TWU and IAM representation alliance vote

[Overspeed]

I look like my picture. Come find me.

 

[TWU informer]

I feel pretty confident with the current CBA scope that I will continue to be employed. The fact remains that for all the negative talk about TUL being closed and huge amounts of jobs to be lost it hasn't happened and doubt it ever will. On the job front I feel confident unless we do end up with no union as a result of stupid political infighting.
 
You know full well that going in to BK we were getting screwed. How did I save myself by voting yes? We all know work was getting outsourced, pension was done, and retiree medical was going to get hacked. The 1113c CBA was to mitigate, not stop job and benefit losses. I'm still fine with my vote and the yes one I cast back in 2010.
 
The Association is the best option out of all others that have been proposed.

 
I dont disagree that the BK laws were and still are stacked against workers.
 
But what about advocating concessions to prevent the BK only to give up more and it happen anyway? Why give concession to save jobs, when it is clear the workforce is being reduced through attrition even after the concession?
 
And the bigger question....
If the AFL-CIO is all they claim to be, then why weren't the BK laws changed after the first work group got the shaft?
 
My point is, when do you stop living in denial and the big lie, while supporting the failed experiment?

 

[dfw gen]

I look like my picture. Come find me.

spoken like a true twu loyalist.

 

[WNMECH]

 

 

 

[Bob Owens]

I look like my picture.

you wish.

 

[Overspeed]

Failed experiment? If you are saying to protect jobs then failure would be defined on whether or not you were the one losing the job. I can't think of any members at any airline who have not been shafted in BK.
 
I was heavily against the types of concessions we took in 2003 and still am. It took us down the wrong path for sure. Management mismanaged the breathing room that was given them and continued to make bad decisions.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

The fact remains that for all the negative talk about TUL being closed and huge amounts of jobs to be lost it hasn't happened and doubt it ever will

That is what the FSC's said about TULE as well. Funny how people can be so blind they can't see the obvious right in front of their face.
 
"They are not going to get rid of Fleet, the company is not going to pay a mechanic to do this work".

 

[bigjets]

Failed experiment? If you are saying to protect jobs then failure would be defined on whether or not you were the one losing the job. I can't think of any members at any airline who have not been shafted in BK.
 
I was heavily against the types of concessions we took in 2003 and still am. It took us down the wrong path for sure. Management mismanaged the breathing room that was given them and continued to make bad decisions.

Is a unions mission to protect jobs? Or is a unions mission to collectively negotiate for safe working environment and pay/ benefits?

Either case the TWU has failed, and OSHA has provided us with a safe working environment.

 

[swamt]

Bob that's true but if I understand correctly the 591 E Board is paying Seham's firm to either block or at least have a vote now. In another email I received the newsletter clearly states that no one from 591 is advocating for anything but telling people to write in any union. No union would only have to have more votes from whichever choice was the number two highest voted choice, not all those combined.
 
I guess my only hope is from the union that is taking a clear position on the Association, AMFA, and the IBT...the IAM. Their members at US clearly do not want anything to do with AMFA or the IBT and their leadership seems to do a better job of communicating the possible consequences of how each member votes. The Int'l has yet to show where it stands on this issue because most of the communication we get is from 591 which is saying it's bad. Is Lombardo for this or not? By not saying anything it seems more and more like he doesn't want it either.

So you are waiting for direction in order to post your actual thoughts???  WOW!!! Speaks volumes, you little puppet...

 

[swamt]

Failed experiment? If you are saying to protect jobs then failure would be defined on whether or not you were the one losing the job. I can't think of any members at any airline who have not been shafted in BK.
 
I was heavily against the types of concessions we took in 2003 and still am. It took us down the wrong path for sure. Management mismanaged the breathing room that was given them and continued to make bad decisions.

I rest my case.  You sir, are still a dumb a$$, please keep posting, LOL you just gotta LUV this stuff!!!

 

[Tim Nelson]

Failed experiment? If you are saying to protect jobs then failure would be defined on whether or not you were the one losing the job. I can't think of any members at any airline who have not been shafted in BK.
 
I was heavily against the types of concessions we took in 2003 and still am. It took us down the wrong path for sure. Management mismanaged the breathing room that was given them and continued to make bad decisions.

I think the late great Labor movement in  America was more focused on being baited by management to protect jobs without protecting the quality of those jobs.  Thank God Charlie Bryan didn't fall for that.  I don't bleed IAM but many of us owe the decent jobs that hung around in this industry in the 90's to that man.  Him drawing the line may have helped speed up the closure of Eastern Airlines but it preserved the industry at that time. Because of that, many old eastern mechanics were able to come on at US AIRWAYS, etc.   Since 2003, our unions in this industry have championed the art of protecting jobs at the cost of lowering the quality of job then having the corporations use this against us in future negotiations.  That strategy of 'protecting jobs' has actually resulted in the severe loss of jobs as well.  Because of that, I get pretty leary when a union boss opens up the floor by saying 'we are going to protect jobs'.   When I hear that, it's like hearing management say "I come in peace". 
In America we say, "Give management an inch...and it takes a marathon."
 
