doesn't fit anyone's structure in a positive way. Last sentence is important...read it a few times.


Inverted

Being integrated with the west is the only realistic scenario for the east pilot group. Keep clicking your heels together though if it helps you to avoid reality.

 

[inverted]

Being integrated with the west is the only realistic scenario for the east pilot group. Keep clicking your heels together though if it helps you to avoid reality.

Caddy,


I know you are hoping so......you wouldn't even have a name. How about AIRizona...kinda catchy.


Inverted

 

[CallawayGolf]

Caddy,


I know you are hoping so......you wouldn't even have a name. How about AIRizona...kinda catchy.


Inverted

It doesn't matter what either of us hope for. Reality with prove itself soon enough. The ninth will rule and the integration process will pick up steam. The only question is if USAPA will put out a TA for a vote (with the NIC included) or if the company will enforce a contract through self-help. Of course if USAPA dissolves under the weight of failed litigations, then the company will integrate east & west and implement any changes as they see fit. Forever separate is not an option.

 

[inverted]

It doesn't matter what either of us hope for. Reality with prove itself soon enough. The ninth will rule and the integration process will pick up steam. The only question is if USAPA will put out a TA for a vote (with the NIC included) or if the company will enforce a contract through self-help. Of course if USAPA dissolves under the weight of failed litigations, then the company will integrate east & west and implement any changes as they see fit. Forever separate is not an option.

Ok, assuming you are right and Parker integrates the two, then what is the future of this airline? Can you see this airline as a successful stand alone carrier...honestly? If it is to be merged, then who is going to want all of the combined airline...any ideas?



Inverted

 

[goneflyin]

In my estimation, the PHL hub is of little value to any major airline. Delta? We have New York. American? Continental? Ditto. United? They have Dulles, right down the road. The amount of O & D traffic that PHL would offer would not offset the redundancy of having two hubs so close together.

Southwest will probably continue to expand incrementally there, though.

You can keep hoping for that white knight, but he ain't coming...

GF
DAL

 

[inverted]

In my estimation, the PHL hub is of little value to any major airline. Delta? We have New York. American? Continental? Ditto. United? They have Dulles, right down the road. The amount of O & D traffic that PHL would offer would not offset the redundancy of having two hubs so close together.

Southwest will probably continue to expand incrementally there, though.

You can keep hoping for that white knight, but he ain't coming...

GF
DAL

That may be the most ignorant statement ever made here....PHL has little value...geezz. You screwed yourself there DAL. PHL has a huge population and is a business oriented travel sector. It is the most profitable hub not to mention a strong international hub. You are going to have to change your screen name now.


Inverted

 

[CallawayGolf]

Ok, assuming you are right and Parker integrates the two, then what is the future of this airline? Can you see this airline as a successful stand alone carrier...honestly? If it is to be merged, then who is going to want all of the combined airline...any ideas?



Inverted

The merger took place in the fourth quarter 2005. In 2006 and 2007 the new US Airways made record profits as a company (more than HP or US ever did separately) and led the industry in most financial metrics or had made the biggest year-over-year improvements of any legacy carrier. DL and NW were no longer competitive and had to go into reorganization status to regain a good financial footing in order to compete. UA has been lagging in almost every financial category since it reorganized. AA didn’t use bankruptcy to recover from 9/11 and they have been floundering ever since.

It wasn’t a failed merger that put US back on the critical list in 2008. It was the cost of fuel. If fuel prices and PAX demand would have remained at 2007 levels then US would have made a profit and would have continued to expand its operations. The late 2008 and 2009 recession caused US, and every other airline, to respond to lower demand and lower yielding fares by cutting capacity and unprofitable routes that were dragging the airline deeper into a financial crisis. Having done all that, US is well positioned for a continued recession or preferably a more robust economy with more demand and better yields as 2010 has already shown.

If the external economic forces hadn’t crippled the industry, US would almost certainly have continued to make a profit, taken delivery on new AC and expanded routes. So, yes I see this as a successful carrier being the result of a successful merger of two weaker players in a fragmented industry. Combining the two pilot groups will make the company even stronger and more competitive which will produce more job opportunities in good economic times. With sustained profitability comes better pay and profit sharing. I certainly don’t play the doom and gloom game when there is every reason for an optimistic outlook.

 

[nycbusdriver]

And you, Hate, EastUS, etc haven't gone "a little overboard"?

Jim

I feel neglected. Or am I simply relegated to an "etc."

 

[Phoenix]

"The East pilots are no different than the thug......" Jim, this is a little overboard. I think you owe us an apology.

Please quit interrupting him while he is talking. He is a hoot.

 

[Tiger 1050]

Southwest will probably continue to expand incrementally there, though.

You can keep hoping for that white knight, but he ain't coming...

GF
DAL

Yes. Our situation is akin to the building burning down around us and yet we argue about who gets out first....

 

[HPearlyretiree]

Yes , and we would still be more valuable.

Yeah, but as scrap and as Wal-Mart greeters.

 

[HPearlyretiree]

Caddy,


I know you are hoping so......you wouldn't even have a name. How about AIRizona...kinda catchy.


Inverted

Great, and we can call your airline "Entitlement Airwhine"

 

[AWE Dog]

Yeah, but as scrap and as Wal-Mart greeters.

If this outfit goes broke, I get my PGBC money. What do you guy's get? Oh I see, thats the Wal-Mart greeter part.

 

[Black Swan]

In my estimation, the PHL hub is of little value to any major airline. Delta? We have New York. American? Continental? Ditto. United? They have Dulles, right down the road. The amount of O & D traffic that PHL would offer would not offset the redundancy of having two hubs so close together.

Southwest will probably continue to expand incrementally there, though.

You can keep hoping for that white knight, but he ain't coming...

GF
DAL

GF- I live in PHL. Believe me, NOBODY drives to Dulles or JFK to fly. The only one I hear anyone doing is Newark, and only if it is really a deal. If anyone would be stupid enough to dump PHL, they would be making a huge financial blunder. There are a lot of companies here. Believe me, Dulles is not right down the road, that is a 3+45 drive or more with traffic.