US ALPA/USAPA/West Thread for week of 3/22-29

[end_of_alpa]

Started off that sentence with lies and on easter at that! You are nothing if you are not singularly focused and you have displayed that since these threads began!! You are a fool of you can't see what's next. No matter what neither union wil ever be able to put our groups together EVER!! Parker and company know this thus golden parachutes. Oil will hit $150 by summer then the furloughs starts. Next up a/c orders cancelled then the selling of routes. No one in this industry will ever merge with USAir again the east employees are too damn difficult to deal with and why would you when you can get routes and gates without the hassle of the employees. Yup USAir is almost done and good riddance if you ask me...

Lions and Tigers and Bears (96).......

OH MY!

(Latest from the Peanut Gallery....update @ 11)

 

[Leonidas]

Like I said, singularly focused. So what then? You will still have a union representing all pilots. The services should be a seamless transaction. Just hope the west guys are members to take advantage of them.

I am not singularly focused. As far as I'm concerned, we'll let the seniority list play itself out as one issue. The rest are being solved or is solved.

What is your point then? Why the "Single promise" statement/question? More FUD?

Are you kidding me, usapa is all about the Nic., and everyone here knows it, why are you playing stupid?

 

[elixir]

I'll say this much....in my 19 years of carying an ALPA card, I have NEVER...EVER been solicited as much as I have in the last 2 weeks from ALPA. For ANY reason whatsoever.

My dues have all been paid, my message conveyed...my interests...COMPLETELY IGNORED.

Know why?

Because where "my interests' fall may be or are in direct contrast to the interests of a "brother" in ALPA...

Somebody's gonna lose...and lose big...but in your loss, you must recall that we are "ONE...IN UNITY"

It is just as impossible as the critics of USAPA are spouting off about....the "no win" ...if you will.


ALPA is the epitome of the NO WIN SCNARIO...by it's very nature.

Without a global seniority system in place, ALPA carriers' are at adds with each other...EVERY DAY...even as they sing the solidarity song.

And in that, there can be no dispute.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Started off that sentence with lies and on easter at that! You are nothing if you are not singularly focused and you have displayed that since these threads began!! You are a fool of you can't see what's next. No matter what neither union wil ever be able to put our groups together EVER!! Parker and company know this thus golden parachutes. Oil will hit $150 by summer then the furloughs starts. Next up a/c orders cancelled then the selling of routes. No one in this industry will ever merge with USAir again the east employees are too damn difficult to deal with and why would you when you can get routes and gates without the hassle of the employees. Yup USAir is almost done and good riddance if you ask me...

The FUD leader speaks. I am focused on seeing USAPA win. Is that singular? In your eyes I guess so. BTW. I know what's coming next. April 17th at 2:01 p.m. USAPA will become the bargaining agent for all USAirways pilots. East and West.

You and I have had many conversations and I have not wavered about USAPA. Or the reasons why I want to see ALPA removed from the property. As much as you would like to believe that USAPA is all about the Nicolau award, for some of us it is more than that. As you have reminded us over and over that we're only a small number of pilots that is behind the decert effort, the reality is there are a majority of us who want to see USAPA succeed. To do that we have to build an infrastructure. It would be nice to have volunteers from the west step up. Personally I really don't care one way or the other. There are many capable volunteers already in the trenches working to see that we will succeed. And these volunteers are not the interim leaders either. Like minded people working solely to guarantee our success and never see ALPA here again. To do that we must represent all pilots. Like Ripley's "Believe it or Not".

I know you don't believe it and that's too bad. There are really some good people starting up this union in the background. The ones you don't see. Those who feel like me, no matter what happens to the Nic award, so long as ALPA is gone. Sometimes I think that is why I have a problem defending USAPA over the award. Would I like to see Nic gone or modified? Sure. Is it the sole reason for my support? No.

You might be right about future mergers. But then again if Doug is the one buying, it might not matter what the takeover target thinks. As far as oil at $150? What a crock. It's all relative. I remember seeing business plans that said $50 oil would put us out of business. OH well. Speculation is real fun, but absolutely meaningless.

 

[ChuckBewFarley]

Here's the letter on the Phoenix visit-

Didn't want debate, wanted Q & A.

Just curious, you guys don't like the FPL gig yet you asked for it to do road shows. I thought this was all about pilots and being inclusive.
Seems you were 'to tired' but I bet Mr. $500 an hour said don't miss it. Love the 'we haven't decided but the almighty USAPA congress hasn't met yet, but we know all about DOH.'



I hope you will understand, we are not interested in a debate. It has nothing to do with being unwilling to discuss the issues, or being afraid - I’ve already gone toe-to-toe with Prater. Debates can quickly turn into sideshows and yelling matches, and I (we) simply do not have time, plus it would waste the time of those attending who want to ask us questions directly. Those who want the ALPA take can simply call our buddy Bill Pollock, who tried to sell out the B-scalers, then gave away our pension without letting us vote, and now has the moxie to call himself a “concerned” pilot. I will take all the time necessary to talk directly with anyone, and/or answer emails. The fastest way to inform the pilots is to respond to their questions, not respond to a fellow debater using canned answers.



ALPA has had over two years to do something for this combined pilot group, and has done nothing except make things worse. Most reasonable pilots would agree with Benjamin Franklin who said, “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.” For ALPA to now say they are the answer to anything is disingenuous. I have nothing to say to an ALPA representative at this point except, “thanks for nothing, goodbye.”



