Tulsa Union Leaders in the News

[Overspeed]

4X

HA! That's funny. No I don't eat at Whataburger and drink tons of beer. I eat well and exercise so that should narrow it down to who I am at DFW.

 

[Overspeed]

The TWU has groomed me to think about "me" only! There is no unionism at AA, and the company knows it. They have employees getting paid to monitor this forum, and all they see is so-called "union brothers" at each others throats.

You can believe what you want, but the majority spoke loud and clear. Let AA do whatever it takes to right this ship, and I certainly have my doubts, but the majority decided that WE will not voluntarily give them one more dime. They will have to steal it through the courts. I can't wait to see if AA really follows through with rejection.

I hate to tell you but the margin between yes and no closed significantly this last vote and that was for a crappy deal. When the judge indicates that he is leaning towards abrogation what do you think the vote will be on the next deal? You are right, you won't be giving back a dime, they will be taking a dollar instead.

 

[strikeforce]

Disagree big time. Between dysfunctional management, break room politics obsessed Locals, and refuse to work AMTs we became one of the most unproductive AMTs in the industry. Ask a Southwest guy how many AMTs they have working the terminal per departure, or how many AMTs does it take to do an ETOPS at UA/CO, or how many AMTs does it take to tow an aircraft at any of the other airlines? It will be a lot less than what we use. Face it, we are our own worst enemy. You have Locals arguing with the company that it takes a boat load of guys to do the work that used to take the old timers when I showed up less than half the guys it does now.

I agree with not recalling guys all those years. We should have been getting leaner and asking for more money for the productivity but instead people like Owens, Pike, and Ruiz said no. No we will not work harder unless you pay us more and by the way, we need more recalls. They all pulled the plug on going for efficiency and slowing down recalls. They told people to refuse OT so that it would force the company to recall AMTs. These guys are the ones who are arguing you should vote no because they are so good at getting what they want. Unfortunately that is working to lowest level and asking to be paid more and that is a losing argument.

Dysfunctional management, YES!

Who allowed the mechanics to be lazy and un-productive?
Who determines the manpower for Etops, terminal & towing?

I guess it's the mechanics fault, right?

If you owned the company, what would you do?

 

[Overspeed]

Dysfunctional management, YES!

Who allowed the mechanics to be lazy and un-productive?
Who determines the manpower for Etops, terminal & towing?

I guess it's the mechanics fault, right?

If you owned the company, what would you do?

It was a joint effort.

 

[xUT]

The other airlines didn't rape their employees for 9 years before they filed for BK.

That's not entirely accurate. UAL employees took pay & benefit cuts to buy 55% of UAL through the ESOP.
We received stock in our 401K that we could not sell until we left the company.
During the ESOP years, Executives & BOD received bonuses, Management changed some names and classifications that bumped their pay and UAL made pretty good profits.
When IAM & ALPA 'the owners' asked for a bump, well sorry you have a contract. Sweet Huh?
At the end of the ESOP period, we all expected industry leading contracts (that were promised as condition of the ESOP).
Low and behold, industry leading contracts were off the table.
B) xUT

 

[strikeforce]

I hate to tell you but the margin between yes and no closed significantly this last vote and that was for a crappy deal. When the judge indicates that he is leaning towards abrogation what do you think the vote will be on the next deal? You are right, you won't be giving back a dime, they will be taking a dollar instead.

Even with Local 514 video's, Tulsa chamber of commerce, senators, Overspeed, state of oklahoma, and all the other YES vote campaigners.....the mechanics in Tulsa were able to see through the BS and supported the NO VOTE campaign. Kudos to those guys!

The BK judge is bought and paid for by American Airlines. The judge will rubber stamp whatever AA wants......who cares! AA has taken $200K thanks to the TWU.......In order for AA to emerge from BK a successful company, they will need the employee to take GOOD care of their customers. It's NOT going to happen with angry employees!

 

[Overspeed]

Even with Local 514 video's, Tulsa chamber of commerce, senators, Overspeed, state of oklahoma, and all the other YES vote campaigners.....the mechanics in Tulsa were able to see through the BS and supported the NO VOTE campaign. Kudos to those guys!

The BK judge is bought and paid for by American Airlines. The judge will rubber stamp whatever AA wants......who cares! AA has taken $200K thanks to the TWU.......In order for AA to emerge from BK a successful company, they will need the employee to take GOOD care of their customers. It's NOT going to happen with angry employees!

And the employees of DL, UA, CO, and US were happy when they went through BK? They are still around aren't they. I guess you can keep and grow and airline with angry employees huh?

The judge is paid off? Nice preemptive blaming before the eventual shafting. You are happy with your vote so you should be ecstatic with the outcome. Guess what no vote or yes vote we are getting screwed again. The point to the 4/26 deal was to mitigate some of the pain of the cuts.

 

[dfw gen]

overspeed these people are your idols!

 

[strikeforce]

And the employees of DL, UA, CO, and US were happy when they went through BK? They are still around aren't they. I guess you can keep and grow and airline with angry employees huh?

Look, we can argue until WE are blue in the face, but the fact is the employees of AA have now gone through two BK. One voluntarily, where WE witnessed greedy executives rewarding themselves while the ship was sinking, and now, where WE were about to take it in the shorts voluntarily again, and I can guarantee YOU, the next step in the BK process would have been, "in order to retain the best talent at AA, the company will have to compensate Tom Horton and his buffoons MILLIONS in bonuses"! Instead, the mechanics threw a wrench in AA's plans....and now, AA will have to go back to the table before they exit BK. It's up to AA on whether they want good or terrible relations with their employees.