I want it back.....back the way it was.  I don't want to see my union boss walking the floor with management.  I don't want to read updates that give management any credit.  Put it back the way it was.  It's ok to say "Eff management",  it's ok to say that we are going to take management on.  I'd rather my union boss STFU instead of saying "Well, management can prolly do this, "   or  "The reality is that we prolly can't strike".  Listen, with a mass of people, a group can do any damn thing they want, it may not be legal, but don't tell me that we can't do this or can't do that.  Management breaks the damn contracts all the time but instead of management saying "we can't do that", they say "Grieve it".
 
No, it's not just about protecting jobs when the cost of doing so is to recreate the job into some crap level wage/benefit.   Any job protection or concessions must be met with snapbacks plus some form of interest.
I fully realize that's not where the American Labor Movement is but it's in large part because the younger generations were raised with a silver spoon and played soccer on Sundays, or played video games, and don't know how to fight because Labor doesn't educate but, itself, sounds like management.  I think the young generation is eager to learn and fight.  Just really tough when management doesn't give briefings anymore because the union reps give them.  Who feels like labor has its back? It's really hard to see where union begins and management ends.  You first!

 

[Overspeed]

True it is not just about protecting jobs, it is about the whole CBA. There is not one contract out there that provides the most in-house jobs and best pay. WN has taken the angle of bringing in a small amount of overhaul work but provides their union employees (for now but negotiations are dragging on for years now) while they have grown. DL, UA, and AS have dropped huge amounts of jobs in the overhaul sector through layoffs and massive outsourcing. DL is investing in Aeromexico MRO to continue keeping their AO outside.
 
Today's labor movement is much like you say not willing to do the heavy lifting required and expects that paying union dues is where their involvement ends. Changing unions to AMFA will not solve the problem. Leadership will and since we lack that from the local level on up I am resigned to recognizing what is the best option at this time. The Association can work but when we have all the political infighting we have within the TWU (locals filing DFR lawsuits, forming their own unions, and leaders with their only strategy being to blame everyone else) I expect to see chaos reign.

 

[FWAAA]

True it is not just about protecting jobs, it is about the whole CBA. There is not one contract out there that provides the most in-house jobs and best pay. WN has taken the angle of bringing in a small amount of overhaul work but provides their union employees (for now but negotiations are dragging on for years now) while they have grown. DL, UA, and AS have dropped huge amounts of jobs in the overhaul sector through layoffs and massive outsourcing. DL is investing in Aeromexico MRO to continue keeping their AO outside.
 
Today's labor movement is much like you say not willing to do the heavy lifting required and expects that paying union dues is where their involvement ends. Changing unions to AMFA will not solve the problem. Leadership will and since we lack that from the local level on up I am resigned to recognizing what is the best option at this time. The Association can work but when we have all the political infighting we have within the TWU (locals filing DFR lawsuits, forming their own unions, and leaders with their only strategy being to blame everyone else) I expect to see chaos reign.

Let me translate your post:

Keep working for the industry's lowest wages to preserve all those wonderful outstanding what few remaining AA jobs exist in Tulsa.  
 
Vote for the TWU/IAM Alliance so that management can outsource all it wants (reducing jobs) while paying the line AMTs industry-lagging wages (in places like NYC, BOS, PHL, MIA, SFO, LAX and other expensive cities).
 
If anyone buys that bullshit they deserve what they get.   

 

[Rogallo]

You can't fix stupid!

 

[bigjets]

True it is not just about protecting jobs, it is about the whole CBA. There is not one contract out there that provides the most in-house jobs and best pay. WN has taken the angle of bringing in a small amount of overhaul work but provides their union employees (for now but negotiations are dragging on for years now) while they have grown. DL, UA, and AS have dropped huge amounts of jobs in the overhaul sector through layoffs and massive outsourcing. DL is investing in Aeromexico MRO to continue keeping their AO outside.
 
Today's labor movement is much like you say not willing to do the heavy lifting required and expects that paying union dues is where their involvement ends. Changing unions to AMFA will not solve the problem. Leadership will and since we lack that from the local level on up I am resigned to recognizing what is the best option at this time. The Association can work but when we have all the political infighting we have within the TWU (locals filing DFR lawsuits, forming their own unions, and leaders with their only strategy being to blame everyone else) I expect to see chaos reign.

The TWU has helped kill the labour movement by excepting anything in order to say we saved tule, but in actuality the TWU has brought down everybody's pay. Outsourcing work to china or Central America has nothing to do with unions (as all union and non union shops have suffered from out sourcing ) but has everything to do with globalization.

Look at the troubleshooting chart, MCI and AFW both with excellent experienced mechs both stations closed and work outsourced. Both represented by the TWU, the only thing the TWU accomplished was to collect dues and take credit for an AA accountant idea that it would be cost effective to do 737 OH in TULE.

The TWU did manage to have the worst CBA for the past 11 years and take credit for getting us a pay raise in September 2015 off the non union delta mechs pay scale.