You have re-incentivized us with regard to coming out West. We’re all so damn tired, and have so little time, and weren’t sure anyone really wanted to hear what we had to say, that when we were turned down by the Company for trip drops we figured we may as well give it up. We are investigating your idea of a web cast, and may try to do something with our upcoming CLT Road Show if we can get it setup quickly enough. Also, we are going to TRY, and I do mean try, to come out to PHX either the 18th or 19th. It will have to be a very informal question and answer session, as I don’t believe we will be able to do the advance work necessary for a true Road Show. If we can combine our visit with some sort of online presence for those unable to come, that might be even better. If we can make it in any fashion, it will be better than nothing.



Thanks again for at least listening, it sure was better than the anonymous, expletive-filled voicemail I received an hour later.



Regards,

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Are you kidding me, usapa is all about the Nic., and everyone here knows it, why are you playing stupid?

I'm not as you say "Playing stupid". And no I'm not kidding you. There are many of us on the east working very hard to see USAPA succeed. And yes we will represent our membership to the best of our abilities. While you want to be singularly focused on USAPA and the Nic award, many of us just want to see ALPA gone. Do I want to see Nic gone or modified? Yes. Is it my overriding reason for supporting USAPA? No.

So I'll say again for the umpteenth time. "Just so long as ALPA is gone". You can't make it any more plain than that.

 

[deltawatch]

20 years ago I remember a pilot telling me that ALPA was "50,000 miles wide and a 1/2 inch thick".

Was speaking with an AA pilot the other day and he said that they were very happy with no ALPA on the property.

 

[ChuckBewFarley]

The boys just got a new girl friend-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ITQxwucQ-0

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Oh well I wonder who you will blame when these einsteins can't deliver on a single promise?

You made this statement and or question. I asked why and you didn't respond. Maybe you missed my question then. I have shown we are capable of delivering on many promises and your response was about DOH. Ok. Then you keep reminding me of Nic, USAPA ad nauseum. Once again I ask "What is your point?" The effort to spread more FUD? In case it hasn't dawned on you, the time for spreading it has long since passed.

 

[ChuckBewFarley]

You made this statement and or question. I asked why and you didn't respond. Maybe you missed my question then. I have shown we are capable of delivering on many promises and your response was about DOH. Ok. Then you keep reminding me of Nic, USAPA ad nauseum. Once again I ask "What is your point?" The effort to spread more FUD? In case it hasn't dawned on you, the time for spreading it has long since passed.

Much like the FUD you spread in Phoenix.

The only plan you have is DOH.

Not one plan on pay, hours of service, etc.

But we know about DOH.

What's your point?

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Much like the FUD you spread in Phoenix.

The only plan you have is DOH.

Not one plan on pay, hours of service, etc.

But we know about DOH.

What's your point?

I wasn't in PHX. Volunteered to go but was told I was not needed.

Once again DOH. In case it hasn't dawned on you yet, that is one issue of a myriad of issues in building a union. Luckily each one is being solved by many capable people working in the background. So once again you are all singularly focused on DOH. The plan is to run a union at 2:01 p.m. on April 17th. If we win, we'll be ready as best we can, since as you say, only 2/3 will be dues paying members.

Hhmm. "Pay, hours of service, etc". I'll ask you a question then. Who does USAPA represent? As I said you have many capable people working in the background. Who are your volunteers from out west stepping forward to offer input on pay, hours of service, etc? So the plans cannot be finalized until the election, followed by the offer of input. One step at a time. Better yet, why don't you volunteer to work on the negotiating committee? I'm sure your input would be gladly accepted if USAPA wins the election.

My point? Go back and look at the question and answer posts from me. Maybe it will become clear to you.

 

[Did not Apply to USAir]

I keep thinking that there is something the West ALPA supporters would understand. It is hard to do when that person hasn't been around all that long, hasn't suffered the loses, nor seen the travisties that ALPA was a part of. Their time will come.
Even though you keep saying it is all about the Nic, your opinion does not make that statement true. Over and over many have tried to explain what inept, biased, and corrupt form ALPA has shown, but you have only one thought in your mind blocking all else. Please think and not just feel.

 

[Leonidas]

You made this statement and or question. I asked why and you didn't respond. Maybe you missed my question then. I have shown we are capable of delivering on many promises and your response was about DOH. Ok. Then you keep reminding me of Nic, USAPA ad nauseum. Once again I ask "What is your point?" The effort to spread more FUD? In case it hasn't dawned on you, the time for spreading it has long since passed.

Are you kidding me? you haven't represented a single pilot yet, you have not had a single test, you have absolutelly no plan should parker say "no". And when DOH doesn't go your way and you can't get the east boys raises worth a crap, you will implode just like the east mec did. Count on it.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

The only plan you have is DOH.

You don't have to believe me, but there are plans to run our union after the election. With many votes by the membership upcoming shortly after certification. If USAPA wins, we'll be ready from day one. It's up to you if you want to participate or not.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Are you kidding me? you haven't represented a single pilot yet, you have not had a single test, you have absolutelly no plan should parker say "no". And when DOH doesn't go your way and you can't get the east boys raises worth a crap, you will implode just like the east mec did. Count on it.

No I'm not kidding you AGAIN!. What don't you understand? We don't represent anyone yet. If USAPA wins, then great. We'll deal with it. With or without input from the west. Our test right now is to win the election. It's all moot if we lose.

Why is it that every west poster wants an answer yesterday for every conceivable problem they can possibly think of? Knowing full well there is not an answer until after the election. Luckily we are not putting the cart before the horse. Right now the leaders are concentrating on putting this union together and winning the election. Those in the background are formulating the nuts and bolts plans to run the union.

Once in place, there will be many upcoming votes to put the union in order and really begin to job of advancing only USAirways Pilots interests. So what if Parker says no, the first time. You want me to speculate on the response? I'll wait until after the election and come back here with a response as to what I will vote for.