 

[Duke787]

Disagree big time. Between dysfunctional management, break room politics obsessed Locals, and refuse to work AMTs we became one of the most unproductive AMTs in the industry. Ask a Southwest guy how many AMTs they have working the terminal per departure, or how many AMTs does it take to do an ETOPS at UA/CO, or how many AMTs does it take to tow an aircraft at any of the other airlines? It will be a lot less than what we use. Face it, we are our own worst enemy. You have Locals arguing with the company that it takes a boat load of guys to do the work that used to take the old timers when I showed up less than half the guys it does now.

I agree with not recalling guys all those years. We should have been getting leaner and asking for more money for the productivity but instead people like Owens, Pike, and Ruiz said no. No we will not work harder unless you pay us more and by the way, we need more recalls. They all pulled the plug on going for efficiency and slowing down recalls. They told people to refuse OT so that it would force the company to recall AMTs. These guys are the ones who are arguing you should vote no because they are so good at getting what they want. Unfortunately that is working to lowest level and asking to be paid more and that is a losing argument.

Management runs the operation, management decides the manning of each shift, the MEPS system decides the work load (what "consultant"came up with this dumb ass idea) management decides who gets hired, who passes probation, evaluates their mechs, and crew chiefs, at what point is management going to be held accountable for not running their operation efficiently. It use to be our airline, but the executives at AA clearly shows that it's their airline, and has just turned this into just a job rather then a career.


After 2003 when the TWU and management were working together I believe TULE made $500 million profit, I guess management didn't like being showed up by the mechanics on how to run a maintenance operation.

Taking from the employees and blaming the employees is not going to fix AA.

I hope Horton can make working at AA something to be proud of, instead of a place I go to for 8.5 hours

 

[lineguy43]

That's not entirely accurate. UAL employees took pay & benefit cuts to buy 55% of UAL through the ESOP.
We received stock in our 401K that we could not sell until we left the company.
During the ESOP years, Executives & BOD received bonuses, Management changed some names and classifications that bumped their pay and UAL made pretty good profits.
When IAM & ALPA 'the owners' asked for a bump, well sorry you have a contract. Sweet Huh?
At the end of the ESOP period, we all expected industry leading contracts (that were promised as condition of the ESOP).
Low and behold, industry leading contracts were off the table.
B) xUT

Man your story almost reads like a move from the NWA playbook. Except we took concessions for stock in 1993. Well the IAM took it in "preferred" stock at a put price of 45 dollars a share. Well after a 10 yr maturity period when we went to cash in that stock at the "put" price..NW found a corporate friendly judge in Delaware where NW was incorporated and basically said you don't have to pay that obligation.. So when NW came around asking for concessions after 9/11 AGAIN all the unions sucked hind tit and said "OK" except AMFA. When we after chewing on concessions in the middle to later 90's NW was doing very well exceptional I might even say..The IAM asked for those concessions back and the company basically said "you have a contract" Then the IAM in 1999 negotiated a new agreement and what they brought back was criminal considering how well NW was doing thats why the M&R threw them out and why we voted in AMFA, Then when NW came around asking us for concessions AMFA said "we have a contract" and we will see you in 2005. So thats when NW spent the next two years and millions of dollars in their efforts to bust AMFA. Did we lose?..Yes but what NW pulled then would never work now even the FAA is a different animal and would not tolerate the secret problems NW was having. If our original NW guys did not cross they would have not pulled it off. Today they do not have the thousands of guys in the wings wanting to cross add to that a different administration (we had Bush) who NW had in its pocket. A lot of things fell into place in that strike that made it successful for NW I would have never believed it if I hadnt seen it with my own eyes but in reality that was a rare thing and a personal one when it came to the battle between AMFA and NW. AA even if it had a relationship as toxic as ours was between M@R and them would be very hard pressed to pull off what NW did in 2005. But with the TWU you won't have to worry that will never happen they will continue to suck up more concessions..I like to save jobs as much as anyone but I see where this is going they are going to get you to vote wages down even further in the promise of "saving jobs" what will really happen is you will for a short time then they will go the way every other airline has gone to and that is farming out virtually all O/H and keep line mx. Difference will be that you will have already established a 'new' bottom of the barrel wage and benefit package that will certainly not help AMT's in the industry. We at NW fell on the sword and a lot of us actually did quite well I know I did but a lot of us did not as well. I know people are going to say it is easy for me to say this but I would have said it no matter what...Better to fight and die standing then live on your knees....

 

[TWU informer]

Thinking only about you I see. You don't see the whole picture because you only care about yourself.

You want to talk about rape? Switch places with the guys at UAL. No pension, half of their workforce were dropped off payroll with no severance, retirees lost their medical insurance, if your job was outsourced you lost all your weeks of vacation, and millions in executive bonuses paid to NOT leave the company. The story is the same at US, NW, and DL. You talk like you are the only one to get screwed in the airline industry. Wake up. We are in well travelled territory and history is about to repeat itself.

Like it or not, the craft was knocked on its ass in 2003 with all the BKs and outsourcing. We are now going to join them 9 year later.

Whoop, There It Is !

The infamous "you don't see the big picture" ... brother

Every Yes Voting Union Leader said "Do what is best for YOU and YOUR family"
And now here you are accusing someone of not seeing the picture because they do just that.
My My My, what a tangled web we weave.

How is that AFL-CIO done since 2003 at changing otusource laws and bankruptcy laws so the craft stops getting its ass kicked? Oh that's right, the AFL-CIO was too busy trying to get more dues payers via card check elections and let us take the shaft.

TWU and AFL-CIO are one of the same....more interested in collecting union dues than saving the craft.